Religion and LGBT people

[Esquilax]

No, that isn't what you said. You said that gay people HAVE NO CHOICE to enter into relationships and want to marry. That's what you said, do you want me to point out where you said that?

Ah, I guess I was making the assumption that gay people were entitled to want to love who they're attracted to, and marry them. You know, like the rest of the population? And that, given you vociferously deny hating them, you wouldn't take issue with that desire to enter into a fulfilling relationship. Was I wrong to assume that of you?

I'm going to call you up on this point. You keep saying "genetic". That's bullshit. Handedness isn't even genetic, and it doesn't need to be to make it real, so stop using the term "genetic" as if there's a fucking gene that controls sexuality when you know full well that there isn't.

Call me on anything you like, I'll be the first to admit I was using the word as shorthand, again assuming you were smart enough to take my meaning. I also can't help but notice that you're nitpicking over nomenclature rather than addressing my point, there. Interesting.

You're so full of shit. This is what I said:

I equate the reality of paedophilia as an engrained sexuality alongside heterosexuality

WTF does that have to do with homosexuality??

Let me give you a hint: as a member of the LGBT community myself, I tend to take issue with people mentioning pedophilia in the same sentence as a segment of my own sexuality. It's an ingrained response, maybe it'd be best to just avoid doing so at all in future. Like I said, whatever your point is, it puts a sour taste in the mouth. I'd imagine if you'd been bludgeoned with that comparison all your life, you'd get a tad defensive about it too.

That said, if you meant no harm by it, then I apologize if I intimated something I shouldn't have. We all speak hastily on occasion.

[Waratah]

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You might notice, if you actually read my words, that I never once said anything about eugenics. In fact, I said miscegenation, which is a term for interracial relationships. Which did have a strong negative response from religious groups. Try responding to what I actually say, next time.

I think you missed my point there.

Let me reiterate it for you. Eugenics was once consensus within science. Now you're going to tell me, but Daniel the Bible says don't marry the disgusting pagan people and have children with them (Old Testament), well true. I'll give you that much, however that was religious and not racial. Any pagan person could convert to Judaism and then marry one of the Jews, nobody cared what race they were. Miscegenation was never consensus within Christianity, but Eugenics was once consensus within science!! See the difference?

So, I would have thought there was a fairly important line to draw between pedophilia and homosexuality, even if there is a genetic component to both; that line is one of harm, and of consent.

No, that isn't what you said. You said that gay people HAVE NO CHOICE to enter into relationships and want to marry. That's what you said, do you want me to point out where you said that?

But in the case of homosexuality, it's genetic and nobody can mount a cogent argument as to the harm it causes, because so long as it's between two (or more!) consenting adults it brings no harm to anyone.

I'm going to call you up on this point. You keep saying "genetic". That's bullshit. Handedness isn't even genetic, and it doesn't need to be to make it real, so stop using the term "genetic" as if there's a fucking gene that controls sexuality when you know full well that there isn't.

I don't know whether or not you're a bigot or hateful, but you definitely hold bigoted views. You're comparing harmless, adult homosexuality to the rape- and it's always rape because children can't consent- of children. That's bigoted, no matter your reasoning for doing so.

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You're so full of shit. This is what I said:

I equate the reality of paedophilia as an engrained sexuality alongside heterosexuality

WTF does that have to do with homosexuality??

As I said, if you can stomach it, go read some of their blogs, then come back here and tell me that I equated paedophilia to homosexuality.

I think you will find Daniel that you have tried to equate homosexuality with paedophilia before, .
I asked this

If a homosexual couple are married is it not a sin just like a married heterosexual couple?

And this is where you try to equate homosexuality with paedophilia

If a man marries a 9-year old and has sex with her it's still wrong. Here's an image to help you:

You even tried to post a sick image. Not once but twice.

[catfish]

I can't prove this negative unless you want me to post every religious text I can find. You seem to have trouble distinguishing between "religion" and "people".

Is there a specific text you'd like to address?
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Well I can distinguish between the two, I am not stupid. But most people try to make there religion a big part of them. I want some pointers on text that does not make relgion completely homophobic.

First I'd like some pointers on text that does make religion completely homophobic.
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[Zen Badger]

Well I can distinguish between the two, I am not stupid. But most people try to make there religion a big part of them. I want some pointers on text that does not make relgion completely homophobic.

First I'd like some pointers on text that does make religion completely homophobic.
.

Try this from one of your fellow christians

:linky:

They seem to think the bible is anti-gay.

[Aractus]

I think you will find Daniel that you have tried to equate homosexuality with paedophilia before, .

I was using Islam as an example, and giving an example of an illegal marriage, since that was the topic. You can twist it all you like, but I do believe some people are sexually attracted to children, regardless of whether said people gratify those desires. In the same way, I've met a couple of Xians who are homosexually orientated, but celibate.

[Zen Badger]

I was using Islam as an example, and giving an example of an illegal marriage, since that was the topic. You can twist it all you like, but I do believe some people are sexually attracted to children, regardless of whether said people gratify those desires. In the same way, I've met a couple of Xians who are homosexually orientated, but celibate.

Yes they are, but it is more appropriate to equate them to psychotic murderers.

Not people who happen to love each other.

It has become increasingly obvious though that in the absence of any valid reason for your bigotry you need to resort to diversions like this.

[Waratah]

I think you will find Daniel that you have tried to equate homosexuality with paedophilia before, .

I was using Islam as an example, and giving an example of an illegal marriage, since that was the topic. You can twist it all you like, but I do believe some people are sexually attracted to children, regardless of whether said people gratify those desires. In the same way, I've met a couple of Xians who are homosexually orientated, but celibate.

You are a fucking liar Daniel. The topic was about homosexuality being a sin just like sex outside of marriage. This is when I asked about homosexuality being okay in marriage, which you refused to answer directly. Instead you would answer by giving an example such as you did with the paedophilia shit. Islam was irrelevant to the debate. No twisting needed by me. Just fucking accept that you equated homosexuality with paedophilia to try to support your idea that homosexuality(actions) is wrong inside or outside of marriage. Which means you have lied again.

"You can twist it all you like, but I do believe some people are sexually attracted to children, " How, what, when, who(I'm confused)? I agree with you that there is such a thing as paedophilia. So fucking what. I remember when a Australian politician try to equate paedophilia with gays by saying 30% of paedophiles were gay, so if we fix the homosexual problem then we would be saving a lot of children. Stupid thinking right. By his thinking if we got rid of the heterosexual problem then there would be even more children saved(70%). The correlation between homosexuality and paedophilia is a terrible myth which needs to be stopped.

Daniel, understand that paedophilia is a separate issue to either homosexuals or heterosexuals( especially consenting adults)

Then you go on to say that some paedophiles may not conduct in paedophilia acts.(and that's great and they should be supported in that) And then your next sentence is comparing some homosexual friends of yours who are celibate. Please Daniel

[Violet]

People have gotten so rude to one another these days 0.o I mean seriously... the rage would be funny if they were the slightest bit creative in their application of it.

They don't make them like they used to

[catfish]

First I'd like some pointers on text that does make religion completely homophobic.
.

Try this from one of your fellow christians

:linky:

They seem to think the bible is anti-gay.

My "fellow Christians"??? Seriously, what part of "personal and unique" do you not understand? Shall I lump you in with some asshole atheists?

Form you own opinion if you can and if you can't, take someone else's opinion and pass it off as your own here, in THIS thread...
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[Aractus]

You are a fucking liar Daniel. The topic was about homosexuality being a sin just like sex outside of marriage. This is when I asked about homosexuality being okay in marriage, which you refused to answer directly. Instead you would answer by giving an example such as you did with the paedophilia shit. Islam was irrelevant to the debate.

It was clearly in the context of the Prophet Muhammad's marriage to his "favourite" wife. That's what I said I disagreed with.

The correlation between homosexuality and paedophilia is a terrible myth which needs to be stopped.

I never claimed there's correlation so relax.

Daniel, understand that paedophilia is a separate issue to either homosexuals or heterosexuals( especially consenting adults)

You think it's a separate issue. All issues involved with sexuality are inherently intertwined.

Then you go on to say that some paedophiles may not conduct in paedophilia acts.(and that's great and they should be supported in that) And then your next sentence is comparing some homosexual friends of yours who are celibate. Please Daniel

I didn't say they were friends of mine, my homosexual friends are not celibate.

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My "fellow Christians"??? Seriously, what part of "personal and unique" do you not understand? Shall I lump you in with some asshole atheists?

Form you own opinion if you can and if you can't, take someone else's opinion and pass it off as your own here, in THIS thread...

I didn't bother to view that link, but I should point out that the Bible is not silent on the issue (as Zen seems to think), but nor is it the most important issue either. God destroys Sodom in Genesis, we aren't told specifically why (at least not until Ezekiel 16:49 and it has nothing to do with sexuality). We don't find out anywhere in Genesis that homosexuality is a sin, and in Exodus God doesn't give a commandment to Moses prohibiting it. It's not until Leviticus that God declares it sinful. So it certainly wouldn't seem to be the most important sin, but that said, it is still a sin, and it is made clear in the Bible.