British Non-Catholic Historian on Historical Longevity of the Roman Catholic Church.

[Rev. Rye]

So, I take it that the Jews and the Buddhists don’t count? They’ve been here since long before Jesus was born.

[Nishant Xavier]

Well, as for Judaism, Christianity came from Judaism, and retains the Jewish Scriptures going back to Abraham, who lived around 2000 B.C., and Adam, who might have lived 10-20,000 years ago according to some, and 100,000-200,000 years ago according to others, in its Bible Canon.

In the OT, obviously written before Christ's Birth, there are many Prophecies that the Messiah would come. We believe this Messiah is Jesus Christ, and that's why we retain the OT, and the Prophecies contained in it, like Isa 53, which teaches Christ's Passion 700 years before He came, i.e. in 700 B.C, Psa 110:1 by King David who lived in 1000 B.C., which Christ quoted to the Pharisees as proof of the Messiah's Divinity etc. So, basically - and not going into that in detail here - but, the point is there is historical continuity even before the Incarnation of Jesus Christ 2000 years ago.

And, regarding Christ's coming, the point is it started with 12 poor disciples who had no human chance to succeed. All those disciples died as Martyrs. They themselves never harmed any other innocent soul, and shed no blood but their own, just like Jesus Christ Himself, as every true Christian should strive to live by. There are hardly any other parallels to a Religion starting with a few Poor Disciples all of whom became Martyrs, and yet all of whom also rose to a level of Missionary Success far above far more learned Jewish Rabbis or Pagan Philosophers. Not only Christianity, but other religions were missionary too; they tried to teach what they believed was the Truth. But Christianity was the actual Truth, and it was confirmed by both Philosophical Arguments and Multiple Miracles on Multiple Continents - the only reason Christianity could have grown and spread so far and so widely as it did, which is already evident by the end of the 1st Century A.D. Christianity was established in Africa, in India, in Europe etc.

To an argument made earlier: to be clear, Christianity, at least Catholic Christianity does not teach, live however you want, but as long as you believe in Jesus, you're going to Heaven, or anything like that. No, you should believe in Christ and be Baptized/receive the Sacraments, of course, but you should also strive to live a holy life, which has two parts (1) striving to avoid all sin, esp. mortal to begin with, to avoid Hell; then venial also, if you want to avoid Purgatory (2) secondly, to do good works, which also contribute in time, to receiving the Grace of Perseverance in Christ.

Not going to answer every other objection right now, but will do as time permits subsequently. Now, twice in what he wrote, Thomas Macaulay, mentions St. Augustine of Canterbury, Kent and England etc, let me quote those parts again: "The Catholic Church is still sending forth to the farthest ends of the world missionaries as zealous as those who landed in Kent with Augustin, and still confronting hostile kings with the same spirit with which she confronted Attila." The Attila thing was in the time of Pope St. Leo the Great, that's another interesting story, but we'll pass over that for now. And the 2nd is: "She was great and respected before the Saxon had set foot on Britain". So let's look at the story of how Christianity came to Britain, through St. Augustine of Canterbury, and Pope St. Gregory the Great. This same Pope St. Gregory the Great btw is also known for promoting Religious Freedom or Religious Liberty.

And that's the point here, let me quote St. Bede's Ecclesiastical History of the Church in England. Putting it in hide boxes, those who want can expand it: So St. Bede hands down the principle, which St. Augustine of Canterbury also taught: "he had learned from those who had instructed him and guided him to salvation, that the service of Christ ought to be voluntary, not by compulsion". This is the True Tradition of the Church Fathers and Early Christianity. One or two Church Fathers were of a different opinion, and thus some abuses happened; yes, we agree. But what is conveniently ignored in such re-tellings of history is that many Jews and many Pagans also persecuted Christians, e.g. between 30 and 70 A.D. Christians were persecuted in Jerusalem. Then Jerusalem was destroyed by the Romans. Then, for nearly 300 years, Christians were persecuted in pagan Rome. Then, God converted Emperor Constantine the Great, and Rome became Christian. Then, Christianity spread in England, Ireland etc, not by the sword, as is falsely claimed, but rather by Preaching and Miracles, by Philosophy and Arguments, as the life history of St. Patrick, the Apostle of Ireland, or the life history of St. Augustine of Canterbury, the Apostle of England will show. All these are basic facts of European and world history. 

If anyone denies these things happened, then how on Earth did Christianity come to Britain, to France, to Germany, to Ireland, etc in the first place, which everyone knows did happen? Go back in history and read, the answer is: through St. Augustine of Canterbury, St. Remigius, St. Boniface, St. Patrick respectively, most of whom were sent by Popes, like St. Augustine of C by Pope St. Gregory, and were Bishops/Priests themselves. They prayed, they fasted, they lived blameless lives beyond all reproach, they did charity and good works, and Christianity triumphed. 

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"When they had sat down, in obedience to the king's commands, and preached to him and his attendants there present the Word of life, the king answered thus: “Your words and promises are fair, but because they are new to us, and of uncertain import, I cannot consent to them so far as to forsake that which I have so long observed with the whole English nation. But because you are come from far as strangers into my kingdom, and, as I conceive, are desirous to impart to us those things which you believe to be true, and most beneficial, we desire not to harm you, but will give you favourable entertainment, and take care to supply you with all things necessary to your sustenance; nor do we forbid you to preach and gain as many as you can to your religion.” Accordingly he gave them an abode in the city of Canterbury, which was the metropolis of all his dominions, and, as he had promised, besides supplying them with sustenance, did not refuse them liberty to preach. It is told that, as they drew near to the city, after their manner, with the holy cross, and the image of our sovereign Lord and King, Jesus Christ, they sang in concert this litany: “We beseech thee, O Lord, for Thy great mercy, that Thy wrath and anger be turned away from this city, and from Thy holy house, for we have sinned. Hallelujah.” 
Chap. XXVI. How St. Augustine in Kent followed the doctrine and manner of life of the primitive Church, and settled his episcopal see in the royal city. [597 a.d.] As soon as they entered the dwelling-place assigned to them, they began to imitate the Apostolic manner of life in the primitive Church; applying themselves to constant prayer, watchings, and fastings; preaching the Word of life to as many as they could; despising all worldly things, as in nowise concerning them; receiving only their necessary food from those they taught; living themselves in all respects conformably to what they taught, and being always ready to suffer any adversity, and even [pg 048]to die for that truth which they preached. In brief, some believed and were baptized, admiring the simplicity of their blameless life, and the sweetness of their heavenly doctrine. There was on the east side of the city, a church dedicated of old to the honour of St. Martin, built whilst the Romans were still in the island, wherein the queen, who, as has been said before, was a Christian, was wont to pray. In this they also first began to come together, to chant the Psalms, to pray, to celebrate Mass, to preach, and to baptize, till when the king had been converted to the faith, they obtained greater liberty to preach everywhere and build or repair churches. When he, among the rest, believed and was baptized, attracted by the pure life of these holy men and their gracious promises, the truth of which they established by many miracles, greater numbers began daily to flock together to hear the Word, and, forsaking their heathen rites, to have fellowship, through faith, in the unity of Christ's Holy Church. It is told that the king, while he rejoiced at their conversion and their faith, yet compelled none to embrace Christianity, but only showed more affection to the believers, as to his fellow citizens in the kingdom of Heaven. For he had learned from those who had instructed him and guided him to salvation, that the service of Christ ought to be voluntary, not by compulsion. Nor was it long before he gave his teachers a settled residence suited to their degree in his metropolis of Canterbury, with such possessions of divers sorts as were necessary for them.

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[/quote]

The link: https://www.gutenberg.org/files/38326/38...html#toc59

[The Grand Nudger]

Blameless lives beyond all reproach, lol.

[Fake Messiah]

Not going to answer every other objection right now, but will do as time permits subsequently.

Nor is that your goal. You paste long speeches and touch on many subjects that are impossible for anyone to reply to as if you are not interested in debate but just proselytizing your bullshit.

[Nishant Xavier]

GN: Yup. That's what the Bible commands, including St. Peter, the First Pope:

"Live such good lives among the pagans that, though they accuse you of doing wrong, they may see your good deeds and glorify God on the day he visits us." (1 Pet 2:12)

And 1 Pet 3, Suffering for Righteousness: "15But in your hearts sanctify Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give a defense to everyone who asks you the reason for the hope that is in you. But respond with gentleness and respect, 16keeping a clear conscience, so that those who slander you may be put to shame by your good behavior in Christ. 17For it is better, if it is God’s will, to suffer for doing good than for doing evil."

Anyone who reads the life and example of the Early Christians, especially, the Apostles of Christ, sees they not only talked the talk, but also walked the walk: that's why in fact many happily joined the Church, when Christians were living like that. When Christians' don't like that, it's bad, and Christians need to change and go back to doing that. And Christ Himself of course He did this, He not only said to forgive one's enemies, but did it Himself on the Cross. Early Christianity was anointed and led by Holy Spirit fire, full of apostolic zeal and good works, and matchless holiness. It became and has remained the world's largest religion for a reason, but some lukewarmness has crept it; the solution is not to embrace some alleged or even modified western form of Marxist Militant Atheism that falsely claims Christian Religion is evil, but rather to return completely and wholeheartedly to the life and practice of Christ and His Apostles. Fasting and Prayer also has power, especially when it is accompanied by virtue and good works, and that's also part of the reason why God heard the prayers of the early Christians for the lost, and granted them so many disciples.

[The Grand Nudger]

To be fair, I doubt that engagement would be a real improvement. See above.

[Nishant Xavier]

To the Militant Atheist Fake Messiah: Oh pls, I have already answered many of your objections multiple times. Just don't feel like doing so right now, will get back to it when work is done, as you know I will. Now, want to come back to something else Macaulay said:

"The proudest royal houses are but of yesterday, when compared with the line of the Supreme Pontiffs. That line we trace back in an unbroken series, from the Pope who crowned Napoleon in the nineteenth century to the Pope who crowned Pepin in the eighth; and far beyond the time of Pepin the august dynasty extends, till it is lost in the twilight of fable. The republic of Venice came next in antiquity. But the republic of Venice was modern when compared with the Papacy; and the republic of Venice is gone, and the Papacy remains."

It's true that the Papacy endures far beyond the time of Pepin, the republic of Venice etc. However, it extends back further than Macaulay thought. When I find the source, I will quote Protestant Historian Philip Schaff in History of the Christian Church. He frankly admits that the Papacy and Bishops of Rome goes back to St. Peter, and the 2nd, 3th, and 4th Popes historically where St. Linus, St. Cletus and St. Clement. Even Wikipedia admits this now btw.

Here's Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_popes Later.

[arewethereyet]

Just because something has been around a long time does not mean it's good or true or right.

Leprosy has been around twice as long as Christianity and I am not signing up for that.

[Angrboda]

There appears to be an inverse relationship here between passion for the religion and ability to think rationality.

[Fake Messiah]

To the Militant Atheist Fake Messiah: Oh pls, I have already answered many of your objections multiple times. Just don't feel like doing so right now, will get back to it when work is done, as you know I will. Now, want to come back to something else Macaulay said:

Oh, so we are calling each other names, well from now on I will call you Pedophile Enabler Nishant.

In the post, you touched on many subjects, like the historicity of Abraham which was not proven; Prophecies that the Messiah would come - yes, but Jesus did not fulfill them (messiah was to rebuild the temple, bring world peace, make all people convert to Judaism, he was not to be the son of god) so Jesus was not a messiah; that disciples died for Jesus - not even mentioned in the Bible; and so on.