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RE: Is the "Lord's Prayer" Christian, and other concerns
January 12, 2012 at 4:29 pm
(This post was last modified: January 12, 2012 at 4:39 pm by Faith No More.)
Are they actually trying to argue that a prayer whose origin is the NT is not a Christian one? Have they no shame?
Even if the open windows of science at first make us shiver after the cozy indoor warmth of traditional humanizing myths, in the end the fresh air brings vigor, and the great spaces have a splendor of their own - Bertrand Russell
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RE: Is the "Lord's Prayer" Christian, and other concerns
January 12, 2012 at 5:52 pm
No, apparently not.
But try reciting a Muslim prayer and see how well that goes over with the council members. "Hey, it's not a Muslim prayer, Allah is just the Arabic word for God."
Christian apologetics is the art of rolling a dog turd in sugar and selling it as a donut.
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RE: Is the "Lord's Prayer" Christian, and other concerns
January 12, 2012 at 6:10 pm
(January 12, 2012 at 5:52 pm)Doubting Thomas Wrote: No, apparently not.
But try reciting a Muslim prayer and see how well that goes over with the council members. "Hey, it's not a Muslim prayer, Allah is just the Arabic word for God."
That's not a bad idea, really. Bring in a bunch of Hare Krishnas, some pagans, and various and sundry other folk so they can have their say too. May not result in anything positive happening, but it would be entertaining to watch.
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RE: Is the "Lord's Prayer" Christian, and other concerns
January 12, 2012 at 7:01 pm
(This post was last modified: January 12, 2012 at 7:04 pm by Oldandeasilyconfused.)
Quote:"Our Father" prayer is not Christian? What a bunch of bullshit.
Actually--- 'Our Father" is a very Jewish prayer. None of the basic tenets of Jesus' basic teachings are antithetical to Judaism. How could they be? He was above all a Jew who founded a purely Jewish sect.
Having a Jewish prayer is probably no more acceptable under the US constitution.
Quote:Prayer ''Our Father'' is the Jewish prayer. Let us read it as well as the parallel verses of TaNaKh (the Old Testament) and Sidur (the Jewish prayer-book).
Matt 6:9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.
Matt 6:10 Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as [it is] in heaven.
Psalms 145:10 All thy works shall praise thee, O LORD; and thy saints shall bless thee.
Psalms 145:11 They shall speak of the glory of thy kingdom, and talk of thy power;
Psalms 145:12 To make known to the sons of men his mighty acts, and the glorious majesty of his kingdom.
Isaiah 53:10 Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put [him] to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see [his] seed, he shall prolong [his] days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.
''Glorified and sanctified be His great name in the world which He has created according to His will. May He establish His kingdom in your lifetime...'' (Kaddish)
''You are holy and Your name is holy, and your holy ones praise You every day. Blessed are You, O Lord, holy God.'' (Amidah, blessing three)
Matt 6:11 Give us this day our daily bread.
''Bless for us, Adonai our God, this year and its crops. Grant us a blessing on the earth. Satisfy us from Thy bounty and bless our year like other good years. Blessed are You, O Lord, Who blesses the years.'' (Amidah, blessing nine)
Matt 6:12 And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.
Psalms 79:9 Help us, O God of our salvation, for the glory of thy name: and deliver us, and purge away our sins, for thy name's sake.
"Forgive us, our Father, for we have sinned; pardon us, our King, for we have transgressed; for You pardon and forgive. Blessed are You, O Lord, gracious One who abundantly forgives. (Amidah, blessing six).
Matt 6:13 And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil...
Psalms 7:1 O LORD my God, in thee do I put my trust: save me from all them that persecute me, and deliver me:
Psalms 25:20 O keep my soul, and deliver me: let me not be ashamed; for I put my trust in thee.
Matt 6:13 ... For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.
1Chr 29:11 Thine, O LORD, [is] the greatness, and the power, and the glory, and the victory, and the majesty: for all [that is] in the heaven and in the earth [is thine]; thine [is] the kingdom, O LORD, and thou art exalted as head above all.
Psalms 145:13 Thy kingdom [is] an everlasting kingdom, and thy dominion [endureth] throughout all generations.
http://messianicministry.info/prayer.htm
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RE: Is the "Lord's Prayer" Christian, and other concerns
January 12, 2012 at 7:02 pm
(This post was last modified: January 12, 2012 at 7:03 pm by Doubting Thomas.)
Remember when Congress invited a Hindu, I think it was, to give a Hindu prayer before a session of Congress? There were a bunch of people thrown out for protesting or yelling out that it was blasphemy or some such. There's no doubt in my mind that most Christians believe in freedom of religion... as long as it's Christianity.
Christian apologetics is the art of rolling a dog turd in sugar and selling it as a donut.
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RE: Is the "Lord's Prayer" Christian, and other concerns
January 12, 2012 at 10:01 pm
(This post was last modified: January 12, 2012 at 10:04 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Indeed, because for some hilarious reason they're all certain that they agree with each other...and wouldn't do terrible things to their own if given the ability...... Us vs Them bullshit.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Is the "Lord's Prayer" Christian, and other concerns
January 12, 2012 at 10:16 pm
Quote:Have they no shame?
None.
Nor brains.
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RE: Is the "Lord's Prayer" Christian, and other concerns
January 12, 2012 at 11:39 pm
(January 12, 2012 at 7:02 pm)Doubting Thomas Wrote: Remember when Congress invited a Hindu, I think it was, to give a Hindu prayer before a session of Congress? There were a bunch of people thrown out for protesting or yelling out that it was blasphemy or some such. There's no doubt in my mind that most Christians believe in freedom of religion... as long as it's Christianity.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sq3ElGdC2fU
You mean this one?
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RE: Is the "Lord's Prayer" Christian, and other concerns
January 13, 2012 at 9:21 am
(January 12, 2012 at 11:39 pm)reverendjeremiah Wrote: (January 12, 2012 at 7:02 pm)Doubting Thomas Wrote: Remember when Congress invited a Hindu, I think it was, to give a Hindu prayer before a session of Congress? There were a bunch of people thrown out for protesting or yelling out that it was blasphemy or some such. There's no doubt in my mind that most Christians believe in freedom of religion... as long as it's Christianity.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sq3ElGdC2fU
You mean this one?
OMG. That was HORRIBLE. I never saw that. What a disgrace. That was just disgusting. I was tearing up and about to cry for that guy (ok, yes i'm a chic). 
I agree that Christians want religious freedom as long as it's Christianity. What hypocrites.
Our public school district here actually says the Lord's Prayer at PTO meetings. We were shocked the first time we heard it.
"Shannon said the language of the Lord's Prayer is tolerable and contains language that fits with widely held beliefs of people of other faiths."
Tolerable? To who? Christians? Again, how does any religion or faith belong in a government meeting? I think the debate should not be over if the Lord's Prayer is only for Christianity but that no religion has a place in a government meeting. There is no logical purpose for a prayer of any sort at a government function. But, since we are "one nation under God, " the praying will never go away.
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RE: Is the "Lord's Prayer" Christian, and other concerns
January 13, 2012 at 11:40 am
(This post was last modified: January 13, 2012 at 11:41 am by Doubting Thomas.)
Of course they had to shout him down. Jesus is not only an American, but a Republican, and he wouldn't allow this to happen in his congress.
The funny thing is that those Christians shouting down the Hindu chaplain understand how we atheists feel whenever Congress is opened with a Christian prayer.
(January 13, 2012 at 9:21 am)Heather Wrote: I think the debate should not be over if the Lord's Prayer is only for Christianity but that no religion has a place in a government meeting. There is no logical purpose for a prayer of any sort at a government function. But, since we are "one nation under God, " the praying will never go away.
I couldn't agree more with you. This is what I've been saying all along. The First Amendment says that NO establishment of religion will take place, not that it's OK as long as it's a general non-denominational prayer that most people can agree on. If we had a sensible Supreme Court, there would be no "under God" in the pledge, no "In God We Trust" on our money, and no prayers opening government meetings or sessions of Congress.
Christian apologetics is the art of rolling a dog turd in sugar and selling it as a donut.
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