All Hail the Second Amendment

[popeyespappy]

Oh and no, I've actually got a point about death and injury rates I want to make with Brian concerning this and another subject so discussing them is relevant.

[Minimalist]

Pap, unlike some others around here you have some street cred... but while what you say makes sense the laws...especially in the Gun Nut/Bible Belt are not on your side.

http://www.11alive.com/videos/news/2015/.../74768430/

"There are few laws in place to hold adults responsible. "


Of course.  Adults write the laws!

[Minimalist]

Hmmm....

http://www.heraldextra.com/lifestyles/an...223af.html

2005-2015

Our sweet, loving, son and brother, Connor Evan Gappmayer, returned to the loving arms of his Heavenly Father on Friday, December 4, 2015 due to an accidental shooting.

No.  More likely some fucking idiot probably left a gun laying around where a 10 year old could find it.

[paulpablo]

Rather than start a new thread about the second amendment and gun control I thought it would be better to ask this question here.

Obviously there are mixed opinions about gun control, but what do you think is the ideal solution to the legality issues surrounding guns right now?

Personally I have no strong feelings either way just because I think both sides of the argument have strong points to consider.

Do you think all guns should be illegal to buy or just a certain level of firepower?  

I've noticed people who are against gun ownership tend to also not trust the police either, but then if citizens can't carry guns that just leaves the police you don't trust with guns.  Or you could just slowly disarm everybody so it's a bit like England where generally all police are unarmed except for the armed response units and other exceptions.

But then this might be a problem in America just because of the amount of powerful guns already out there, if the police and law abiding citizens suddenly decided to disarm or use inferior firepower that would leave a lot of the superior firepower in the hands of criminals.

I don't like the idea of guns being legalized in England where I live, but with America's culture I think it might be problematic to suddenly change the legality of guns in a major way. A definite sensible idea I think the vast majority agree with is that gun sales should be more carefully regulated.

[Minimalist]

The first thing to remember is that guns don't kill people.  Bullets kill people.  So, given the power to do so, I would crack down hard on the ammunition supply.  No more online ammo purchases.  Get your fucking ass to a store and fill out paperwork in 10 copies and even then the amount should be limited,  Likewise, reloading supplies should be equally controlled and if you want to make your own gun powder hopefully you'll blow yourself to smithereens in the process.

Second, full training in the use of the weapon and mandatory licensing and proficiency testing.  Further, when not in use the weapon must either be stored, unloaded, in a gun safe, or, be a smart gun which can only be fired by the owner.  I would also have no objection to guns being stored at a police station to be signed out for hunting or some other legitimate purpose.

Third, all gun owners should carry mandatory liability insurance to protect others from their own carelessness.

Fourth, no semi-automatics, automatics, RPGs, mini-guns, anti-tank missiles, artillery, claymore mines or other devices which were not foreseen when the 2d Amendment was written.

[The Grand Nudger]

Pap, unlike some others around here you have some street cred... but while what you say makes sense the laws...especially in the Gun Nut/Bible Belt are not on your side.

http://www.11alive.com/videos/news/2015/.../74768430/

"There are few laws in place to hold adults responsible. "


Of course.  Adults write the laws!

There are plenty of laws in place holding parents (or owners) legally responsible for what their children or other minors may do.  Half of all states have laws explicitly concerning gun owners and child gun accidents (mixed bag, as they can't decide whether to consider it a felony or a misdemeanor).   All states have scores of laws that would be applicable, though not explicit.  I posted about it this recently.  

The problem is not the absence of laws, but the absence of prosecutors willing to pursue them.   That's why we have this strange perception of lawlessness. We don't have this problem when a teen takes his dads keys and goes on a joyride. There's no question in your mind that you are going to be liable. Shouldn't be any question regarding guns either.

[The Grand Nudger]

Obviously there are mixed opinions about gun control, but what do you think is the ideal solution to the legality issues surrounding guns right now?

Enforce existing law to it's fullest, close counter purpose loopholes.

Do you think all guns should be illegal to buy or just a certain level of firepower?  

I think that the way our current system is set up is pretty solid.  You could really dumb it down in description with three tiers.  The first is banned, largely current military grade.  The second is heavily restricted, this is where -actual- assualt rifles and other legacy military equipment live.  The third is moderately to minutely restricted, this would be bb guns on up to high capacity mag semi automatic rifles.  

I've noticed people who are against gun ownership tend to also not trust the police either, but then if citizens can't carry guns that just leaves the police you don't trust with guns.  Or you could just slowly disarm everybody so it's a bit like England where generally all police are unarmed except for the armed response units and other exceptions.

I think police should be heavily armored, not heavily armed.  

But then this might be a problem in America just because of the amount of powerful guns already out there, if the police and law abiding citizens suddenly decided to disarm or use inferior firepower that would leave a lot of the superior firepower in the hands of criminals.

Probably not.  If we all decided that a .22 pistol was as big a handgun as could be legally owned, a .22 pistol would be the weapon of choice for the enterprising criminal.

I don't like the idea of guns being legalized in England where I live, but with America's culture I think it might be problematic to suddenly change the legality of guns in a major way.  A definite sensible idea I think the vast majority agree with is that gun sales should be more carefully regulated.

They're already -supposed- to be carefully regulated.

[Minimalist]

The problem is not the absence of laws, but the absence of prosecutors willing to pursue them.

And why do you suppose that is?


Meanwhile....how do you tell a L-ARGO from just an ordinary gun nut?

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/12/08...tail=email

Elementary school locked down after open-carry dad keeps on showing up with gun

 

A mystery Parent of the Year and open-carry enthusiast’s Christmas gift to the children and staff at Lillian Fletcher Elementary School in Homer Michigan, is a school wide lockdown. A parent at the school showed up on Friday with a holstered gun. Then, having already been told that maybe he didn’t need to bring his gun with him to an elementary school, brought it again on Monday!

[Minimalist]

Another family that thought a gun in the house made them safer.

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2015/12/09/child...as-police/

Child Accidentally Shoots, Kills Himself Say Dallas Police

Assholes.

[Minimalist]

Another Happy Holiday Party....courtesy of Smith & Wesson

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/12/minnesot...-officers/

Minnesota man guns down worker at employees’ holiday party and fights with arresting officers

Note that the white guy who fought with the cops did not get shot 16 times.