Posts: 69247
Threads: 3759
Joined: August 2, 2009
Reputation:
259
RE: Attn: Christians, We've Heard Them Already
June 11, 2013 at 5:04 pm
(This post was last modified: June 11, 2013 at 5:04 pm by Minimalist.)
Bart Ehrman dealt with the Problem of Evil, too.
He came to a far different conclusion than some bozo on a message board.
http://blog.beliefnet.com/blogalogue/200...oblem.html
Quote:This was my view for many years, and I still consider it a powerful theological view. It would be a view that I would still hold on to, if I were still a Christian. But I’m not.
About nine or ten years ago I came to realize that I simply no longer believed the Christian message. A large part of my movement away from the faith was driven by my concern for suffering. I simply no longer could hold to the view—which I took to be essential to Christian faith—that God was active in the world, that he answered prayer, that he intervened on behalf of his faithful, that he brought salvation in the past and that in the future, eventually in the coming eschaton, he would set to rights all that was wrong, that he would vindicate his name and his people and bring in a good kingdom (either at our deaths or here on earth in a future utopian existence).
Posts: 5336
Threads: 198
Joined: June 24, 2010
Reputation:
77
RE: Attn: Christians, We've Heard Them Already
June 11, 2013 at 5:23 pm
(June 11, 2013 at 5:01 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: I've never ever seen you debunk anything.
You have to take off the Holy Spirit glasses first.
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
Posts: 14259
Threads: 48
Joined: March 1, 2009
Reputation:
80
RE: Attn: Christians, We've Heard Them Already
June 11, 2013 at 5:26 pm
(This post was last modified: June 11, 2013 at 5:26 pm by fr0d0.)
And put on the glasses of atheism
confirmation bias FTW
Posts: 5336
Threads: 198
Joined: June 24, 2010
Reputation:
77
RE: Attn: Christians, We've Heard Them Already
June 11, 2013 at 5:43 pm
(June 11, 2013 at 5:26 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: And put on the glasses of atheism
Atheism is a philosophy like clear is a color. Try again?
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
Posts: 29659
Threads: 116
Joined: February 22, 2011
Reputation:
159
RE: Attn: Christians, We've Heard Them Already
June 11, 2013 at 5:49 pm
(This post was last modified: June 11, 2013 at 6:10 pm by Angrboda.)
I think it's a case of "debunked" is in the eye of the beholder. The atheists may lay out their case and conclude that they've prevailed. The theists, coming from a different perspective, likewise conclude on their behalf. I'm not going to debate who is right or wrong, because I obviously have my own biases. (Though I will commend DP for doing a good job in clarifying arguments.) But posting our viewpoints from settled positions doesn't move the ball in either direction. That's why we have discussion. Not to "vanquish the enemies of the world" but to give people a chance for some social engagement, an opportunity to pleasantly kill some time, and perhaps, learn something, even if that something doesn't fundamentally change either camp. It might help to analogize it to a similar debate currently ongoing on this forum, that of the cause and substance of mental illness. There are those who feel that mental illness is a disease and should be dealt with as such. There are those who have different opinions on the matter. How does one move from one position to the other? Being pointed to a FAQ or list of settled positions on the matter isn't going to change anybody's mind, and given the nature of human psychology, will likely simply harden hearts and kill interest in debate and discussion. If people are wrong on some matter, they need to be shown in their own thinking what is going on, and if misinformed, they need to be informed and educated. Yes, references to relevant materials is important, but I don't think it really supplants or replaces the need for discussion, and it may in fact kill discussions.
Posts: 14259
Threads: 48
Joined: March 1, 2009
Reputation:
80
RE: Attn: Christians, We've Heard Them Already
June 11, 2013 at 5:49 pm
(This post was last modified: June 11, 2013 at 5:52 pm by fr0d0.)
(June 11, 2013 at 5:43 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote: Atheism is a philosophy like clear is a color. Try again?
Just like theism is a philosophy just like off is a TV channel.
Wow you just destroyed your own argument!
Posts: 501
Threads: 7
Joined: June 3, 2013
Reputation:
13
RE: Attn: Christians, We've Heard Them Already
June 11, 2013 at 5:52 pm
(June 11, 2013 at 5:49 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: Just like theism is a philosophy just like off is a TV channel.
Wow you just destroyed your own argument!
um... Fail.
Posts: 14259
Threads: 48
Joined: March 1, 2009
Reputation:
80
RE: Attn: Christians, We've Heard Them Already
June 11, 2013 at 5:53 pm
(June 11, 2013 at 5:52 pm)Savannahw Wrote: um... Fail.
Really?
Care to spell out your ignorance?
Posts: 501
Threads: 7
Joined: June 3, 2013
Reputation:
13
RE: Attn: Christians, We've Heard Them Already
June 11, 2013 at 5:57 pm
(This post was last modified: June 11, 2013 at 5:57 pm by Savannahw.)
A TV has to be on to have a channel. Electricity turns the tv on, thus allowing you to pick a channel. Off is not a channel. It is just an unpowered tv.
Posts: 30974
Threads: 204
Joined: July 19, 2011
Reputation:
141
RE: Attn: Christians, We've Heard Them Already
June 11, 2013 at 5:58 pm
(This post was last modified: June 11, 2013 at 5:59 pm by Jackalope.)
(June 11, 2013 at 5:52 pm)Savannahw Wrote: (June 11, 2013 at 5:49 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: Just like theism is a philosophy just like off is a TV channel.
Wow you just destroyed your own argument!
um... Fail.
I'm going to have to side with the hoary hobbit on this one (with respect to the analogy).
A theistic religion might satisfy the criteria for being a philosophy, but theism (see note below) doesn't, as (like atheism) it only represents an answer to the question "Do you believe any gods exist?".
Dictionary.com Wrote:1.
the belief in one God as the creator and ruler of the universe, without rejection of revelation ( distinguished from deism ).
2.
belief in the existence of a god or gods ( opposed to atheism ).
|
![[Image: extraordinarywoo-sig.jpg]](https://i.postimg.cc/zf86M5L7/extraordinarywoo-sig.jpg)
