Russia and Ukraine

[Leonardo17]

You know what?

I have no problem if Ukraine targets Russian military assets on Russian soil.  It doesn't matter if those assets are Russian soldiers, mercenaries, military bases, or hardware.

Russia has been indescriminately  firing missiles into Ukrainian cities, kidnapping children and murdering civilians.

There has to be a price paid for that.

So long as they don't start targeting Russian civilians or civilian infrastructure, I say have at it.

Personally, I’m seriously worried about soldiers on both sides of the conflict too.
 
I found a good Article on the state on the Russian Army on the internet. I’m going to compare this with my own military service which is considered as “below average” among the armies of OECD countries.
 
https://www.yahoo.com/news/no-armour-no-...12999.html
 
First the Russian have lost (at least) some 200,000 troops. Bur only 40,000 of these are “killed” (forgive my poor English)
 
1) We had little or no salary (That’s how it works here except for those who become officials after having some university degree)
 
2) We had very good / well heated dormitories + places where we could wash ourselves (even though with some difficulty). Our food was very good + we were able to buy extra food from several places if we wanted to. + I kept my uniform clean by washing it (by hand) once a week. I was (had to be) clean shaved all the time. Hygiene was not a major concern (our superiors did not care that much), I had friends who were stinking because they were to lazy to get a bath But I washed myself on a daily basis all the time.
 
3) Our uniforms and boots were not of very high quality. But as someone who hikes and like nature oriented sports, I can say that our summer uniform was ok (But it was the early 2000’s and summers were not as hot as today) and our winter equipment was ok too. Still. In cold weather, our guard duty dropped from 2 hours to half an hour (with soldiers having to wake up every 4 hours or so at night). We had good medical care too. In fact, I had friends from poor neighborhoods who waited to be conscripted in order to have some medical interventions done on them.
 
4) We had good tents / sleeping bags and other equipment to be used in case of a military conflict / earthquake etc. I was a simple infantry soldier. Commando units were practicing with this kind of stuff. I know nothing of trench warfare. But I’m sure it must be very, very difficult for both sides. I has to be totally inhumane even for the Ukrainians. They must be getting used to it somehow.
 
5) I did purchase my own kits yes. But it was all made in Turkey and it was good quality. It was not very expensive. And poor people didn’t have to do that. I did it only so I could have a second uniform while my own uniform was drying or was being washed in some place.
 
6) There is no “Zombie warfare” in the army. That happens in the Russian Army or in “The walking dead”. None of my officials would even send a single one of us to die without aa very good reason.
 
7) I had Kurdish (South-Eastern Region of Turkey) who somehow managed to bring join into the barracks. I was one caught using something like that. I had to apologize sincerely and the only reason I wasn’t punished was my connections. I saw some “well placed” soldiers having some alcohol on new-year’s eve (not me). We could smoke cigarettes. Some people went to the bar when they were on permit. I did not do that because we had to be back at 17:00 (if I remember correctly) and being late for even 2 minute would create very serious problems. We were allowed to smoke cones but we had to hide it when an official was nearby (That’s the Turkish military culture).
 
8) Our morale was also quite low. Army (even in times of peace) is difficult even in times of peace. Still, it was nothing like the Russian Army being described in this article. That’s not how army works. Even in combat zones, we had (not me, people who were there) were dropped some food in a can that were very nutritive and healthy for the soldiers. I’ve never heard of anyone being forced to eat “bad” food or anything like that. Still our rations were a little small so had had to purchase some extra food ourselves (which was also not bad at all). In fact I haven’t heard of anything like that in any 20th century armies. (Who gives ox meat to it’s soldiers?)   
 
 
 
 
 
 

[Leonardo17]

The Russians could stop their bleeding with a simple decision.

"No one knows with certainty how many people have been killed and wounded in Iraq since the 2003 United States invasion. However, we know that between 280,771-315,190 have died from direct war related violence caused by the U.S., its allies, the Iraqi military and police, and opposition forces from the time of the invasion through March 2023. The violent deaths of Iraqi civilians have occurred through aerial bombing, shelling, gunshots, suicide attacks, and fires started by bombing. Many civilians have also been injured".

I don't justify Russia. But don't tell me that USA and its allies are noble side that likes diplomacy. 

There are no “noble sides” in these issues. But for me, Iraq as a nation ceased to exist when Saddam came to power in 1980. The people of Iraq and Afghanistan were already suffering before the American invasion. So does that justify US aggression? – A big No. But do I really care? – Again, No. These were countries that could not be in a worse shape than they already were. But still, yes, I think there could be, and can be for instance in the case of Bashar Al Assad, better approaches in gradually removing these dictators. That’s my point of view on that.

[Leonardo17]

I'm sorry that's a huge stretch from these communications

How would you describe such strong involvment in a political process of a foreign nation?

You're the ones who are trying to do that almost everywhere. Even Mrs. Marinne LePen is being financed by the Kremlin? 

[Leonardo17]

Simply involvement

Who gave USA rights to coordinate election process of foreign nation?

Where did you see that? 

See this is the typical populist approach. First they do something, than they say “You did this”. Who is the one who got involved in any nations election process? Putin did that.
 
Ex: The “Dictator for Life” the “Hail Caesar” here is openly collaborating with terror organizations like the Kurdistan Worker’s Party, The Hezbollah, with Vladimir Putin and increasingly with the IRI + even with ISIL in some instances yet his propaganda machine is spreading the news (based on AI engineered – Made in Russia fake videos) that the Main Opposition Party is working with the PKK (Eng. KWP).
 
This is a technique. “I not involved in anyone’s election process (Not even with Donald Trump’s election process) You are involved in somebody’s election process.”
 So Excuse me but Whaaaat? Huh? 

[The Architect Of Fate]

Collin Kaepernick too? You hate black men that kneel and don't think America is perfect? I thought you served in the military to protect free speech? (I'm not American, but you get my point).

I love Canada. I love America. Loyal to my country and our allies, but like President Obama said when he was running, there are dumb wars. I think that's what he said. Don't quote me on that

Last i checked Collin Kaepernick wasn't making excuses for a foreign despot by engaging in whataboutism, And no I don't for a millisecond you love either country I honestly don't think you love anything but yourself and to you, loyalty is merely a word and considering Obama has stated his full support for the war in Ukraine your use of his words ring hollow.

[Leonardo17]

I'm hard-pressed to find a law that says they aren't allowed to be involved at all.

USA goverment wanted people in Ukraine goverment that will be beneficial to their interests. And we are talking about the strong country bordering Russia. Thats so diplomatic and peace loving. Not provoking at all.          

Still: They sort of do not want to be a part of the Muscovite nation

[Leonardo17]

Whataboutism and Russia have been invading nations longer than America has existed. It's not like America invent invasions.

I am talking about post WW2 period. Creation of UN. The noble ideas behind it. It was all fake, from russians point of view, because West does what it wants. I am russian, born in EU. I can see the russian side of conflict.

Which Russians are you talking about? The fans of the singer Shaman or the ones who want get married with Turkish boys in order to be able to get a Turkish citizenship and permanently leave Russia? (and bring their familly out of Russia if they can)

This Book is available in E-Book format if you can't find it in a local library. Read it:

Idea for a Universal History with a Cosmopolitan Purpose by Immanuel Kant 

E-book at B&N

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

Whataboutism and Russia have been invading nations longer than America has existed. It's not like America invent invasions.

I am talking about post WW2 period. Creation of UN. The noble ideas behind it. It was all fake, from russians point of view, because West does what it wants. I am russian, born in EU. I can see the russian side of conflict.

We can all see the Russian side of the conflict. It boils down to, 'Gimme that, it's mine!!'

Boru

[Leonardo17]

They may be, but if so, it looks like their escape route goes through bakhmut - as wagner is pulling all of it's people in toward the city at present moment - according to ukraine.

Prigo isn't wrong about any of the shit he's complaining about, though I doubt he genuinely gives a shit...either.  The russian ministry of defense has clearly fucked the pooch on multiple levels and from the pov of a wagner merc, at least, it can't possibly matter why that happened, only that it did.

The main reason Prigozyn was crying was because the officer in charge of logistics, who was selling him stuff at knock down prices, was removed from his post a few months ago (and resigned the other day to take up a senior post in Wagner).

Looks like they've made up, Wagner and the RAF, because now they're "staying in the fight".  Probably Shoigu had Prigozyn over for dinner and casually mentioned that he was deploying new Chechen stopping battalions in the area behind Bakhmut and they were exceptionally well armed.

The only thing I understood from that event is that the Russian army (just like the West) is now terribly lacking munitions in this very WWI type of war.
 
+ I don’t think that guy is even normal. Again: Who yells insults at his own army the way he did? This is pure insanity

[Leonardo17]

I dislike USA hypocrisy. It likes to talk about democracy, freedom, international law. But at the same time as I quoted George Friedman here before, it acts as Empire.

True. But which one is the better of the worse?
 
The problem with you is that you don’t seem to realize that you are not a proletariat dictatorship anymore. You are not a project of Marxism that (at least it was thought so in the past) “has a better alternative for the world”. So who are you now? Who are you exactly?