(March 13, 2019 at 1:19 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: The tradition dates to the Middle Ages. Historically, ALL the Catholics of a given area would get to vote for local priests, deacons, bishops and so on. Sometime in the 11th century, it was decided that the best way to keep secular influences out of the church matters would be to restrict voting for Pope to the cardinals. The idea was to prevent emperors, kings, and other assorted nasties from controlling the church by influencing the election (didn't work).
And, Brian, it IS an election, whether you're uncomfortable with the term or not.
Boru
Um no, it was more to the point that the Pope was the top dog over the kings. It was not a real separation of Church and state. The kings under the Church always had to be anointed by the Church. It was still a form of theocracy.
Real secular separation didn't take hold until the age enlightenment. Even after that, even after the founders, there have been constant attempts to interject religion into common law. The Church did not come up with the concept of common law.
"Secular" to the theist back then meant, merely means anyone who does not ascribe to their specific sect. "Secular" in the modern world means neutral, neither for or against.
Even with England, the only reason the Queen cant become a dictator is because long ago the parliament beheaded a king. But it still remains in antiquity the real power was religion. Royalty back then, saw itself as under the favor of divine power. The queen today has to ask permission to enter one of the chambers. I forgot which one.
Certainly you can find individual rulers whom persecuted religious dissent, but ultimately long term, royal families in antiquity saw their powers as being divinely anointed.
It still has no reflection on modern western pluralism.
