God does not follow the first principle of morality. Why not?

[Ryantology]

Drich never addressed the important part of my post.

Why do you not condone rape, slavery, torture, murder and genocide, since these are all acts God is guilty of doing directly or commanding others to do in his name, and if God is good, any act he perpetrates must be good?

Or, do you, in fact, condone these activities?

I'd like a response.

[System of Solace]

And againd I see you left out omni benevolence even though your whole arguement depends on it.. Wonder why that is.

Woops.

Psalms 18:30: "As for God, his way is perfect: the word of the Lord is tried: he is a buckler to all those that trust in him,"

Ps.19:7: "The law of the Lord is good, converting the soul: the testimony of the Lord is sure, making wise the simple."

The Holy, Catholic, Apostolic and Roman Church believes and acknowledges that there is one true and living God, Creator and Lord of Heaven and earth, almighty, eternal, immeasurable, incomprehensible, infinite in will, understanding and every perfection. Since He is one, singular, completely simple and unchangeable spiritual substance, He must be declared to be in reality and in essence, distinct from the world, supremely happy in Himself and from Himself, and inexpressibly loftier than anything besides Himself which either exists or can be imagined.

[Drich]

Again it does not work because The God of the bible does not offer all people the omnibenevolence epiricus' gods appearently did.

So you admit Yahweh is capable of evil and, in fact, employs it. Understood.

Is Omnipotence the only omni aspect of god being repersented in the supposed paradox?

immediately before the other omni aspects are shown...

It's funny how the bible does not use the word you used

It's funny how the exact word used in the bible is at the whim of the translator. Did you miss the 'Lexicon Switcheroo' thread?

and I think it to be odd you do not define the word.

Ever heard of a dictionary?

This is a streach even for a sunday schooler. Before I proceed let me see you say you believe Omniscients to be limited to God having the ablity to simply 'see all things.' That for you the doctrine of Omniscients does not include any other 'all knowing aspects.'

So...god doesn't know everything? Are you saying that there are things god does not know?

And againd I see you left out omni benevolence even though your whole arguement depends on it.. Wonder why that is.

"Then he is malevolent"

It is a shame to see you default to pointless and meaningless jabs, rather than actually putting in an effort to understand. Perhaps you do understand and know you can not honestly defend your position anymore. Eitherway it is disappointing to see you lower the bar on your work.

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Drich never addressed the important part of my post.

Why do you not condone rape, slavery, torture, murder and genocide, since these are all acts God is guilty of doing directly or commanding others to do in his name, and if God is good, any act he perpetrates must be good?

Or, do you, in fact, condone these activities?

I'd like a response.

Gladly.
The acts you have mentioned in of themselves have absolutly no intrinsic 'moral' value. They are bad when/because God says they are bad. As it is now these things are 'bad.'

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Woops.

Psalms 18:30: "As for God, his way is perfect: the word of the Lord is tried: he is a buckler to all those that trust in him,"

Ps.19:7: "The law of the Lord is good, converting the soul: the testimony of the Lord is sure, making wise the simple."

Let me understand this. You believe these verses declare universal omni benevolence for everyone on the planet?

Ah, no, Not even close.. God's love if reserved for God's people. Not all people can consider themselves God's people.

The Holy, Catholic, Apostolic and Roman Church believes and acknowledges that there is one true and living God, Creator and Lord of Heaven and earth, almighty, eternal, immeasurable, incomprehensible, infinite in will, understanding and every perfection. Since He is one, singular, completely simple and unchangeable spiritual substance, He must be declared to be in reality and in essence, distinct from the world, supremely happy in Himself and from Himself, and inexpressibly loftier than anything besides Himself which either exists or can be imagined.

And this means God is omni benevolent how?

[System of Solace]

Gladly.
The acts you have mentioned in of themselves have absolutly no intrinsic 'moral' value. They are bad when/because God says they are bad. As it is now these things are 'bad.'

BULLSHIT! Malachi 3:6
King James Version (KJV)
6 For I am the Lord, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.

It comes down to:
Take every part of the Bible literally and be a complete idiot and outcast from society;
Reject silly beliefs.

And why does God suddenly change his mind? It's because man created God in his image. That's why as we progress, more and more of the bible becomes considered Christian dogma.

Let me understand this. You believe these verses declare universal omni benevolence for everyone on the planet?

Ah, no, Not even close.. God's love if reserved for God's people. Not all people can consider themselves God's people.

We've strayed from the point, honestly. I don't really have to prove he is omnibenevolent, but I can prove he is malevolent when you look at all the suffering in the world. How can you justify this suffering with the "They have chosen not to accept Jesus" when some have never heard that name uttered before?

And this means God is omni benevolent how?

Doesn't. It means the Vatican thinks he is.

[Ryantology]

Gladly.
The acts you have mentioned in of themselves have absolutly no intrinsic 'moral' value. They are bad when/because God says they are bad. As it is now these things are 'bad.'

Where did God ever say it was bad to commit rape, torture, own slaves, or annihilate whole peoples?

[Drich]

BULLSHIT! Malachi 3:6
King James Version (KJV)
6 For I am the Lord, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.

What makes you think that God's position on the list of acts you posted sides with your understanding of them??

If God does not Change, then How is it He can condone these acts in one book/instance and condemn them the next? Unless! The acts themselves have no interinsically moral value at all. They are simply good or bad when God says they are good or bad. Meaning that the only time raping and murdering is bad is when we do it on our own/without a command from God. And are acceptable when He says they are. Again as it is we in this age as Christians nor Jews have any commands to rape murder or anything else on your list. Meaning all instances of the sins you mentioned can be rightfully judged as sin.

And why does God suddenly change his mind? It's because man created God in his image.

Ah no. As I have pointed out many many times in the soceity/times the bible was written it was very counter culture in every aspect. (Do you really need examples and explainations?) "We" believers have always been persecuted for being outside of the culture in what we believe.

That's why as we progress, more and more of the bible becomes considered Christian dogma.

ah, no. not even close. As we progress the 'christian dogma' moves further and further from the bible. Prosperity doctrines, the whole sale justification of sin rather than santification of sin. and the list goes on.

We've strayed from the point, honestly. I don't really have to prove he is omnibenevolent,

Yes you do you if you whole arguement is that God is malevolent. Because if there isn't a biblical promise that God is supposed to love and care for everyone like you thought/think He is supposed to then lableing God malevolent is meaningless. Do you honestly not see that? or Do you believe your own hype, and really think I failed to defend my thread on this topic the first time around? Your precious paradox fails if there is not a declaration of omni benevolence here. Again are you ignorant here or just obstinate?

but I can prove he is malevolent when you look at all the suffering in the world.

So what? God put us in Charge of this realm this world at the fall of Man. If there is suffering it is because We/YOU allow it!

How can you justify this suffering with the "They have chosen not to accept Jesus" when some have never heard that name uttered before?

Seriously? How can you say you hate God if you truly know nothing of Him?

Christians are Called to suffer. Meaning If you are a Christian expect to suffer in this life. If His own Son was not spared suffering from this world then why would we expect not to suffer? Furthermore why would someone who does not know Christ be in a better position to not suffer?

We do not trade worship for a better life. That is what I was talking about earilier when I mentioned a prosperity doctrine, and how Christianity is moving away from the bible.

And this means God is omni benevolent how?

Doesn't. It means the Vatican thinks he is.

[/quote]

So let me make sure I understand your arguement. you quoting that creed, Doesn't really mean God is omni benevolent as it has nothing to do with the bible. It just means that the Vatican believes that God is omni Benevolent... Even though the bible say nothing of the sort. Is that your arguement in a nut shell?

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Where did God ever say it was bad to commit rape,

We are subject to the state. If the state says no rape torture genocide then we must follow those rules.

[Darkstar]

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We've strayed from the point, honestly. I don't really have to prove he is omnibenevolent,

Yes you do you if you whole arguement is that God is malevolent. Because if there isn't a biblical promise that God is supposed to love and care for everyone like you thought/think He is supposed to then lableing God malevolent is meaningless. Do you honestly not see that? or Do you believe your own hype, and really think I failed to defend my thread on this topic the first time around? Your precious paradox fails if there is not a declaration of omni benevolence here. Again are you ignorant here or just obstinate?[/quote]

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So god is malevolent, you just think this is unimportant.

but I can prove he is malevolent when you look at all the suffering in the world.

So what? God put us in Charge of this realm this world at the fall of Man. If there is suffering it is because We/YOU allow it!

So god does not interact with the world in any way? Should be a deist, then. If he does interfere, then we aren't totally in charge of this realm and he doen't have an excuse. Also, define 'allow'. Do we 'allow' cancer to kill children, or natural disasters and other diseases to kill people? Isn't god responsible for diesease (if he created all life on earth)? If so, his non-interference is only via a loophole.

How can you justify this suffering with the "They have chosen not to accept Jesus" when some have never heard that name uttered before?

Seriously? How can you say you hate God if you truly know nothing of Him?

How can you say you love god if you truly know nothing of him?

Christians are Called to suffer.

God is a sadist.

Meaning If you are a Christian expect to suffer in this life.

Because non-christians don't suffer? God must be doing some extra evil for that to have meaning.

If His own Son was not spared suffering from this world then why would we expect not to suffer? Furthermore why would someone who does not know Christ be in a better position to not suffer?

1. God predestined that, it isn't really our fault.
2. Maybe they wouldn't...but that was my above point.

We do not trade worship for a better life. That is what I was talking about earilier when I mentioned a prosperity doctrine, and how Christianity is moving away from the bible.

Good thing too; it's illegal to stone people for working on the sabbath.

So let me make sure I understand your arguement. you quoting that creed, Doesn't really mean God is omni benevolent as it has nothing to do with the bible. It just means that the Vatican believes that God is omni Benevolent... Even though the bible say nothing of the sort. Is that your arguement in a nut shell?

Actually, you are right in saying that god isn't omnibenevolent. A lot of people have that idea, but it isn't mentioned in the bible. People sometimes believe things that aren't in the bible, but it is more common that they don't believe something that is in the bible. Do you think that blaspheming the holy spirit will really earn you a one-way ticket to eternal torture, even if the rest of your life is spent in servitude?
Mark 3:28-29

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Truly I tell you, people can be forgiven all their sins and every slander they utter, 29 but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; they are guilty of an eternal sin.

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[System of Solace]

If God does not Change, then How is it He can condone these acts in one book/instance and condemn them the next? Unless! The acts themselves have no interinsically moral value at all. They are simply good or bad when God says they are good or bad. Meaning that the only time raping and murdering is bad is when we do it on our own/without a command from God. And are acceptable when He says they are. Again as it is we in this age as Christians nor Jews have any commands to rape murder or anything else on your list. Meaning all instances of the sins you mentioned can be rightfully judged as sin.

How were they justified in the past?
And what if these commands have been personal, as so many claim? How do you answer to the hundreds that claim they killed for God?

Ah no. As I have pointed out many many times in the soceity/times the bible was written it was very counter culture in every aspect. (Do you really need examples and explainations?) "We" believers have always been persecuted for being outside of the culture in what we believe.

Yes you do you if you whole arguement is that God is malevolent. Because if there isn't a biblical promise that God is supposed to love and care for everyone like you thought/think He is supposed to then lableing God malevolent is meaningless. Do you honestly not see that? or Do you believe your own hype, and really think I failed to defend my thread on this topic the first time around? Your precious paradox fails if there is not a declaration of omni benevolence here. Again are you ignorant here or just obstinate?

You brought omnibenevolence into this debate. It is not omnibenevolence, but simply benevolence. Do you realize your problem here? If you are right and he is not benevolent (you aren't) then he is simply a total asshole.

So what? God put us in Charge of this realm this world at the fall of Man. If there is suffering it is because We/YOU allow it!

Then he's malevolent, and does not care about the suffering of mankind.
And why did man fall, anyways? Because God isn't a good enough designer?

Seriously? How can you say you hate God if you truly know nothing of Him?

African child dying of AIDS. Probably never heard of Jesus. If you seriously didn't understand what I said.....well, we won't go there.

So let me make sure I understand your arguement. you quoting that creed, Doesn't really mean God is omni benevolent as it has nothing to do with the bible. It just means that the Vatican believes that God is omni Benevolent... Even though the bible say nothing of the sort. Is that your arguement in a nut shell?

No. I'm just saying that the biggest religious power in the world right now thinks differently than you.






By the way

1 John 4:8 "He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love."

[Ryantology]

We are subject to the state. If the state says no rape torture genocide then we must follow those rules.

That is not an answer to the question I asked you.

[IATIA]

And why did man fall, anyways?

Because god threw a raw steak on the floor and said to the dog "Do not eat that".