Posts: 23918
Threads: 300
Joined: June 25, 2011
Reputation:
151
RE: Why Does God Need A Creator?
February 24, 2013 at 1:02 pm
(February 24, 2013 at 11:43 am)fr0d0 Wrote: Yes I disagree that you can be as good as is possible with a positive world view with a neutral world view. This is quite simple to see.
This is a little puzzling for me. Is it good to do good? Sometimes yes. But can there be an excess of good? If someone thinks incessantly about what is good and spends every waking moment attempting to do what he has decided is good .. is that a life well spent? (Would it be for you?)
I think that I am neutral on the value of the good. Most of the actions I do which what others might describe as "good" are from empathy. I don't act on empathy for any 'pleasure' that gives me. Nor do I do it out of any desire to act in accordance with any moral code of which I am aware. I do it for its own sake. It is a natural inclination which I neither thwart nor attribute to any higher purpose.
Is it better to do good things because we have decided they are good and we do them out of a sense of duty to the good? I don't think so.
Posts: 14259
Threads: 48
Joined: March 1, 2009
Reputation:
80
RE: Why Does God Need A Creator?
February 24, 2013 at 2:43 pm
Adopting a world view of positivity gives you a different scale to play with. The reasons you have to be positive are more.
So I agree. There's a limit to the "good" you can do/doing more would be irrational. Possibly counter productive.
Posts: 319
Threads: 3
Joined: January 30, 2013
Reputation:
8
RE: Why Does God Need A Creator?
February 24, 2013 at 3:15 pm
(February 24, 2013 at 11:43 am)fr0d0 Wrote: OK I won't use the hate word. But here again you seem to need to equate my belief with the "needlessly dangerous". This is foreign to my beliefs, but you seem to have no problem assigning this to me.
Yes I disagree that you can be as good as is possible with a positive world view with a neutral world view. This is quite simple to see.
Just to be clear, I don't mean that your belief specifically is needlessly dangerous, I think they all are. I'm not racist, I persecute everyone equally XD
I don't have a neutral world view. The only thing atheism at all addresses is the existence of a god. As to the world itself, I have quite a positive outlook on it indeed. I'm of the opinion that it can and should be bettered, and that I can do that of my own steam, with a view unincumbered by needless dogma or irrational beliefs. I think that's immensely positive. In fact in regards to a general outlook on the world itself, I don't think that atheists and theists are that terribly different in our personal goals. Most of us want to make the world better, we simply differ on why and how, and it stems from belief in a god or gods.
I want to do good because I believe that it affects people, and you do so probably for the same reason, but with the added bonus of an unknown entity smiling warmly upon your doing so.
The danger simply comes from what you might believe that entity wills you to do, which is where, I think, we begin to differ on what constitutes "good".
If you believe it, question it. If you question it, get an answer. If you have an answer, does that answer satisfy reality? Does it satisfy you? Probably not. For no one else will agree with you, not really.
Posts: 14259
Threads: 48
Joined: March 1, 2009
Reputation:
80
RE: Why Does God Need A Creator?
February 24, 2013 at 3:21 pm
(This post was last modified: February 24, 2013 at 3:22 pm by fr0d0.)
Lol yeah universally racist. I like it.
I don't know about the entity looking down warmly, it's more the other way around.
I think we're all in danger of going off the rails. I think I became more law abiding with belief. I hope i'd stand up for my beliefs if they were at odds with any law. There's nothing wrong with differing opinions in a democracy of course.
Posts: 319
Threads: 3
Joined: January 30, 2013
Reputation:
8
RE: Why Does God Need A Creator?
February 24, 2013 at 3:27 pm
(February 24, 2013 at 3:21 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: There's nothing wrong with differing opinions in a democracy of course.
No indeed. One might argue that in many cases, it makes a democracy strong to have conflicting opinions. It's difficult to make one-sided decisions when the other side has the potential to stop you.
If you believe it, question it. If you question it, get an answer. If you have an answer, does that answer satisfy reality? Does it satisfy you? Probably not. For no one else will agree with you, not really.
Posts: 1473
Threads: 20
Joined: November 12, 2011
Reputation:
26
RE: Why Does God Need A Creator?
February 24, 2013 at 5:39 pm
(This post was last modified: February 24, 2013 at 5:54 pm by Norfolk And Chance.)
(February 16, 2013 at 6:26 pm)chasingthetruth Wrote: He isn't bound by the same laws of existence that he himself dictated
Who says that he isn't bound by the same laws of existence that he himself dictated? You? Your religion? Guess you'll have to prove that before we can go any further...
Quote:why is it necessary for him to have had a creator? (for those who use this argument)
Theist "God = answer to all the questions that we do not know the answers. God is the creator. He created everything"
Atheist "Really. Who created God?"
Theist "God did not need a creator"
Atheist "If you say that there are things (such as god) that do not need creating, then using your logic why did the Universe need creating? Why the need for a god, in fact?"
(February 19, 2013 at 8:22 am)fr0d0 Wrote: Proof, empirical proof of the xtian God is not possible by definition. Belief in God is only possible through faith. If it were possible to prove his existence independantly the Xtian God would cease to exist, do you see.
Fuck me, what shit.
You are currently experiencing a lucky and very brief window of awareness, sandwiched in between two periods of timeless and utter nothingness. So why not make the most of it, and stop wasting your life away trying to convince other people that there is something else? The reality is obvious.
Posts: 45
Threads: 1
Joined: October 8, 2012
Reputation:
2
RE: Why Does God Need A Creator?
February 24, 2013 at 7:10 pm
(February 24, 2013 at 5:39 pm)Norfolk And Chance Wrote: (February 19, 2013 at 8:22 am)fr0d0 Wrote: Proof, empirical proof of the xtian God is not possible by definition. Belief in God is only possible through faith. If it were possible to prove his existence independantly the Xtian God would cease to exist, do you see.
Fuck me, what shit.
Like I said...Babel fish. 
Posts: 39
Threads: 2
Joined: February 24, 2013
Reputation:
7
RE: Why Does God Need A Creator?
February 24, 2013 at 7:48 pm
(February 16, 2013 at 6:26 pm)chasingthetruth Wrote: He isn't bound by the same laws of existence that he himself dictated, why is it necessary for him to have had a creator? (for those who use this argument)
Who says he isn't bound by the same laws of existence? How could you possibly know that?
"Religion divides with a sense of unity."
|
