Theists: Hitchens Wager

[Edwardo Piet]

The tornado thing really is about clarifying the 'intentions aren't important' aspect.  Because intentions are big part of how we differentiate between humans and tornados behavior.  

Well, you'll get no disagreement there. I already said they're important insofar as they lead to bad consequences...

You bring up punishment, which is really a deterrent for bad behavior.  But if you have a faultless or unintentionally bad consequence, like opening a door for an old lady, and a bunch of wolves hop out and eat her, trying to prevent that is very similar to trying to prevent a tornado from tornading.  Seems more like a 'shit happens' thing.

Yes it is a shit happens thing. But it's still bad that it happens.

There would be nothing inherently wrong with saying that tornadoes were "immoral"... it just seems silly to use that word about tornadoes.

Preventing suffering caused by tornadoes is just as important as preventing suffering from non-tornadoes, provided the suffering involved is the same in both cases and equally preventable in both cases.

It just sounds silly to use "immoral" in reference to tornadoes. That's the wrong word. It's like calling water "non-dry"... technically it is non-dry but it makes a lot more sense to simply say it's wet.