Sexual desire seems to be a curse for men

[Belacqua]

I understand the feelings of frustration that a lack of success can bring, but I do not get the feelings of resentment and anger -- they are pathological.  Entitlement about what others are suppose to do for you is toxic.

Sad to say, I don't think it's unusual for extreme frustration to turn into resentment and anger. Those things are pathological, but every pathology has an etiology. 

This thread has got me thinking about Freud's classic Civilization and its Discontents. I know Freud is out of fashion these days, but this book is well worthwhile. Unlike more feel-good self-help books, Freud here acknowledges that there are contradictions built into the human condition, and we are just all going to end up frustrated. Some people manage better than others, but full satisfaction is not possible.

We are animals, and we run on desire. The desire is irrational and insatiable. It doesn't work to argue that we should stop desiring, and insulting people whose desire is extreme is not going to make the desire go away. 

At the same time, civilization is built on restraint. At exactly the same time that we are desiring animals, we are also social beings, and we can only live and thrive because we knuckle under to civilization's rules. In the same way that a civilized country will stop its rivers from flooding its towns, as much as possible, individuals are expected to dam up or divert their desires -- which fundamentally goes against what we are as animals. More optimistic people think we can somehow achieve a lasting control on these things, but I think Freud is right that the best we can do is manage what is, deep down, an insolvable contradiction. 

I don't think that saying "suck it up, loser" is going to help a guy who's struggling to manage. Demonstrating to him that we have no empathy, that it's all his fault, that we will cut him off from our sympathies if we disapprove, is surely a way to push him toward less civilizational restraint. People who are met with emotional violence give emotional violence in return. But the American tough-guy approach seems to offer nothing else. 

I remember once long ago going on at length about how upset I was about something. The person I was talking at listened patiently and in the end said of my feelings "that's understandable." It was the most moving thing I'd ever heard. 

I have no idea how to help people who are frustrated beyond reason by sexual desire. I do think we can say that they MUST control themselves, and not harm others or make harassing demands -- but at the same time we can acknowledge that human beings, who have bodies, are likely to have desires that go beyond what they can comfortably manage.

[Jehanne]

Just to be clear, Freud was an atheist who was in a loving marriage for over 50 years; he and his wife had 5 children.

[arewethereyet]

I understand the feelings of frustration that a lack of success can bring, but I do not get the feelings of resentment and anger -- they are pathological.  Entitlement about what others are suppose to do for you is toxic.

Sad to say, I don't think it's unusual for extreme frustration to turn into resentment and anger. Those things are pathological, but every pathology has an etiology. 

This thread has got me thinking about Freud's classic Civilization and its Discontents. I know Freud is out of fashion these days, but this book is well worthwhile. Unlike more feel-good self-help books, Freud here acknowledges that there are contradictions built into the human condition, and we are just all going to end up frustrated. Some people manage better than others, but full satisfaction is not possible.

We are animals, and we run on desire. The desire is irrational and insatiable. It doesn't work to argue that we should stop desiring, and insulting people whose desire is extreme is not going to make the desire go away. 

At the same time, civilization is built on restraint. At exactly the same time that we are desiring animals, we are also social beings, and we can only live and thrive because we knuckle under to civilization's rules. In the same way that a civilized country will stop its rivers from flooding its towns, as much as possible, individuals are expected to dam up or divert their desires -- which fundamentally goes against what we are as animals. More optimistic people think we can somehow achieve a lasting control on these things, but I think Freud is right that the best we can do is manage what is, deep down, an insolvable contradiction. 

I don't think that saying "suck it up, loser" is going to help a guy who's struggling to manage. Demonstrating to him that we have no empathy, that it's all his fault, that we will cut him off from our sympathies if we disapprove, is surely a way to push him toward less civilizational restraint. People who are met with emotional violence give emotional violence in return. But the American tough-guy approach seems to offer nothing else. 

I remember once long ago going on at length about how upset I was about something. The person I was talking at listened patiently and in the end said of my feelings "that's understandable." It was the most moving thing I'd ever heard. 

I have no idea how to help people who are frustrated beyond reason by sexual desire. I do think we can say that they MUST control themselves, and not harm others or make harassing demands -- but at the same time we can acknowledge that human beings, who have bodies, are likely to have desires that go beyond what they can comfortably manage.

Bold mine - 
What exactly does this mean?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I've passed up nookie because I wasn't sure what she wanted or would like. Ambiguous isn't my style.

[Uberpod]

If it cannot be comfortably managed, it still needs to be uncomfortably managed. We can extend empathy without enabling the directing of anger toward others.

Legalization of prostitution can be looked at and even state subsidized prostitution.

[Uberpod]

I've passed up nookie because I wasn't sure what she wanted or would like. Ambiguous isn't my style.

Pussy cat got your tongue? You could not just ask?

[Jehanne]

If it cannot be comfortably managed, it still needs to be uncomfortably managed. We can extend empathy without enabling the directing of anger toward others.

Legalization of prostitution can be looked at and even state subsidized prostitution.

Are folks just too embarrassed to mention the M-word, masturbation??

[Uberpod]

If it cannot be comfortably managed, it still needs to be uncomfortably managed.   We can extend empathy without enabling the directing of anger toward others.

Legalization of prostitution can be looked at and even state subsidized prostitution.

Are folks just too embarrassed to mention the M-word, masturbation??

Many of us are Jacking Off as we type our responses so we don't have any problem discussing and we have no need to use a hyphenated version of the word.   It comes in handy.   But, over time does not satisfy.

[Jehanne]

Are folks just too embarrassed to mention the M-word, masturbation??

Many of us are Jacking Off as we type our responses so we don't have any problem discussing and we have no need to use a hyphenated version of the word.   It comes in handy.   But, over time does not satisfy.

We do have an Area-69 subforum; some pics are allowed. Not sure about videos.

[Uberpod]

Many of us are Jacking Off as we type our responses so we don't have any problem discussing and we have no need to use a hyphenated version of the word.   It comes in handy.   But, over time does not satisfy.

We do have an Area-69 subforum; some pics are allowed.  Not sure about videos.

lol.  At first I thought you were joking and then I actually found the subforum. Mind blown.

Is it mainly a joke?