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RE: Oh, Catholics, you delightfully hypocritical fucks.
January 25, 2013 at 9:36 am
(This post was last modified: January 25, 2013 at 9:38 am by Drich.)
(January 25, 2013 at 1:42 am)Creed of Heresy Wrote: (January 25, 2013 at 1:18 am)Drich Wrote: Remember the religious are no better than anyone else, infact they admittedly worse than those who believe that they can get by on their morality. That is why we seek atonement. Is it truly so shocking that we are found to be in line with our self admitted nature?
"Lead not by word, but by example."
-Attributed to various sources
Words of wisdom that Christians rarely seem to be able to comprehend. Atonement means little when you are supposed to be spreading the word of your god and all you are doing is nullifying the words by your actions. Especially when you weaken the explanation by stating that it's all ok because you confess to an intangible entity your sins thus making them not sins any longer. Makes the whole thing really hollow. The example being admit ones own short comings, and seek atonement for sin rather than trying to justify one's sin and lowering the bar of popular morality to meet one's sin.
(January 25, 2013 at 1:55 am)Violet Lilly Blossom Wrote: (January 25, 2013 at 1:42 am)The_Germans_are_coming Wrote: A judge, prossecution and jury dont mess arround and dont care about assumptions or beliefs.
Facts are all that count in a court of law and those who dont understand that, fall on their nose.
Facts are utterly irrelevant in court. What matters is how disingenuous and hard to understand the lawyer is. The more word salad made by the prosecution: the more likely a person is to be declared guilty. The more word salad made by the accused: the more likely to be acquitted.
Ultimately, it's all about presentation and misleading the audience. Boy but being a lawyer would be fun  And you don't even have to possess a degree in law to be a judge in most places in the USA  OJ and Casey Anthony came to mind for some reason.
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RE: Oh, Catholics, you delightfully hypocritical fucks.
January 25, 2013 at 1:36 pm
(January 25, 2013 at 9:36 am)Drich Wrote: OJ and Casey Anthony came to mind for some reason.
I posted a picture of OJ... but I guess the forum just doesn't recognize him 
Please give me a home where cloud buffalo roam
Where the dear and the strangers can play
Where sometimes is heard a discouraging word
But the skies are not stormy all day
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RE: Oh, Catholics, you delightfully hypocritical fucks.
January 25, 2013 at 3:22 pm
I wrote that before I scrolled through all of the other posts.
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RE: Oh, Catholics, you delightfully hypocritical fucks.
February 9, 2013 at 6:30 pm
Hi Creed Of Heresy,
The Catholic Church or this particular Hospital has not compromised its religious doctrine to win a lawsuit.
The article you quote doesn't even said they did - it said the Church "appeared to do so". (The use of such language should be a dead giveaway to any thinking person).
I.e. they know the doctrine didn't change, but hey lets print a nonsense story anyway, because biased people - who don't really care for facts - will lap it up without thought, to glibly affirm their own negative views of Catholicism.
The story is about someone who has filed a wrongful death lawsuit because their unborn children died in a Catholic hospital.
Wrongful death lawsuits apply to the wrongful death of people.
However, the secular law says that an unborn child is not a person.
When abortion was legalised. (Roe V Wade), it was justified in law by saying that - although a new human being is created when a human egg is fertilised, this new human being is not a person (and therefore it is OK to kill it).
The Hospitals defence is simply pointing out that a court of law which says an unborn child is not a person, cannot then convict the Hospital on grounds that it is.
It is not changing its own position, it is asking the court to apply its law consistently - which is only fair.
Creed of Heres Wrote:But really...are any of us surprised at this? No. No we aren't, are we?
I would definitely advise looking past media headlines, to get to the facts of the matter.
You seem to have accepted a rather biased story out-of-hand, without thought, in a gleeful rush to criticise the Catholic Church.
All media sources with their own agenda, but you tend to find stories regarding the Catholic Church are often lurid gossip dressed up as journalism (as in this case) because there is undoubtedly a market for such.
When I see people lap up stories like this, I sometimes wonder how much thought they have put into their atheism! 
Take it easy mate!
Cheers!
GS
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RE: Oh, Catholics, you delightfully hypocritical fucks.
February 9, 2013 at 6:38 pm
I appreciate the cheeky tongue smiley, but you are aware that atheism doesn't require thought to maintain it any more than a car requires an engine to remain parked, yes?
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist. This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair. Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second. That means there's a situation vacant.'
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RE: Oh, Catholics, you delightfully hypocritical fucks.
February 9, 2013 at 6:40 pm
(February 9, 2013 at 6:30 pm)Gabriel Syme Wrote: It is not changing its own position, it is asking the court to apply its law consistently - which is only fair.
No one to my knowledge implied otherwise.
It is however still hypocritical of them to do this.
Article Wrote:But when it came to mounting a defense in the Stodghill case, Catholic Health’s lawyers effectively turned the Church directives on their head. Catholic organizations have for decades fought to change federal and state laws that fail to protect “unborn persons,” and Catholic Health’s lawyers in this case had the chance to set precedent bolstering anti-abortion legal arguments. Instead, they are arguing state law protects doctors from liability concerning unborn fetuses on grounds that those fetuses are not persons with legal rights.
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RE: Oh, Catholics, you delightfully hypocritical fucks.
February 9, 2013 at 7:11 pm
(February 9, 2013 at 6:38 pm)Stimbo Wrote: I appreciate the cheeky tongue smiley, but you are aware that atheism doesn't require thought to maintain it any more than a car requires an engine to remain parked, yes?
Hiya Stimbo!
Yeh, you are quite right!
I was really questioning the quality of analysis given to (eg) Christianity, or whatever, but I appreciate my choice of words wasn't great!
Cheers
GS
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RE: Oh, Catholics, you delightfully hypocritical fucks.
February 9, 2013 at 7:17 pm
That's okay, we're here to learn from each other if nothing else. If I come across as a little pedantic at times, it's only because I have a passion for language and so I can tend to be a little protective towards it. You'll get used to me I'm sure!
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist. This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair. Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second. That means there's a situation vacant.'
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RE: Oh, Catholics, you delightfully hypocritical fucks.
February 9, 2013 at 7:19 pm
(This post was last modified: February 9, 2013 at 7:21 pm by Gabriel Syme.)
Hi Napoleon,
(February 9, 2013 at 6:40 pm)Napoléon Wrote: (February 9, 2013 at 6:30 pm)Gabriel Syme Wrote: It is not changing its own position, it is asking the court to apply its law consistently - which is only fair.
No one to my knowledge implied otherwise.
Well the threat title labels Catholics as 'delightfully hypocritical fucks' on the alleged grounds they changed their opinion to win a lawsuit.
That would certainly seem like implying different events to me, (!), not least because they didn't change their opinion, rather their argument is based on how the law itself defines unborn children.
It is the legal definition which counts in court-cases, not Catholic doctrine.
(February 9, 2013 at 6:40 pm)Napoléon Wrote: It is however still hypocritical of them to do this.
The hospital isn't actually "doing" anything, least of all being hypocritical.
If the law states that an unborn child is not a person, then it cannot issue a credible judgement on grounds that it is a person.
It has to be consistent.
(February 9, 2013 at 7:17 pm)Stimbo Wrote: That's okay, we're here to learn from each other if nothing else. If I come across as a little pedantic at times, it's only because I have a passion for language and so I can tend to be a little protective towards it. You'll get used to me I'm sure!
Hey - its no problem at all, I thought it was a fair point, not pedantic.
No worries!
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RE: Oh, Catholics, you delightfully hypocritical fucks.
February 9, 2013 at 7:35 pm
(This post was last modified: February 9, 2013 at 7:37 pm by Napoléon.)
(February 9, 2013 at 7:19 pm)Gabriel Syme Wrote: Well the threat title labels Catholics as 'delightfully hypocritical fucks' on the alleged grounds they changed their opinion to win a lawsuit.
Bolded where I think you've gone wrong. To my knowledge no one here has said they've changed their opinions, like you are suggesting.
Quote:That would certainly seem like implying different events to me, (!), not least because they didn't change their opinion, rather their argument is based on how the law itself defines unborn children.
It doesn't matter, fact is they're happy enough to use the law to suit their own ends when things need to go in their favour. But every other time they're against such laws. This is by definition hypocritical.
Quote:The hospital isn't actually "doing" anything, least of all being hypocritical.
Please explain to me how an organisation that has actively campaigned against the legal definitions used for this case in the past, yet is now happy to use them because it suits their own ends, is anything but hypocritical.
Quote:If the law states that an unborn child is not a person, then it cannot issue a credible judgement on grounds that it is a person.
It has to be consistent.
It's not about the law it's about what catholics supposedly think is moral and correct.
For the record I don't begrudge them at all for doing what they are in court, but it is still a hypocritical thing to do, supposing you're an organisation that so fervently holds such beliefs as they do on abortion and one which has actively campaigned against the laws they are now employing to protect themselves.
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