Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: February 26, 2025, 6:00 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
2016 Elections
#82
RE: 2016 Elections
(April 21, 2015 at 3:42 pm)Hatshepsut Wrote:
(April 21, 2015 at 1:59 pm)Nestor Wrote: You can't just pretend like U.S. military intervention isn't the primary cause for the existence of groups like ISIS and Al-Qaeda. The former are, after all, former members of Al-Qaeda in Iraq, which consisted of Ba'ath party loyalists in Saddam's regime... A regime we also propped up in the 80s before completely destabilizing the region with Dubya's invasion...What do we expect to occur when we go into Muslim nations and establish rulers who treat their people with absolutely no dignity?

The acute and the chronic in short. Ugly spectacles like the piles of naked bodies at Abu Ghraib don't help. It was this and the waterboardings in secret jails that soured me on Pres. Bush, whom I was willing to support on the initial action against the Taliban in Oct. 2001. It's arguable he should have stayed out of Iraq to begin with although impossible to predict what would have resulted. Presumably Uday would have inherited from Saddam and continued the extreme repression we now know was the only thing holding the lid on the place.

The chronic goes all the way back to Napoleon's entry into Egypt, beginning a 200-year run of shortsighted Western abuses in the Middle East. Yet we have to deal with the situation as it is today. The Taliban, Al-Qaeda, and Islamic State (indeed Al-Baghdadi split off from AQI  ca. 2009, see Wood in Atlantic Monthly) cannot be allowed to operate unopposed. I don't think we can negotiate with them as if they were legitimate players in the world system, either. While these groups feed on anti-Western resentment, it's not just the West and its pro-Western lackeys they hate. They literally want to return their societies to the 7th century. They may well have arisen sooner or later even had the West never become involved in the region.

When we're doing everything within our power to 1) pressure our "allies" and "partners" who are habitual human rights abusers to cease the deplorable actions they commit against their own people (which can never truly happen so long as our politicians are themselves beneficiaries of such tyrants and warlords and responsible for our own culture of abusive policies and actions), 2) support those who are poor and/or indoctrinated with economic aid and education, either by directly establishing relations with businesses and authorities in those countries able to effect change, or literally dropping books and food instead of bombs in those without any political stability, and 3) formulate a coherent strategy for not simply destroying cities and terrorist organizations that control them, but that helps establish actual systems of government that the common man, woman, and child will benefit from no matter what their color or creed is, then I will 4) support drone strikes and surveillance in a very limited way.
He who loves God cannot endeavour that God should love him in return - Baruch Spinoza
Reply



Messages In This Thread
2016 Elections - by Silver - April 15, 2015 at 1:30 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 15, 2015 at 1:38 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Silver - April 15, 2015 at 1:41 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Heywood - April 15, 2015 at 2:33 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 15, 2015 at 1:48 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 15, 2015 at 1:48 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 15, 2015 at 2:35 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Clueless Morgan - April 15, 2015 at 10:42 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 15, 2015 at 10:54 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Faith No More - April 15, 2015 at 10:50 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Faith No More - April 15, 2015 at 11:03 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Brian37 - April 15, 2015 at 11:23 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 15, 2015 at 11:49 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Brian37 - April 15, 2015 at 12:15 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Faith No More - April 15, 2015 at 12:54 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by polar bear - April 15, 2015 at 12:06 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 15, 2015 at 12:18 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Brian37 - April 15, 2015 at 12:25 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 15, 2015 at 12:51 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Brian37 - April 15, 2015 at 1:20 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 15, 2015 at 12:57 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Faith No More - April 15, 2015 at 1:04 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 15, 2015 at 1:07 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Faith No More - April 15, 2015 at 1:19 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 15, 2015 at 9:52 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by vorlon13 - April 15, 2015 at 1:05 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 15, 2015 at 2:53 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Brian37 - April 15, 2015 at 9:03 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by AFTT47 - April 16, 2015 at 1:53 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Polaris - April 15, 2015 at 7:10 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Clueless Morgan - April 15, 2015 at 7:30 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Polaris - April 15, 2015 at 8:37 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by CapnAwesome - April 15, 2015 at 9:15 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 15, 2015 at 10:12 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - April 16, 2015 at 1:39 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - April 16, 2015 at 4:03 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by A Theist - April 16, 2015 at 4:34 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Polaris - April 16, 2015 at 7:12 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Faith No More - April 16, 2015 at 10:37 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Pizza - April 16, 2015 at 5:16 am
2016 Elections - by KUSA - April 16, 2015 at 7:45 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 16, 2015 at 10:16 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by CapnAwesome - April 16, 2015 at 11:38 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 17, 2015 at 12:11 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by CapnAwesome - April 17, 2015 at 12:19 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by A Theist - April 17, 2015 at 4:59 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by downbeatplumb - April 21, 2015 at 1:55 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by DeistPaladin - April 21, 2015 at 6:39 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Pizza - April 16, 2015 at 9:21 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by vorlon13 - April 16, 2015 at 10:12 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by polar bear - April 16, 2015 at 10:22 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 16, 2015 at 1:10 pm
2016 Elections - by KUSA - April 16, 2015 at 9:47 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Polaris - April 16, 2015 at 9:50 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by bennyboy - April 16, 2015 at 10:23 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 16, 2015 at 10:44 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 17, 2015 at 11:26 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - April 16, 2015 at 11:47 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 17, 2015 at 12:27 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Heywood - April 17, 2015 at 2:09 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by CapnAwesome - April 19, 2015 at 9:42 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 20, 2015 at 6:27 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - April 20, 2015 at 6:54 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 20, 2015 at 9:40 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 21, 2015 at 5:53 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - April 21, 2015 at 5:55 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 21, 2015 at 6:12 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by BrianSoddingBoru4 - April 17, 2015 at 4:31 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Brian37 - April 17, 2015 at 2:10 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Thumpalumpacus - April 17, 2015 at 1:31 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 17, 2015 at 3:41 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - April 17, 2015 at 4:44 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Thumpalumpacus - May 1, 2015 at 8:32 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - May 1, 2015 at 8:53 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - May 2, 2015 at 4:49 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - May 2, 2015 at 10:39 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Thumpalumpacus - May 2, 2015 at 11:16 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - May 2, 2015 at 10:13 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by AFTT47 - April 17, 2015 at 7:23 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 17, 2015 at 6:04 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - April 17, 2015 at 7:10 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Pizza - April 17, 2015 at 7:25 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Polaris - April 20, 2015 at 11:23 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Silver - April 20, 2015 at 11:26 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Brian37 - April 21, 2015 at 6:05 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 21, 2015 at 1:24 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - April 21, 2015 at 1:59 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 21, 2015 at 3:42 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - April 21, 2015 at 5:20 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 21, 2015 at 7:15 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Pizza - April 21, 2015 at 2:11 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Brian37 - April 21, 2015 at 3:09 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 21, 2015 at 3:39 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 21, 2015 at 6:48 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 21, 2015 at 7:22 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 21, 2015 at 7:34 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 21, 2015 at 7:34 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 21, 2015 at 7:42 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 21, 2015 at 8:22 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 21, 2015 at 8:10 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 21, 2015 at 8:13 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Whateverist - April 21, 2015 at 8:25 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Polaris - April 21, 2015 at 8:26 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Brian37 - April 21, 2015 at 8:33 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Whateverist - April 21, 2015 at 8:29 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Polaris - April 21, 2015 at 8:31 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 21, 2015 at 8:41 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Whateverist - April 21, 2015 at 8:49 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 21, 2015 at 8:52 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Anomalocaris - April 21, 2015 at 9:22 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Aroura - April 21, 2015 at 9:02 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - April 21, 2015 at 9:15 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Pizza - April 21, 2015 at 9:25 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - April 21, 2015 at 11:01 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 21, 2015 at 9:39 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by c172 - April 21, 2015 at 11:09 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by DeistPaladin - April 21, 2015 at 10:14 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - April 21, 2015 at 11:22 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Aroura - April 22, 2015 at 12:29 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Cato - April 22, 2015 at 12:43 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by DeistPaladin - April 22, 2015 at 11:50 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 22, 2015 at 1:51 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by DeistPaladin - April 22, 2015 at 2:05 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by c172 - April 22, 2015 at 12:39 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 22, 2015 at 8:19 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by No_God - April 22, 2015 at 11:51 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Polaris - April 22, 2015 at 8:01 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 23, 2015 at 9:54 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by DeistPaladin - April 23, 2015 at 10:27 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 23, 2015 at 11:35 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by AFTT47 - April 30, 2015 at 1:14 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Whateverist - April 22, 2015 at 8:10 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - April 22, 2015 at 8:43 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 22, 2015 at 9:50 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 22, 2015 at 8:24 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by DeistPaladin - April 22, 2015 at 8:30 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 22, 2015 at 10:48 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Polaris - April 22, 2015 at 8:33 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 22, 2015 at 8:43 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by DeistPaladin - April 22, 2015 at 10:11 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Polaris - April 22, 2015 at 10:22 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by henryp - April 30, 2015 at 10:12 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 30, 2015 at 6:10 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by CapnAwesome - April 28, 2015 at 10:48 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - April 30, 2015 at 9:46 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by c172 - April 30, 2015 at 11:13 am
RE: 2016 Elections - by henryp - April 30, 2015 at 12:12 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by c172 - April 30, 2015 at 12:15 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 30, 2015 at 12:48 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 30, 2015 at 1:36 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by DeistPaladin - April 30, 2015 at 2:00 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - April 30, 2015 at 6:48 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 30, 2015 at 6:51 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Mudhammam - April 30, 2015 at 6:54 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - April 30, 2015 at 7:05 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Saxmoof - May 1, 2015 at 7:28 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by AFTT47 - May 1, 2015 at 7:48 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by c172 - May 1, 2015 at 8:20 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by AFTT47 - May 1, 2015 at 8:30 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Minimalist - May 1, 2015 at 8:39 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - May 1, 2015 at 9:09 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by henryp - May 2, 2015 at 12:00 pm
RE: 2016 Elections - by Hatshepsut - May 2, 2015 at 2:33 pm

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  It's obvious the MSM Media hasn't learned it's lesson from 2016 GODZILLA 11 1326 June 21, 2019 at 9:03 am
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Stop Re litigating 2016 liberals /OP ED. Brian37 66 7753 February 21, 2019 at 7:59 am
Last Post: DLJ
  State level elections in BAvaria yield ground breaking results Deesse23 0 406 October 15, 2018 at 3:50 am
Last Post: Deesse23
  Lets get rid of primary elections when electing our president GODZILLA 79 11757 July 2, 2018 at 7:46 pm
Last Post: Clueless Morgan
  The 2018 mid-term US elections. Jehanne 18 5053 October 7, 2017 at 7:50 pm
Last Post: vorlon13
  Are elections always as nasty as this last one we had NuclearEnergy 14 4226 January 21, 2017 at 8:53 am
Last Post: downbeatplumb
  Hilary wanted to rig the Palestian elections ReptilianPeon 55 10691 December 22, 2016 at 8:21 pm
Last Post: ReptilianPeon
  Leftists tearings 2016 Cobainism 62 10262 November 29, 2016 at 10:26 pm
Last Post: Aegon
  2016 vote recount? Silver 34 5086 November 29, 2016 at 4:17 pm
Last Post: Napoléon
  6 million fewer Democrats voted in 2016... Jehanne 51 9925 November 16, 2016 at 12:13 am
Last Post: Cecelia



Users browsing this thread: 5 Guest(s)