(March 28, 2016 at 1:27 pm)Godschild Wrote:(March 28, 2016 at 11:44 am)Nymphadora Wrote: Too bad all those starving people living in third world countries or those tribal communities tucked way back, deep in a forest, who struggle to find food daily, don't know about YOUR god and prayer.
That's why we go to those places as Jesus ask us to, there are benefits outside salvation we introduce others to.
That's not prayer. That's actively doing something. See the difference? We're talking about prayer and the fallacy that people seem to believe that it works.
Nymphadora Wrote:They all could have "prayers" for food answered in a snap. Cause that's how your god works, right?
GC Wrote:No not really, we teach them how to farm ground and raise animals for food, this way they can provide food for themselves and their families and future generations. Christianity is a simple practice of teaching, you can find this throughout the NT.
Again - NOT prayer. See the portion of your quote that I bolded. To reiterate - NOT PRAYER. That is teaching skills of survival. You are trying to dodge the points I'm making.
Nymphadora Wrote:No, sorry. If he existed at all, things like hunger and disease would be obsolete. He would take care of ALL persons on earth, regardless of their religious beliefs (or non-beliefs) because being the "loving" god you and others claim he is, he wouldn't want anyone to suffer.
GC Wrote:He doesn't want anyone to suffer, however there is this sin thing that has brought suffering into the world and man continues with sin at a greater and greater rate. So there will always be suffering until sin is eliminated. Jesus himself told His disciples that we would always have the poor with us. If you hate so much to see the poor suffer then I'm supposing you are working to help them, if not shouldn't you, it is a man made problem after all.
I myself AM poor. But I'm in school so that I can gain valuable job skills to be able to not only survive, but to thrive. Your god didn't have anything to do with that initial decision and he still doesn't have anything to do with it. I alone earn my grades. No god necessary. As for sin - god created that sin because he put it there as part of his "plan". If it wasn't part of his plan to make people sin, he shouldn't have put temptation there in the first place. And that's straying from the topic.
Nymphadora Wrote:In addition to that, prayer shouldn't even be required or necessary since god supposedly has a "plan" for each of us. So praying for the outcomes that WE want is really pointless since it's clearly not what HE wants, nor would it be part of his plan.
GC Wrote:I see by this statement you made you're deficient in bible knowledge to an extreme amount.
I might not know as much as some people here, but I know enough that I can accurately make the statement I made about his supposed plan.
GC Wrote:God's absolute will can't be changed, God's plan for any life is not set in stone, a person has free will and God will adjust the plan to help us in our ignorance of what's best. Prayer is not about what we want, prayer is about staying in the plan God has for us, this type of prayer is only for the Christian.
The free will argument is pointless. We won't go there because it's been argued to death on these forums. As for your saying a certain type of prayer is for the Christian, Show me proof of that and I'll show you Jewish people who will strongly disagree with you. Besides, you have no guarantees that your god is *the* god. 40,000 other religious types can't be wrong and yours just "happens" to be right on your say so? Give me a break.
GC Wrote:God's not going to help those who deny He exists,
People living in tribal/jungle areas don't know he exists, therefore they can't deny it. So what about those people? They just get to be punished with starvation and disease because, reasons? Your argument does not make sense and all the people "praying" for those who are:
1 - starving and;
2 - don't know of the existence of any sort of god, is pointless, according to your reasonings.
GC Wrote:Prayer is part of having a relationship with Him, not for get what you want, it's not a credit card you can throw around. Be fore arguing pray you should learn what prayer really is.
Try telling that to the thousands of your fellow christians who constantly pray over their food or pray before a game or because they got a touchdown in football (Tebowing comes to mind), or they pray to find their car keys or money etc etc, ad nausem. They are the ones you need to be telling this to. I already know prayer doesn't do shit.
Nymphadora Wrote:God + prayer = a completely stupid waste of time and there is zero proof that it works. Testimonials are subjective and can't be verified for their truthfulness or accuracy. Witnessing isn't proof of prayer working either since, again, it is subjective.
GC Wrote:It's verified in those individuals who have a living relationship with God and in actual truth that's really all that matters. You're trying to apply science to a spiritual life and it just doesn't work that way.
Then if that's all that matters, stop trying to convince a forum full of atheists that we need your god because in all actual truth, we don't care about your non-existent god and that's really all that matters. Not a single believer has ever come on here with verifiable proof of any existence of any god. So, really, thanks but no thanks. We don't need your imaginary friends.
Nymphadora Wrote:Admit it. There is no god. There is no plan. And prayer doesn't do shit. Anyone can make excuses for it all they want but answered prayers aren't real. The end result is always the result of someone actually doing something that accomplishes said desired result. You know, like doing the work required to solve a problem. No god ever steps in and uses their so-called omniscient powers to help out.
GC Wrote:I'll do no such thing Satan.
Oh... so now I'm satan? I see how this works. An atheist makes a valid, reasonable point (this happens all the time) and rather than you just saying, "Well, I'm okay with your non-beliefs and you're okay with my beliefs and we'll just leave it at that and I won't try to shove my religion or my god down your throat.", you resort to calling me satan. Whatever helps you sleep at night buddy, but I don't think that your god would approve of your not-so-christian attitude towards your neighbor. What's that commandment? Oh that's right... Love thy neighbor.

Disclaimer: I am only responsible for what I say, not what you choose to understand.