Nationalism and secularism

[Creed of Heresy]

One problem, Mehmet: Your country has no natural resources that will carry it forward towards being the greatest of all nations. Greatness of a nation can be considered subjective, but in truth, it's not. It's measured by the power it wields in the world. People hate to admit it but America is the "greatest" nation in the world because it is the hub of the world's commerce, it is the base of the world's most powerful military force, and it is the bastion of the largest output of culture. Regardless of whether or not you call the culture good or bad, the dominant culture, the most pervasive one, is the "greatest."

Am I saying Turkey is NOT a great nation? Hell no, far from it. It has attracted a large swath of investment and its economy is on the rise. Its development is great. But in comparison to nations such as China, Japan, Morocco, Norway, it is not rising nearly as fast. It doesn't even register as a blip on the technological innovations or scientific innovations scales which are the largest driving influences behind civilization [and likely soon to be the largest driving influence behind bio-engineered crops and energy in the global market] where the US still to this day reigns supreme despite our ultraconservative population fighting tooth and nail to hinder that.

Striving towards that goal? Noble. Claiming to know you will succeed because of a platitude-like prophecy? Quaint...and naive. You are pretty much saying you will succeed because someone said that heritage is all you need. Yeah, that's some REAL modern-thinking. Your heritage and OUTSIDE INVESTMENT. Turkey's strength will not come exclusively from within. It will come from without. It already is.

Globalization. Get used to the idea of it.

[kılıç_mehmet]

One problem, Mehmet: Your country has no natural resources that will carry it forward towards being the greatest of all nations.

There you are wrong. The Lands of Turan are rich in natural resources, and rich in soil. What we need is a better industry. Greatness is not measured in how much gold or oil there is under your earth. Are the arabs, who are so rich in oil, great? With their over 300 million numbers, they still are humbled by the 5 million jews in Israel?
How about the Russians? With their great resources in Siberia, they make the people of St. Petersburg and Moscow rich as Kharun, while their workers live under poverty, and their daughters resort to prostitution in other countries, with substentially ress resources.

People hate to admit it but America is the "greatest" nation in the world because it is the hub of the world's commerce

Yes, it is true that the US is the current hub of the world's commerce, but history shows that such countries who held most of the world's trade in their hands, like the Phoenicans of the old, great Carthage, and once the capital of the world, Rome and Byzantium, are now nothing in comparison with Wall Street.
What now makes the US the trade hub of the world is also your greatest enemy. It takes it's toll on your citizens.
How is a nation "great" if the wealth is not used in turn to enrich the peoples of that nation? And from what I hear in this forum, it is not.
Yes?

it is the base of the world's most powerful military force

It is. Just like we were once.
And you are a rather new power. We have held this title for more than two centuries.
Entire nations quaked under our soldier's boots.
Now what has turned us into nothing more than a regional power, is the same reason the great empire of Chingiss has collapsed.
We take heed of the wrongs of the past, as we have been through so many roads, that we have known practically each and every ideology that has passed humanity. We know which suits us the best, we know that we have a great military and trade history, and Turkistan is wealthy in natural resources, and if not for Russia, extending it's cold grip into the riches of our lands.
We have everything that we need to surpass America. We only need to re-unite, and work hard.

and it is the bastion of the largest output of culture.

Yes, you sure do produce a lot of movies, comic books, video games, and popular music.
So do we. So do the Germans. The difference is in how you market these items around the world.
We don't. We couldn't, even if we want to. Because these are specific to us, friend. Whereas America's cultural output seems to be somewhat akin to the cultural output of the multi-ethnic empires of the old-Alexander's empire, Roman empire, they all brought their culture where they went to.
The US is now going through it's prime times. But it has a number of great weaknesses, that the other multiethnic empires also showed.

Am I saying Turkey is NOT a great nation? Hell no, far from it.

Turkey might be a great country, a regional power, but Turks are a nation that features people from the Balkans to China proper. This is our nation.

Hell no, far from it. It has attracted a large swath of investment and its economy is on the rise

This is a false rise. You cannot rise with foreign investment. You can only become more and more dependent on it.

Its development is great.

Say mashallah, friend.

But in comparison to nations such as China,

China is a nation of slaves, friend. The rest of the world treats China as little more than what it is. They use China and it's people as cheap slave labour. Do you really think that China can go any further with this large population of Slaves? How far have the Chinese gone throughout their History? The Germans have crossed the Russian steppes to make a home for themselves in Europe. They have used longboats to reach America, and created the first colonies on that continent.
Turks have traversed the Asian continent, created innumerable states, and still are spread over a large area. The Chinese are a stagnant people. They will not advance any further than they already have with foreign investment.

Japan, Morocco, Norway, it is not rising nearly as fast.

These are all single countries. Norway and other Scandis have very low populations. How much does their voice really ring amongst the international scene? Not much, I'd reckon.
They are best left alone to themselves, they'll still live in peace and prosperity, hopefully.
Japan, too, is a great nation. As a matter of fact, I view them as the greatest of our rivals, even though I'd rather see them as allies in the future, or even brethren.

We Turks can surpass these nations, if we could work intelligently and passionately towards a common goal. Each and every time we had done that, as history shows, we have brought forth great nations.
We shall do so once again.

It doesn't even register as a blip on the technological innovations or scientific innovations scales which are the largest driving influences behind civilization

Sadly, the US-loving governments of the past have stagnated our advancement in the technological fields, with our best scientists going abroads to seek work elsewhere. They had said, "Why would we need a national car? We can buy it from the westerners anyways! Let us concentrate our efforts on growing wheat and sugar beet!" or, "The government is producing planes? For what we need that for? Close down the factories, let us grow wheat and sugar beet."
This treasonous behaviour has led us to leave behind technology, and become a nation that supplies other nations with whatever food they need.
And now, we can't even do that, as our agriculture is under attack by powers unknown, but they act through our government, once again.
We need a firm, nationalist government, unafraid of taking action, unafraid of telling others to leave us alone.

where the US still to this day reigns supreme despite our ultraconservative population fighting tooth and nail to hinder that.

The US reigns supreme due to the large number of people it attracts from other countries.
It drains the most gifted individuals from the rest of the world.

Our purpose is to keep our gifted in our own lands, to work for our cause, instead of working for the cause of the foreigner.

Striving towards that goal? Noble. Claiming to know you will succeed because of a platitude-like prophecy?

If I knew that the goal is impossible, I certainly would aim for a lower goal.
But I know it's not impossible, not even near impossible. Keeping your goals low will only produce laziness, laxity and things like our former governments have told us. How can we ever think of producing our own cars, tanks and planes? We shouldn't even try. We should continue to be dependent on others.

This is the way a slave thinks. And even the slave thinks of one day, overthrowing his oppressor, and strangle him with the same chain his master sought to enslave him with.

You are pretty much saying you will succeed because someone said that heritage is all you need.

The power we need is within our blood. Our heritage. Our history.
This is what will enable us to try to be worthy of this blood, heritage and history. It will be the incentive that drives us toward greater deeds.

If we had no knowledge of our prior archivements, no knowledge of what we are, no knowledge of what we great deeds we have brought forth in the road to our red apple(ideal) would we be any different from the black slaves that you have brought to work in your fields? Malcolm X was a great pioneer of instilling some pride, even if it was artificial, in the black people that your founders have used as their slaves, and destroyed their culture, language and ethnicity in order to force them into the slave mentality. That he has nowhere to go, but to serve his master.

The one who has ethnic pride, a national consciousness, will always strive to the road of freedom for his people.

Your heritage and OUTSIDE INVESTMENT. Turkey's strength will not come exclusively from within. It will come from without. It already is.

Globalization. Get used to the idea of it.

More like Global slavery. I am getting already used to the idea, and more and more I dislike it. Have your investments. They are all nothing more than instruments of slavery that you so oppose in America, but when it comes to nations outside of your own, you suddenly are very protective about them, telling me to get used to their violent oppression.
They come in forms of privatisations, acquisitions, bribes, usury, outsourcing and monopolies. To fool our people, they feed us the garbage they call *culture* and luxury items. The bring about moral and social collapse, as to numb our minds with their media.
Our heritage dictates that we create our own wealth. Our heritage dictates that we become independent. Our heritage dictates that we should be free of economic oppression. Our heritage dictates that we should shun the cultural imperialism of the foreign. Our heritage dictates that we should shun and destroy everything that tries to destroy our good customs.
This is what our heritage dictates. Call it what you will.
Saying that we can't do it, would be to overlook the archivements of the people who founded this country. People told them, "The allies will never accept your claims of an independent Turkey.". But they said, "Freedom(Turan) or death(anything else. Death is certainly more acceptable in comparison)." This is my motto. The heritage of great Turks of the past shows us the way. We are just too blind to follow it.

[The Grand Nudger]

The path to success and power is that of insular ethnic "purity", isolationism, and idle threats from a puppet army? Good luck with that. Think it's been tried before, but what the hell, maybe it'll work this time.

[kılıç_mehmet]

The path to success and power is that of insular ethnic "purity", isolationism, and idle threats from a puppet army? Good luck with that. Think it's been tried before, but what the hell, maybe it'll work this time.

Once again, you distort my words.
Did I say that I tell my people to isolate themselves from the world?
We see how well the isolationists have fared throughout history. The Soviets collapsed. North Korea is a shithole. Even China, communist on paper, is not isolating itself from the world.

Neither will we. But we will defend ourselves against attacks of any form.
Besides, whose army are you calling a puppet?
I'd say that your army is the puppet here, as it is too keen to follow with a war each time your corporations need to secure some profit, while the losses are in human lives.
Your army, which leads the NATO, is puppeteered by corporate war criminals. Isn't this what you've been telling all along in this forum?
How does it come that you accuse our armed forces with being a puppet, while it is you who are the real warmongers?

Besides, we know what has been tried before. Some amongst our former emperors sought to create a US like social system. It failed. Communism, has failed.
Our ideology has never been put to use due to circumstances regarding the freedom of our peoples. Now, the majority of Turks are free, with their own countries. It is time to put Turan to the test.

[The Grand Nudger]

The formation of a fascist nation along purely ethnic lines will put you in the unfortunate position of being political pariahs Mehmet, you can't be so naive as to not realize this. Turkey has absolutely nothing to bargain with to alleviate the pressure this would cause. It would be self imposed (though perhaps unintentional) isolationism. Your army (like your country) is heavily dependent upon the U.S. You would require yet more weapons and investment in setting up this nation of yours, and as it seems that military power is of the utmost importance to you this would mean that somebody (and you could always source another supplier, since you seem to think the U.S. is the great white fucking satan, lol) would end up owning you. You would be unbelievably indebted to whomever provides you with the means to accomplish this self defeating goal. Again, due to the nature of the state that you're proposing, it's likely that we wouldn't be feeding you the cash and weapons you need. That would decrease your bargaining power even further, so not only would you be indebted for these things, you'd be getting raked over the coals for them, just because whatever supplier you go with could set their price to whatever they liked. Now, you keep beating your chest about nations trembling under some turkish army, this is a fairy tale Mehm. Your nation doesn't even register as a blip on the scale of military powers. Your only claim to fame are the nuclear weapons -that we gave you-. Fortunately, we had the foresight to deny you the types of delivery systems that would make this a credible threat to an actual superpower (maybe somebody saw you coming Mehm?).

As I've said, it's been tried, but you're welcome to give it another go. But what the hell, heading down a road that would do little but weaken your nation and people couldn't possibly go wrong. It's not like there are people eyeing your lands, right? People who might immediately find themselves the beneficiaries of legitimate superpowers, people who would then easily court the UN and provide the impetus for sanctions against your brand new state, people who would ultimately end up with a state all their own, rising from the ashes of your failed ethnic holy war?

[kılıç_mehmet]

The formation of a fascist nation along purely ethnic lines

The nation will be a Turkist state. Besides, on which lines do you propose we form this nation?
Along you lines?
No thanks. Besides, our current nation was also formed along purely ethnic lines. That's why it's name is Turkey, I mind you. Same goes for the rest of the nation states around the earth.

unfortunate position of being political pariahs Mehmet,

We're already political pariahs. This is why our movement comes from the people, not from the politicians.

, you can't be so naive as to not realize this.

I'm not. Besides, the formation of a pan-turkic state will provide peace and stability for all. I'm sure that we could all use a little bit of stability in international affairs.

Turkey has absolutely nothing to bargain with to alleviate the pressure this would cause.

All alone, perhaps. But if all Turkic nations come together for this cause...anyone who would pressure us into doing something else could only be the worst of tyrants. And we'll stand up to that one too.
And why should we bargain anything for anything that is our birthright?
Nothing in this world is archived by bargain.

It would be self imposed (though perhaps unintentional) isolationism.

Why would we need to isolate ourselves? The rest of the world would isolate itself from us. And should this deter us from doing what we want?
Do we have to bow to the wishes of foreigners?
This, again, is the mentality of the slave, friend. Forgive us for this once, that we do not wish to be your slaves.
But if you want to bring us to our knees by isolation...Be our guest. We've faced worse.

. Your army (like your country) is heavily dependent upon the U.S. You would require yet more weapons and investment in setting up this nation of yours,

It is dependent for now. As long as we're in the NATO, we will be dependent on foreign contractors for weapons. Once we quit the NATO, we shall be free to develop our own weaponry. We do not need your investments. Such investments never brought anything into our country.
For now, Turkey is on a privatisation streak.
What kind of benefits did this have for the common man? Nothing. In fact, it resulted in jobs being lost. Furthermore, it resulted in a piece of ourselves going to the hands of the foreign. It's profits will serve those abroad, not us. Our only gain is by means of taxes(they do not aid in the creation of more jobs). And currently, these taxes are kept very low in order to lure more investors.

You cannot imagine how many dirty money runs this business. Bribes, acquisitions. The new companies that come into the play almost instantly form a monopoly, and charge prices at will.
If we would stop this foreign investment, or keep it to a minimum, or at least, illegalize privatisations of vital social and economical institutions that belong to the government, we would be in a much better state.

and as it seems that military power is of the utmost importance to you this would mean that somebody (and you could always source another supplier, since you seem to think the U.S. is the great white fucking satan, lol) would end up owning you.

It already has, since you're asking. Our purpose remains the same. I'm not saying that we will not purchase something of which we have not a native counterpart, but we will try to be self-sufficient in everything we have, or at least bring forward something that will make the dependency mutual.
This is our goal. But first, we need to stop the selling what our people have created with the blood they shed in our war for independence, and quit the NATO, an unnecessary partnership, which is of no real use to us anymore.

You would be unbelievably indebted to whomever provides you with the means to accomplish this self defeating goal.

Any goal besides Turan is automatically self defeating for us.
We've tried this so-called liberal democracy of yours. We've tried capitalism. We saw how communism is a repressive failure.
Now we're going to try something that holds our people dear to the heart, not money.

Our debts are already as high as they are. Paying them off with selling off our national resources will bring us nowhere else.

Again, due to the nature of the state that you're proposing, it's likely that we wouldn't be feeding you the cash and weapons you need.

Whatever we will do, we will do with our own blood and sweat, friend.
We have won our war of independence, without your help. We can create Turan without your help.
We will do this once we have archived a sufficient degree of self-sufficiency to survive the potential international embargo that you claim will happen if we try to unite.

That would decrease your bargaining power even further, so not only would you be indebted for these things, you'd be getting raked over the coals for them, just because whatever supplier you go with could set their price to whatever they liked.

Are you suggesting that they don't do this as we speak?
They have already done these, friend, you just think that we haven't gone through these before.
We've gone through these because we thought that we could never think of being self-sufficient. We thought of us as nothing more than a nation of peasants. It is time we transcend the notions of what people tell us what we can do, and start going down the trail the founders of this country have gone through. To do what we want to do.

Now, you keep beating your chest about nations trembling under some turkish army, this is a fairy tale Mehm.

Is it a fairy tale that the European nations mobilized crusader armies and fleets to combat the army of a single, determined nation of Turks-the Ottoman empire and the Great Seljuks? Is it a fairy tale that the combined, desperate efforts of the Goths and the once mighty Roman empire has only hindered the Hunnic advance at the Battle of Chalons? Is it a fairy tale, that the grand might of the Göktürk empire was destroyed by the political games of the Chinese?
It certainly is no fairy tale, friend. These are all historically documented things.

Your nation doesn't even register as a blip on the scale of military powers

Sure. And therefore, you haven't still kicked us out of Anatolia. You could bring other folks that could do your bidding for less than a dime.
Greeks, Armenians, Kurds..Slave nations, the lot. They will be happy to take over the country if you'd be so courteous to drive us back to where we came from. Your kind has tried to do this in the aftermath of WWI...And failed. Let's see you try once again, if you think that our army is a joke. Seeing how the arab and the tajik are dropping your soldiers like flies in Iraq and Afghanistan makes me think that it is you who are the greatest of jokes when it comes to the art of war.
We're a nation of warriors. A single determined Turkish soldier is worth ten of your well equipped, but weak spirited, weak minded lot, driven by their corporate masters.

Your only claim to fame are the nuclear weapons -that we gave you-.

We do not lay claim to nuclear weapons. The nukes that are in the American base of İncirlik are the property of the US, or the NATO.
Not ours. After we quit the NATO, we'll return your murderous weapons of mass destruction to you, along with your soldiers and your equipment in those bases. No foreign soldier shall have it's bases at will on our soil anymore!

Fortunately, we had the foresight to deny you the types of delivery systems that would make this a credible threat to an actual superpower (maybe somebody saw you coming Mehm?).

No, I already know that you would sell us nothing that could be of any use against any real threat from the outside. You, being the first on the list. We shall crack whatever codes for the toys of war we have bought from you, and receive what we have payed for. Not something that you also have power over. But then, we shall create our own instruments of war for our defense.

As I've said, it's been tried, but you're welcome to give it another go.

And it was successful. We have achived independence in the early days of our republic. A plane factory was founded in Turkey. We were also on the verge of creating our own car, but again, capitalist agenda proved to be victorious.
On the other hand, these people have called us, who hailed the new car, falsely "communists", while we strongly opposed the Soviet Union. They, however, were the lapdogs of the US.

. It's not like there are people eyeing your lands, right?

There are. Russians, for example. The US is eyeing everyone's lands. China is occupying our lands. Besides that, there are those who hope for assistance from the likes of you in stripping portions of our lands to their own countries, as they did during WWI, and were instead, handed their asses over them by Turkish forces.

People who might immediately find themselves the beneficiaries of legitimate superpowers, people who would then easily court the UN and provide the impetus for sanctions against your brand new state, people who would ultimately end up with a state all their own, rising from the ashes of your failed ethnic holy war?

I doubt that they will have the will to voice these things once we have formed Turan.
But I can see from the way you voice things, the world does not want us to unite. Why would the world oppose the unification of a people that you brand as "barely a blip" on the radar?
Why do you oppose our unification?
Why do the minorities and mixed bloods oppose our unification?
It's simple: They know that our unification will bring about our golden age. A golden age that was never seen before. They know that their own dreams will see their end. They know that they will not easily push others around any more. If we manage to unite, soon, the world will probably see a real arab union too. Then you'd be screwed, friend. You'd be screwed. We Turks do not hate anyone. We just want to be left alone. The arabs are vicious dogs. I suggest you prepare yourself for the worst doomsday scenario. While you are busy chewing on eachother's flesh, we shall look down and laugh.

---

The flags of Turanic nations in the yearly Kurultai poster in Hungary.
It might strike you as weird, but the same Hungarians we had battled so fiercely during the days of the Ottoman empire are now hosting the biggest Turanic gathering in the world, from each and every of the peoples of Turan attending to this grand assembly.

An map featuring the Turkic peoples around Eurasia, and their flags. The dark blue regions are sovereign states, the light blue are Turks who live under the sovereignity of other nations, some with a degree of autonomy, like Tatars and Sakha.

This only needs a spark, a small spark. The spark has not been lighted in Turkey, but in Hungary. We have a political party in Hungary, that pushes for a Pan-Turanic alliance in Hungary. It's votes are slowly but steadily rising amongst the Magyars(Hungarians) of the country.
It makes me proud to see, that even though we believe in different religions, Turks and Magyars can still feel brotherly bonds that stem from our kinship through Attila's legacy.

The Hunnic ancestors of the Magyars, at the battle of Chalons. The artist depicts a host of crows following our lines, to feast upon the enemies we have cut down as we ravaged Europe for the first time.
After the Huns, our advance was unstoppable.

[The Grand Nudger]

LOL, "Rahowa!"

Like I said, I don't have to troll you.... Your nose and your tail are going in so many opposite directions in that post I can't help but wonder if you've gotten dizzy. Probably don't even notice it do you? That's the effect of fascist, ethnocentric propaganda on a receptive mind. Victors and victims, great but laid low, powerful but easily oppressed. Your enemies; mighty tyrants, but weak willed and incompetent, their influence vast and pervasive but ineffectual.

Delusion writ large and codified into a political movement.

(I get so sick of hearing you blather on about warriors by the way...civilian)

[kılıç_mehmet]

Victors and victims, great but laid low, powerful but easily oppressed.

You are the victim when you allow yourself to be the victim, and you are the victor if you fight for victory. You are oppressed if you play the game by the rules of the oppressor, powerful if you make up the rules yourself.

Your nose and your tail are going in so many opposite directions in that post I can't help but wonder if you've gotten dizzy.

My nose and tail are in the same direction. I don't know what made you think that I have any inconsistencies in my words, point them out one by one, if you can find one.

That's the effect of fascist, ethnocentric propaganda on a receptive mind.

Oh sure, friend. You start spouting the generic antifa slogans, that I'm the result of a propaganda. My views are not the result of any political party, or are not in the same lines with the official state ideology. I formed my views from the writings of famed nationalist writers, all dead by now, some, who were imprisoned and tortured by authorities who professed a similar, anti-ethnocentric view, speaking through your words. As I said. My faith in these ideals are not weakened by your posts, they are only strengthened, as I see more and more the same people, shouting the same things towards me.

Your enemies; mighty tyrants, but weak willed and incompetent, their influence vast and pervasive but ineffectual.

The mighty tyrant are the same tyrants that you talk about here the whole time. Are you now telling me that these mighty tyrants are not tyrants at all? Or that your troops are nothing more than paid mercenaries who die in your pointless wars?
Your own people are incompetent, that you have said countless times in these forums. There is not a single inconsistency within my posts, and whatever you're shouting the whole time in the politics section of this forum.
You brought forward points, and I answered them. If you think there are untruths in what I've said, voice them. You're playing a comedia here, friend, and I laugh at your simpleton mind, with such simple views, you think of everyone to be as simple as you.

Delusion writ large and codified into a political movement

You cannot even reply to my posts one by one, to show me exactly where I am conflicting myself, or show whatever fallacy, or delusion you find in my posts. I think that you are not really a debater that I should be replying to. If I explain my views in a post in full, I expect to receive feedback in a similar way. You simply come in, tell me this and that in a short paragraph and leave. Now you will talk of your supposed victory over me. I have time, friend. I am explaining these to you for the Xth time now. You still haven't given me a reasonable answer that could turn my views around. And now, you will probably get into that I was heavily indocrinated by the state and my family. My views are very, very different from what the state, or my family holds.
Your replies are the same, simple replies, that hold no real value, but I simply keep writing to wipe that ignorance off of your mind.
but I guess this self-righteousness that you hold in your mind, labeling everything as the fascist, and your own as the saviors of humanity, leads me to believe that you are wrapped in a sack of illusions of your own.
I bear no illusions. I only bear truths, and that truth is, if we Turks wish to survive this harsh world, and thrive, we must stick together. But this too, is probably delusional to you. You hold the view, that we are irrelevant. If so, why really oppose our unification? Because it's "ethnocentric"? What else would you expect? A single world state? But that's what you maniacs dream about every day, isn't it. Humanity re-united. Yeah. I've already explained that none of your nonsense ever worked, and will ever work. Use the words nationalist and ethnocentrist as an insult as much as you will, I'd still take pride if you'd openly call me a racist, friend.

[The Grand Nudger]

Okay, racist.

On victim and victor. I find this whole line of thought completely absurd. You would have us believe that you are mighty victors when speaking of your great nation, but then constantly appeal to being helpless victims when asked why your great nation doesn't seem to be so great. Similarly, you would have us believe that your turkish blood somehow makes you powerful, but when asked why this power is mysteriously absent you claim that you have been oppressed. Do you often see a very powerful people oppressed? Who would oppress them, and wouldn't they require power at least equal (if not greater) to do so in the first place?

Check the above for my nose and tail comment. I think that all of these wildly disparate statements are rationalizations meant to reenforce your bigotry or excuse your master race for failing, whichever is required in any given situation. They need not be consistent with reality or themselves (and clearly they are not). This isn't exactly new in to the annals of ethnocentrism or bigotry, it's sort of the standard operating procedure.

Watch out, I'm a filthy anti-facist...lock up your kids! You mean to say that you don't have any organization that aligns itself along political lines roughly or exactly mirroring those you have expressed here? Whew, that's a relief, because I was starting to think that a bunch of douchebags were actively plotting to start yet more shit over there. So it's just you, you're going to establish the Nation of Turan? In your backyard or your bunker? Either is fine by me. People have written a great many things, not all of it is worthy of faith or respect Mehm (regardless of whether or not a person is dead, or has been tortured), you don't respect the things that we antifa son's-of-bitches write, do you? Your faith would likely be strengthened by whatever I posted, that's the nature of faith. Do you ever read any of our posts here Mehm?

"My own people" are often incompetent, and yet we are a superpower and you are not. Where does that leave the master-race? You would appeal to the tyranny of others to excuse the tyranny you wish to impose? Not very compelling Mehm. Yes, I do think there are "un-truths" in your posts everytime you start blathering on about your blood and your race and you ethnicity and all of the superiority garbage. I can point them out very easily. They begin when you type the first letter, they end when you hit send. Are we clear? Did you just call me a stupid-head? Really....that's what you've got? Jesus christ now I feel bad for criticizing your little ethnic tirades in the first place. I don't usually pick on people in schoolyards...

I used to reply to your "points" one by one, remember? I've given up. The force is too strong in you. My full feedback on ethnic superiority bullshit -is- that it is bullshit. That's all that is required. You must make your own race into the master-race, I don't have to explain to you why you are not. Get to work. Your views weren't arrived at by reason, and so it is unsurprising that a reasonable answer would not cause you to review them. Of course, a "reasonable answer" would mean exactly what to you from a non-turk? Are we even capable of such things? When have I ever claimed to be or even know of a savior Mehmet, bullshit, absolute bullshit, and I'm probably the worst person to try that particular kind of bullshit on. I label facists facists when they self identify as such in their explanations of their principles. You blather on about how it isn't a turkish word so it doesn't apply. Get over yourself. I hold no such view, I hold that you, specifically those of you who align themselves with bigotry and ethnocentrism are not irrelevant, but ignorant and dangerous (both to yourselves and those around you). History bears out my assessment of this situation very nicely. I oppose the tyranny you would impose upon others under the guise of "unification". What would I expect, I would expect that you would have moved past tribal politics and ridiculous ethnocentric worldviews which are based wholly in ignorance and have caused nothing but suffering and bloodshed since the dawn of time. That's reasonable, isn't it? A single world state? Sounds like a pipe dream. Could be a pleasant one, could be a nightmare. Yes, Mehm, I would love to see us all "re0united" as if we were ever separated to begin with. We have no enemies here but ourselves, it would seem to be a pretty damned smart move to go ahead and do away with that one, what with it being something we should be able to control pretty well. What won;t work, who the fuck do you think I am, and have you ever once asked me my politcal views in all of this time you've been screaming about mutts and pure-bloods? No, you haven't. You've done nothing but tell me about myself and what I believe and why I believe it, and all of this based upon what you think my blood is or isn't, and what you think that means. I've explained this to you already Mehm. This is fairy tale bullshit.

[Creed of Heresy]

I was about to hop back in the pool but damn it the water ain't boiling.

I'll just interject a quick note; if all the Turks came together into a single or unity of Turkic states, it would be powerful indeed.

Same can be said of ANY race, or nationality. If all the citizens in the US unified under a single political party and ideal? ...Well the rest of the world would be kneedeep in shit because then we'd all be easily misled fools, with no dissident voices, sitting on top of the most expensive, advanced, and battle-ready military in the world...not to mention a looot of nuclear weaponry. If you want a fine example of Americans being easily misled and it having grave consequences for both Americans AND the rest of the world, you need only look at the aftermath of September 11th, 2001.

You say America "steals" the best talent from other nations. That would imply taking something not rightfully ours. But the thing is, we are a republic, built on law and founded on a constitution protecting the individual and exhorting him to exercise the freedom of him or herself within a fair, moral boundary [IE, no killing and the like; the rule of law]. You say we steal. We say we liberate. I am sure the North Korean government considers the paltry few who escape to South Korea as property stolen from them by the South and its "western devil allies," as they love to call us. Many Americans, however, mistake the idea of "liberating others." They think it involves bombs and rifles and stealth fighters. It does not. Liberty is an idea. An idea is more than a weapon, more than a man, and so long as it is just and fair, it is bulletproof.

Our government, for the moment, is failing us. But we have the advantage over ancient empires of the past; we live in the age of information. And the American people are long past the point of being merely pissed off. We are undergoing political upheaval, though it's downplayed. New political parties are gaining power, overthrowing the current balance. This new party is crap, of course, but it has done all it needs to do; it's begun to change the political system of there only being two views, two ideas, two opinions.

The greatest minds of today are all men of American, English, German, and Japanese education, in that order. The great feats of engineering are wrought by men not necessarily of these nations but of these nations' education, and for those nations. It is no coincidence that all technological innovations come from these four nations. Gone are the days of numbers meaning everything. A single man with a remote control can bomb an enter company of soldiers into the ground from 5000 miles away without having to do much more than ask his assistant to bring him a coffee. A hundred laborers by hand cannot do the job of a single man with a set of manufacturing equipment.

You say it's in your heritage to rise up and be great by unity. I say the man with the best equipment and brain wins. And the American idea of you doing what you want to do for your own life and purpose has, is, and always will be far more enticing than selection of superiority based on bloodlines. To that end...I am afraid you are chasing a pipe dream.

...Damn it I said I wasn't going to wade into the water and now my nuts are scalded.