(July 18, 2011 at 2:10 am)Trog31 Wrote:(July 11, 2011 at 10:02 pm)theVOID Wrote: God is often described as being simple, this is an extremely important claim for any theists as the more complex an explanation is the lower the prior probability of this thing existing. Seeing as it is already extremely difficult to present any evidence for the existence of God outside of the experience of certain sensations (which is poor quality evidence given the number of contradictory claims based on the same standard) if we could show that the prior probability of this being was much lower than that of possible alternative causes for the universe we would be forced to conclude that the other explanations are much more likely to be true.New here so apologies if I am breaching protocol by not responding to the last post.
I liked that you are attempting to defeat the "God is Simple" position taken by Theists.
However I would take a different approach. Rather than trying to prove complexity using the concept of "plan"
I would agree with Theists and say "God is SO simple he need not exist"
I'll try to be coherent...
God's "Plan" cannot change.
If it DID change, that would imply imperfection (God can't make mistakes)
A plan that does not change is a map
A map requires no intelligence, no consciousness and no will
The complexity of the map is conferred by the being PERCEIVING/INTERPRETING the map, not the map itself
God is therefore no more complex than what a being perceives Him to be
God takes on the qualities of the observer and has none of his own
(each observer would perceive a different "god")
God therefore exists only in the minds of those perceiving him and is as simple
or complex as the imagination of the perceiver.
God is a figment of imagination
Does that make sense?
Cheers!
Appreciated! I did a wholesale clip and neglected the close...
You are correct in saying God does not change and that His plan does not change, you miss the point though, God is perfect and thus His plan is perfect so there is no need of change. As for your map analogy you again have missed the mark, true a map is a guide but it takes some intellegence to understand the map, one also must be conscious of how a map works and have the will to us it. The complexity of the map has nothiing to do with how it is preceived, a complex map is a complex map and it is complex because it's designer made it that way, if the designer gives enough instruction to go with said map then the complexity becomes manageable for all that have the will to accept it and learn, thus having less problems following the map to one's finial destination. God therefore is more complex than the one desiring to follow His plan and he will take on the attributes of God so he can successfully follow the plan, therefore the relationship he has with God can be as simple or as complex as he desires. God is far beyond our understanding, if He wasn't then He would not be God, therefore God has revealed himself in a manner that everyone can relate to if they choose to do so, this revelation of God to man is called "divine simplicity."
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.