I just don't get it

[Old Baby]

Lek, do you have anything better to offer than "I know God is real because God told me so"?

Do you think everyone here should immediately convert to Christianity because you think God talked to you?

If I told you that God personally revealed to me that Islam was the true religion, would you take me seriously?

I'm not sure what you are trying to accomplish.

Actually, the only way anyone becomes a true christian is if God speaks to them.  And I not specifically talking about hearing words, but rather communicating.  I'm just telling you how it is, which is also what the bible says.  I'd like to see everyone convert, but we all must receive it from God or it won't happen; and I can't make that happen.

I believe Islam is a step toward finding God.  We're all somewhere in the process.  I think God has made muslims aware of his existence; or rather those who have truly opened themselves to him.  The same goes for anyone who truly wants to know him.  That's not saying that Islam is the true faith, but that they have knowledge of God.  They know he exists.

Again, what are you trying to accomplish?

If people only believe after God speaks to them, what is the point of your being here and arguing for his existence?  Seems to be a self-defeating effort.

When you heard God speaking to you, did he say "Christianity is the real religion. The bible is the true book." Curious what he said that made you certain of these things and confident that Islam is just a stepping stone toward the purity of your beliefs.

[Lek]

Again, what are you trying to accomplish?

If people only believe after God speaks to them, what is the point of your being here and arguing for his existence?  Seems to be a self-defeating effort.

When you heard God speaking to you, did he say "Christianity is the real religion.  The bible is the true book."   Curious what he said that made you certain of these things and confident that Islam is just a stepping stone toward the purity of your beliefs.

God speaks to me in different ways.  One way is through the scriptures, which are God's words  to mankind.  That's the most common way he speaks to me.  He also speaks to me through nature, which speaks of a creator.  Third, at times I'll go to bed ready to dump my faith, and in the morning after no further thought or consideration, I'll wake up gung ho for God.  I guess I'd call it making me aware of things and keeping me on the right track.  

Matthew 7:7English Standard Version (ESV)
7 “Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.

According to the above verse, it's my belief that those who truly seek him will find him.  Discovering and believing in God is the result of seeking him.  A person who believes in God, realizes he is a sinner and gives his life to God, in my opinion, is a follower of Christ even if he has never heard of him.  God reveals himself to us to the degree he chooses and our lives are a journey toward becoming closer to him and knowing him better.  I don't picture a loving God as dinging someone for something of which he has not had the opportunity to know.  That's not the same as knowing of him and then purposely rejecting him.  Rather he looks at the person's heart and desires.  I know my life has been a journey toward Christ, not a sudden burst of faith and knowledge.

[Angrboda]

"Here, Sinner. Let me introduce you to my talking book."

[God of Mr. Hanky]

This might have been discussed before, but I'm really unable to understand it.

Today I've been discussing atheism with my friends (Muslims) and believe me, they're quite intelligent. At any rate, after I gave them plenty of strong arguments and cornered them, all they could say was " I believe deep down that there is a god".

Now this got me thinking (which is strange now that I think about it, since I've listened to this argument countless of times before and this has been discussed very often on these forums)

What kind of process that led me to become an atheist, that for some reason did not occur to them? I'm not a special snowflake for pit sakes.

I think intelligence is not the issue here, I know I can't convince you guys, but these friends of mine are really scientifically versed. Richard Dawkins, and many others, often said that these people are stuck in some kind of "child stage". 

I think it has to do with their "character", but I am very hesitant to say that, since I wouldn't consider myself to be a courageous person. In fact, I've had atheist friends who were particularly shy and introvert.

So what gives?

Religious ideas do have a profound stunting effect on people's intellectual development, where those beliefs conflict with reality. Also, it is rightly a question of character when they pile on lie upon lie to defend an original lie when reality gives them a contest on it.

[Whateverist]

Majority? The vast majority of people I know (and have ever known) are Christian. The only one I have ever known to admit to hearing voices was my schizophrenic uncle (I'm absolutely sincere here). None of us, believers or not, attributed his condition to religion. You wear as a badge of honor what I watched someone desperately try to overcome his entire adult life. My uncle was legitimately nuts; doesn't say much for you.

I didn't say I heard "voices".  In fact I said I didn't hear any words.  I said that God has spoken to me, the same as he has to countless others.  You can't have a "personal" relationship with Christ if he doesn't speak to you.

Did it ever occur to you that this presence of god is right there in your skull with you?  You don't know how your brain/mind gives rise to what you to take to be your 'self'.  How do you know it isn't also giving rise to what you experience as 'god'?  Doesn't mean your brain/mind is tricking you.  The only error creeps in when you make empirical claims about the world 'out there' based on the what a tradition tells you the 'presence of god' means.  If you just stuck to what you experience directly and didn't make wild ass claims about an entity out there which creates everything there is and then hands out moral laws, no one would laugh at you.  But then xtians were never modest in their ambitions.

[robvalue]

If you have a personal relationship with Jesus, why doesn't he give you the same messages he tells other people who also claim the same thing? Is he really bad at communicating? Is he deliberately misleading some people? Or are the other people deluded, and don't have a relationship with him at all?

If you already believe you're receiving magical messages, then you'll assign significance to random events. The human brain is so obsessed with pattern spotting that it spots ones that aren't even there.

http://youtu.be/kLBDFe3mDtk

[Old Baby]

Again, what are you trying to accomplish?

If people only believe after God speaks to them, what is the point of your being here and arguing for his existence?  Seems to be a self-defeating effort.

When you heard God speaking to you, did he say "Christianity is the real religion.  The bible is the true book."   Curious what he said that made you certain of these things and confident that Islam is just a stepping stone toward the purity of your beliefs.

God speaks to me in different ways.  One way is through the scriptures, which are God's words  to mankind.  That's the most common way he speaks to me.  He also speaks to me through nature, which speaks of a creator.  Third, at times I'll go to bed ready to dump my faith, and in the morning after no further thought or consideration, I'll wake up gung ho for God.  I guess I'd call it making me aware of things and keeping me on the right track.  

Matthew 7:7English Standard Version (ESV)
7 “Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.

According to the above verse, it's my belief that those who truly seek him will find him.  Discovering and believing in God is the result of seeking him.  A person who believes in God, realizes he is a sinner and gives his life to God, in my opinion, is a follower of Christ even if he has never heard of him.  God reveals himself to us to the degree he chooses and our lives are a journey toward becoming closer to him and knowing him better.  I don't picture a loving God as dinging someone for something of which he has not had the opportunity to know.  That's not the same as knowing of him and then purposely rejecting him.  Rather he looks at the person's heart and desires.  I know my life has been a journey toward Christ, not a sudden burst of faith and knowledge.

You aren't addressing my questions.  You're like the Donald Trump of Christians.  I ask you direct questions and you blather for paragraphs about nothing.

[robvalue]

Still waiting on my questions above too.

Anyone claiming to have a "personal relationship with Jesus" is welcome to have a go.

I made a whole thread about this subject before, I'll link it for reference:

Personal relationships with deities

[Wyrd of Gawd]

Again, what are you trying to accomplish?

If people only believe after God speaks to them, what is the point of your being here and arguing for his existence?  Seems to be a self-defeating effort.

When you heard God speaking to you, did he say "Christianity is the real religion.  The bible is the true book."   Curious what he said that made you certain of these things and confident that Islam is just a stepping stone toward the purity of your beliefs.

God speaks to me in different ways.  One way is through the scriptures, which are God's words  to mankind.  That's the most common way he speaks to me.  He also speaks to me through nature, which speaks of a creator.  Third, at times I'll go to bed ready to dump my faith, and in the morning after no further thought or consideration, I'll wake up gung ho for God.  I guess I'd call it making me aware of things and keeping me on the right track.  

Matthew 7:7English Standard Version (ESV)
7 “Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.

According to the above verse, it's my belief that those who truly seek him will find him.  Discovering and believing in God is the result of seeking him.  A person who believes in God, realizes he is a sinner and gives his life to God, in my opinion, is a follower of Christ even if he has never heard of him.  God reveals himself to us to the degree he chooses and our lives are a journey toward becoming closer to him and knowing him better.  I don't picture a loving God as dinging someone for something of which he has not had the opportunity to know.  That's not the same as knowing of him and then purposely rejecting him.  Rather he looks at the person's heart and desires.  I know my life has been a journey toward Christ, not a sudden burst of faith and knowledge.

Did it do ancient people any good to go looking for God when he was paling around with the Israelites?

[robvalue]

Indoctrination followed by a search for validation/rationalization.