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RE: Is America the greatest country
December 14, 2015 at 10:17 am
(This post was last modified: December 14, 2015 at 10:23 am by Catholic_Lady.)
(December 14, 2015 at 12:41 am)Homeless Nutter Wrote: (December 13, 2015 at 11:10 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Please show me Church doctrine stating that gay people deserve to be in Hell.
1. Do people who commit a mortal sin not deserve hell, if not having repented? If not then once more - why would god allow them to end up there?
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/_P6C.HTM
Quote:1861 Mortal sin is a radical possibility of human freedom, as is love itself. It results in the loss of charity and the privation of sanctifying grace, that is, of the state of grace. If it is not redeemed by repentance and God's forgiveness, it causes exclusion from Christ's kingdom and the eternal death of hell, for our freedom has the power to make choices for ever, with no turning back.
2. Is adultery - sex outside of marriage - not a mortal sin?
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/ar...s1c1a8.htm
Quote:1857 For a sin to be mortal, three conditions must together be met: "Mortal sin is sin whose object is grave matter and which is also committed with full knowledge and deliberate consent."131
1858 Grave matter is specified by the Ten Commandments, corresponding to the answer of Jesus to the rich young man: "Do not kill, Do not commit adultery[...]
3. Does catholic church permit same sex marriage?
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/ar...s2c2a6.htm
Quote:Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.
Therefore:
4. What do YOU think is supposed to happen to all those gay people committing adultery, because they're not allowed to marry? What fate do they deserve? Is it a four-letter word, beginning with "H"?
This shows how little you understand, HN. Furthermore, I already addressed this very thing with Vic earlier on in this same thread.
A sin can be of grave matter, but it's the person's culpability that makes that grave matter a mortal sin or not. There are many many reasons why culpability can be lessened (it's really about what is in the person's heart), and the rule is that we are not to assume someone's culpability leads their action to become a mortal sin. Since we cannot see inside a person's heart, we have no idea what their culpability is, and we shouldn't speculate/judge upon another person's culpability. And if we do, we need to assume the best of them.
And the very thing you posted clearly states that there are three conditions for a sin to be a mortal sin... you conveniently only listed one of them (being of grave matter). The other 2 are all about the person's heart and mind and their level of culpability, which, as I said, is impossible for any of us to know.
So no, nothing in Church teaching says gays deserve to go to Hell, and nothing I have said is contrary to Church doctrine.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
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RE: Is America the greatest country
December 14, 2015 at 10:19 am
What is a sin and how do you know it exists?
(August 21, 2017 at 11:31 pm)KevinM1 Wrote: "I'm not a troll"
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RE: Is America the greatest country
December 14, 2015 at 10:20 am
(December 10, 2015 at 2:26 pm)FreeTony Wrote: Would Americans really be annoyed if a political candidate said that America isn't the greatest country?
I don't think my country is the best, though it's a pretty good place to live
Sadly, yes.
(August 21, 2017 at 11:31 pm)KevinM1 Wrote: "I'm not a troll"
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RE: Is America the greatest country
December 14, 2015 at 10:31 am
I'm just wondering how this turned into an ask a catholic thread 
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RE: Is America the greatest country
December 14, 2015 at 10:32 am
I have no idea. I just got here.
(August 21, 2017 at 11:31 pm)KevinM1 Wrote: "I'm not a troll"
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RE: Is America the greatest country
December 14, 2015 at 10:49 am
(December 14, 2015 at 10:31 am)Vic Wrote: I'm just wondering how this turned into an ask a catholic thread
Yeah, me too.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
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RE: Is America the greatest country
December 14, 2015 at 10:51 am
(This post was last modified: December 14, 2015 at 11:05 am by Catholic_Lady.)
(December 14, 2015 at 10:31 am)Vic Wrote: I'm just wondering how this turned into an ask a catholic thread
What happened was I told someone off for saying they wish gun owners would all get killed, and then started getting questioned about my faith. And then not only questioned, but being told what I believe. 
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
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RE: Is America the greatest country
December 14, 2015 at 10:53 am
Fun owners?
(August 21, 2017 at 11:31 pm)KevinM1 Wrote: "I'm not a troll"
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RE: Is America the greatest country
December 14, 2015 at 10:54 am
(December 14, 2015 at 10:53 am)Losty Wrote: Fun owners?
Didn't specify. The person just said he wishes guns didn't have a safety feature so that people who had them would accidentally shoot and kill themselves. I said something along the lines of this being a horrible thing to say, and got accused of being Catholic lol.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
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RE: Is America the greatest country
December 14, 2015 at 10:59 am
(December 14, 2015 at 10:54 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: (December 14, 2015 at 10:53 am)Losty Wrote: Fun owners?
Didn't specify. The person just said he wishes guns didn't have a safety feature so that people who had them would accidentally shoot and kill themselves. I said something along the lines of this being a horrible thing to say, and got accused of being Catholic lol.
Do you plead guilty in exchange for a lower penalty?
A Christian told me: if you were saved you cant lose your salvation. you're sealed with the Holy Ghost
I replied: Can I refuse? Because I find the entire concept of vicarious blood sacrifice atonement to be morally abhorrent, the concept of holding flawed creatures permanently accountable for social misbehaviors and thought crimes to be morally abhorrent, and the concept of calling something "free" when it comes with the strings of subjugation and obedience perhaps the most morally abhorrent of all... and that's without even going into the history of justifying genocide, slavery, rape, misogyny, religious intolerance, and suppression of free speech which has been attributed by your own scriptures to your deity. I want a refund. I would burn happily rather than serve the monster you profess to love.
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