(May 2, 2016 at 4:53 pm)Huggy74 Wrote:(May 2, 2016 at 3:38 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote: 1) Constructed the laws of the universe, including the requirements for how the bipedal, intelligent apes inhabiting one small desert corner of the third rock from one star out of trillions (that we can detect), should think and eat and dress and screw.
2) Constructed those laws in such a way that the penalty for failure to adhere to them is a penalty of eternal torment.
3) Offered "pardon" to those who worship said entity and accept that pardon thereby.
If I came into your neighborhood with a crew of heavily-armed men, gathered everyone in the central square, and told them at gunpoint that they were doing something I didn't like, so they could either tell me I'm the greatest and accept my pardon, or else I'd have to shoot them... what would you call me?
Your "God" has done exactly that, by allegedly being both lawmaker and judge, especially since I only have your word and the written words of long-dead barbarians to tell me that it's even a real thing.
I think you're way off base.
There was no law in the beginning. What law was Abraham under?
God put man here with only one restriction.
Unbelief is what caused man to fall, therefore it will take belief to bring us back. It's quite simple.
You're trying to use the Covenant as your excuse for the concept of hell and eternal punishment? Seriously!?
What. A. Surprise... a cult that claims believing in its claims is the only way to be saved.
You've completely failed to address the point I raised, which is that your current theology is that of the servant of a monster. You can deny it all you like, but it's plain to see. You're the one who proposed that we're subject to the penalty of law unless we accept pardon via acceptance of vicarious atonement by the very being (don't quibble with that "no it was the Son" bit, unless you're willing to concede that God and Jesus are two entirely different beings), and I pointed out to you why being the Craftsman of the Universe, including setting up all the rules by which it operates, from physics to "sin", as you claim, means that the being is no better than a mobster.
A Christian told me: if you were saved you cant lose your salvation. you're sealed with the Holy Ghost
I replied: Can I refuse? Because I find the entire concept of vicarious blood sacrifice atonement to be morally abhorrent, the concept of holding flawed creatures permanently accountable for social misbehaviors and thought crimes to be morally abhorrent, and the concept of calling something "free" when it comes with the strings of subjugation and obedience perhaps the most morally abhorrent of all... and that's without even going into the history of justifying genocide, slavery, rape, misogyny, religious intolerance, and suppression of free speech which has been attributed by your own scriptures to your deity. I want a refund. I would burn happily rather than serve the monster you profess to love.
I replied: Can I refuse? Because I find the entire concept of vicarious blood sacrifice atonement to be morally abhorrent, the concept of holding flawed creatures permanently accountable for social misbehaviors and thought crimes to be morally abhorrent, and the concept of calling something "free" when it comes with the strings of subjugation and obedience perhaps the most morally abhorrent of all... and that's without even going into the history of justifying genocide, slavery, rape, misogyny, religious intolerance, and suppression of free speech which has been attributed by your own scriptures to your deity. I want a refund. I would burn happily rather than serve the monster you profess to love.
