Quote:And if a man sells his daughter to be a female slave, she shall not go out as the male slaves do. If she does not please the master who has selected her for himself, he must let her be redeemed. He has no right to sell her to foreigners, because he has broken faith with her. If he selects her for his son, he must grant her the rights of a daughter. If he marries another woman, he must not deprive the first one of her food, clothing and marital rights. If he does not provide her with these three things, she is to go free, without any payment of money. (Exodus 21:7-11)
This is objectionable against the modern understanding of marriage. How do you know this is wrong. I see this verse as regulating slavery and providing protections for females who are sold as slaves. While this may not be appetizing to people who are used to living in a society in which this is no longer necessary, the intention of the scripture is clearly not to exacerbate the conditions of female slavery but to regulate them and make them easier to endure. In the ancient world, people would be sold into slavery because of war or famine, it was common in all cultures. It took many, many centuries for slavery to be illegal.
The burden is on the atheist to show how slavery could have been abolished in the ancient world. In addition, when you add to the fact that slavery is not a concept that emerges out of the atheist understanding of the natural world or from a trivial appreciation of ethics, you see that the way that the slavery objection typical functions is more to an appeal of the moral authority that abolitionists have in Christian societies. Atheists rely on the fact that slavery has been abolished in Christian countries to justify their absolutist views about morality. This is of course preposterous, why should the moral norms of Christian societies at an advanced stage be used as evidence to condemn theistic societies of the past in a different economic and social stage. The atheist has no evidence to universalize their rejection of slavery but instead makes a pathetic appeal to peoples deep seated sense of national pride. The argument fails because it was never a real philosophical argument to begin with, it is mere propaganda.
Quote:"Behold, here is my daughter a maiden, and his concubine; them I will bring out now, and humble ye them, and do with them what seemeth good unto you: but unto this man do not so vile a thing. But the men would not hearken to him: so the man took his concubine, and brought her forth unto them; and they knew her, and abused her all the night until the morning: and when the day began to spring, they let her go." (Judges 19:24-25)
This is a total misreading of scripture. This shows that you are just cut and pasting difficult passages without even considering the context or what scripture intends to say. The Old Testament condemns rape with the death penalty, see Deut 28.
Quote:"For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man. Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man." (I Corinthians 11:8-9)
None of this proves the point you are trying to make. You are appealing to a sense of cultural uneasiness with a male dominated society. I would say this sense of uneasiness is well placed. History has shown that men are constantly willing to use their positions of influence to abuse women. That said, this does not prove that there is no natural order that tends to exalt men to leadership positions. Biology would tend to say that there is. The atheist approach to feminism, of course, is not based on biology, or really even based on feminism, it is a crude mix of appeals to political propaganda while cynically promoting pornography and sensuality while ignoring the scientific evidence that is used elsewhere to discredit religious belief. The atheist thrives where demands for consistency are relaxed and he/she is permitted to pick and choose what is desirable to make the point. Biology and history, however, would seem to say that men and women are different and almost always occupy different roles. I do not think this means that God necessarily binds all women to certain positions in all societies, but this is the way that it has played out.
Quote:"If a man be found lying with a woman married to an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her;" (Deuteronomy 22:22)
"Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour's wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you." (Deuteronomy 22:24)
The Old Testament punishes adultery with death, as it punishes many crimes with death. This does not prove anything about a misogynistic bias in scripture, it is true that the Old Testament punishes some crimes more severely than the modern world does. How do you intend to say that this is wrong, let alone that it is biased against women?
Quote:"Let the women learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression." (I Timothy 2:11-14)
This scripture does not prove that women are inferior to men. God does not create men with the ability to bear children, does this mean that men are inferior to women? Of course not. You have not said a single thing to justify the very controversial proposition that "men and women should have equal roles in all societies". If you ignore religion and just focus on what is economically and physically possible, I seriously doubt that men and women could occupy the same roles. How many women are there that can cut wood? Look at professional sports, if the NBA played the WNBA, who would win? This is not a matter of political speculation, it is a matter of common sense. Whatever you think of gender roles in the modern church, there are diverse views on this and not all interpret these passages as being binding on modern Christians (I have been in churches where the women preached), it is an absolute fact of history that men and women are different and could not have occupied the same roles.
Quote:There is no reading this "in context". It's wrong, plain and simple. If Christians didn't cherrypick the Bible, women would be incredibly inferior to men.
There is no human right that women in all societies have the right to go to college and become lawyers. Anyone who thinks so is incredibly ethnocentric in their views of culture and morality and lacks insight into the changing dynamics of social and economic organization. Life is a lot more complicated than a bumper sticker.
Quote:There are even more examples of female oppression, but it would take much too long to find all of them.
There are many more examples of passages that show favor and dignity to women, which, as is customary for the free thinking atheist, are methodically left out and probably not even known. Consider Proverbs 31. Where do you see sexism in the description of the women there. Or consider Deborah, the prophetess in the Old Testament, who is a judge of Israel. Consider the role that Mary Magdelene plays and the way that Jesus treats women in the New Testament.
In the Christian church, women have many protections that they lack elsewhere. They are able to find good husbands who do not abuse them within the church. There is the pastoral authority that helps women to stay in stable relationships. The Christian teachings on sexual purity benefit women, who would be seen as sex objects in bars or in secular culture throughout the world. The Bible teaches that men and women are to "submit to one another out of reverence for Christ", something rarely seen in the ancient or modern world. The institution of marriage is redefined to make all conduct directed towards God, instead of to the selfish desires of the male as it would typically exist in most cultures in the world. The cultures of the world that have seen the most freedom and least exploitation for women have been the Christian cultures. Would you compare the experience of women in America or Europe to the experience of women in the Soviet Union or in the Islamic world?
Today, Christian women occupy many influential positions. Many are pastors and leaders. Many have chosen to occupy traditional roles in carry for children. Christian culture affirms the dignity of human beings and women more than any other culture. Atheist culture denies that any moral norms exist for treating women or anyone else, but demands that people trust it to have some sort of way of regulating conduct based on arbitrary cultural prejudices. Atheists think that this will improve the position of women but there is absolutely no reason to think so.
