Orlando shooting/The non gun debate

[The Grand Nudger]

"Everyone" doesn't have access to assault rifles in the first place, so it hardly matters.

[Brian37]

I've lived in Orlando all my life, and I can't decide if I'm just numb or disaffected. I know what most of you would say, but after 9/11 I did feel the impact of those events. even the Oklahoma city bombing felt different. This happened less than 10 mins from my church and honestly it feels like another news story. I am not suprise at the reaction or scale of reaction from the surrounding communities and the well wishing across the world, but again it's what you kinda expect from a 'news story of this type and scale.

And, before the haters say that I was rooting for the shooter or I think those people got what they deserve, I don't. It is a really bad thing for any one to shoot up a crowd of people period.

I'm not the only one here who thinks this way. Most people I've spoken who live here, have a similar view, in that it was a terrible thing, but like me tend to see this as another news story. I've even asked others what it had been disney or one of the other parks, and the reaction does indeed change at the thought of little children being caught in the cross fire, but this is all very different. Maybe it is because of the speed and willingness the news and politicians are willing to use this event to cash in or spread their views. (Like how quickly the other orlando thread turned into a gun debate) Idk..

So Im posting this to see what you all honestly feel. is this just another news item tailor made for the up comming election or is there/should their be a 9-11 feel to this?

"The non gun debate" 

Nope sorry, but as empathetic as you'd like to thing you are. This is the problem with our species, and part of this is your refusal to see life as it is. There is no polite way to say it IS about religion and it IS about weapons.

Just today, I was at my mom's retirement home. Looks from the outside like a two level 5 star hotel. It has a drive through overhang like a fancy hotel, so people don't get wet in bad weather dropping their parents off. It also has a wide long covered porch, which where the overhang meets the building, is perfect for a small bird to build a nest.

Well my mom moved in there almost 6 years ago, and at the first year, some birds figured out a nook they could make underneath the porch. Perfect place to build a nest, no enemies to contend with. The same family of birds comes back every year to use the same spot. But, sometimes that gets disrupted.

This morning while outside, I was saying hi to the parents, but it just so happened at the same time they were trying to train their babies to fly. Not a good idea to wave at them. They dive bombed me. Why did they do that? Not because I had ill intent, but because that is what life does. 

The problem isn't your intent. With humans, it is bad logic. The bird has an excuse, you don't. You don't protect your claims because you are right, anymore that that bird assumed I was dangerous. It did so because that it didn't know better. Just like you have been sold the idea of a god existing so long, the thought of being wrong  is foreign to you. Just like that bird didn't know I wasn't out to hurt it.

You are not resisting us because you are right. You are resisting us because you've been sold a script so long the thought of being wrong scares you. Just like that parent bird went after me. It didn't know better. I hope you are smarter than a bird.

[Brian37]

And yes, guns have everything to do with it. Why do we rightfully talk about disarming Isis, but you ignore Roof, and the abortion clinic shooter who used weapons to defend Christianity?

[The Grand Nudger]

I think that "disarming" isis is a polite euphemism for killing them Brian....... 

[Brian37]

I think that "disarming" isis is a polite euphemism for killing them Brian....... 

No, more like "Lets not talk about weapons even though everyone talks about defending their faith". I agree with disarming Isis. But  love of guns in America with Christians is literally like peanut butter and jelly. I simply am objecting to the title of the OP because of the way those books were written. They are tribal. All teach the defense of the club. And the word "defend" implies a need to have something to "protect" yourself with. So when any Christian or Muslim or Jew tells me they are willing to die for what they believe in, I don't see how you can separate weapons out of that mix.

I DO  agree with killing ISIS, but not for the same reasons. I don't think combating their religious nutfucks should include ignoring our bad logic and our transgressions. To claim that Christianity or Jews are squeaky clean by proxy is a fucking joke. Our tribalism simply is better maintained and more civil, but never perfect.

[Brian37]

The difference between Islam's love of guns and weapons to defend their fictional god and Christians love of weapons is like a heroin addict. Islam is still stuck on the third world pure, while Christianity is trying to stay on it's methadone.

[Drich]

again moron THIS IMAM HAS NOT!!!!!!!!!!

There is a PSA on the radio stations now that has a nice sounding middle eastern girl telling us" Islam will NEVER be seduced by or side with Evil." However they do not say who in this situation 'evil' is.

So what do you expect them to say? Denounce their religion? When has a christian official ever done that? They're all non commital. In this case, one bishop, I quoted him earlier, said something on the lines of all religions being at fault here. Because of degrading homosexuals for a very long time. He's got my full respect for taking that responsibility and I would like to hear that from an Immam too.

I will never hear it from you, however, because you fully subscribe to homosexuality being a sin. Probably also the reason why you don't have a big problem with the pastors celebrating the act itself. Which is much worse than any Immam or other official not being outspoken about it being evil.

Going by all your posts over two years time, you don't shed too many tears over the victims either. So spare me the crocodile tears. You just want to put blame on the opposing field post number, which, as I said earlier, is pretty close to your own line of thought. Only the deities differ.

And it's probably not even a clear cut religious issue in this case. Surpressed homosexuality, mixed with a religious pretext is far more likely. This guy has been a regular at this bar for several years. And he had a gay dating app on his phone. Which he used, according to several witnesses, to hit on men.

[Wyrd of Gawd]

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OK, they do speak out, for the last time. And you don't apply the same standards to your fellow christians. You play the no true scotsman card whenever something is happening or - in the case of abyssmal ordained figures, actually celebrating the attack - you refuse to acknowledge their christianity or call them bad apples. And, by the way, to this day Brejvik claims to be a christian warrior. And to this day I'm waiting for christians to distance themselves from the attacks. They just distance themselves from the person and claim he didn't act in their name. A muslim official doing the same isn't good enough for you. Talking of double standards and stones in glass houses.

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again moron THIS IMAM HAS NOT!!!!!!!!!!

There is a PSA on the radio stations now that has a nice sounding middle eastern girl telling us" Islam will NEVER be seduced by or side with Evil." However they do not say who in this situation 'evil' is. They leave it to stupid white people to fill in that blank for themselves, and idiots like you assume you are on the same page with them, meaning the shooter is evil. but in truth according to their holy book Homosexuality is that evil.

There's supposed to be a lot of muslims in Afghanistan but just about all of the men are homosexuals.  Sex tops religion.  Of course they don't consider themselves to be homosexuals but they'll bang a boy before they will touch a woman.

[IATIA]

I could not say that about my neighbors. How can you speak for a whole country? Source?

[Wyrd of Gawd]

I could not say that about my neighbors.  How can you speak for a whole country?  Source?

Are your neighbors from Afghanistan?  If they are the guys are homosexuals.
Read and learn =

https://www.yahoo.com/news/taliban-honey...tml?ref=gs