Monsanto gives up fight for GM plants in Europe

[Kayenneh]

A yeah, it was "racist symphatiser". Which doesnt change the dishonesty.

Anyway, yes you are.

When did I call you a racist sympathizer? Link me to the exact post please.

And what on earth has it to do with GMO..?

[Something completely different]

A yeah, it was "racist symphatiser". Which doesnt change the dishonesty.

Anyway, yes you are.

When did I call you a racist sympathizer? Link me to the exact post please.

No you said I called YOU a racist symphatiser - when I called you an opportunist!

[Tiberius]

And what on earth has it to do with GMO..?

I accused him of lacking intellectual integrity for not presenting evidence for his claim. His response was to claim I'd called him a racist. I asked for evidence for that claim. He then changed his claim to that I'd called him a racist sympathizer. I asked for evidence for that new claim.

I'm not expecting anything. After all, the guy has no intellectual integrity.

[Tiberius]

No you said I called YOU a racist symphatiser - when I called you an opportunist!

That was not your claim:

Given that you resorted to calling me a racist when I simply called you an opportunist.

Since it's you saying it, the "you" in that quote is ME (Tiberius). The "me" is YOU (Germans).

I never called you a racist. You are a fucking liar.

[The Grand Nudger]

What risks?

the risks for biodiversity.

Just got back from the ballpark. Biodiversity is intentionally minimized in agricultural production regardless of whether you go GMO or traditionally bred. That "risk" isn't a risk at all, and it's commensurate between the two - meanwhile the GMOs offer benefits over and above.

[Something completely different]

I accused him of lacking intellectual integrity for not presenting evidence for his claim. His response was to claim I'd called him a racist. I asked for evidence for that claim. He then changed his claim to that I'd called him a racist sympathizer. I asked for evidence for that new claim.

I'm not expecting anything. After all, the guy has no intellectual integrity.

I simply miswrote my previous accusation! Which has nothing to do with any integrity whatsoever!

[Kayenneh]

I'm not expecting anything. After all, the guy has no intellectual integrity.

I know

I just wanted to point out to Germans in this case that the topic has derailed from the original point. And I agree with you Tiberius and your views on GMO.

[Tiberius]

I simply miswrote my previous accusation! Which has nothing to do with any integrity whatsoever!

Your words in response to me saying I'd be friends with a racist because I could try to change their views:

Dear diary, I am not a racist, but I really enjoyed that beer at the pub with the guys in SS uniforms tonight.

The intention was clear to me; it was clear to everyone else too. You didn't directly call me a racist, but you insinuated it strongly.

Link: http://atheistforums.org/post-429554.html#pid429554

[Something completely different]

Just got back from the ballpark. Biodiversity is intentionally minimized in agricultural production regardless of whether you go GMO or traditionally bred. That "risk" isn't a risk at all, and it's commensurate between the two - meanwhile the GMOs offer benefits over and above.

If that is true, what do you suggest about farmers depending on one company for services? A farmer who buys a crop from monsanto has to constantly rebuy the pesticides and the feriliser from that same company because the plant only responds to these. This dependency can ruin the farmer when the company choses to rise prices.

Other than that, why should it be wise to open to an american market which can export far cheaper goods to Europe?

---

Your words in response to me saying I'd be friends with a racist because I could try to change their views:

Dear diary, I am not a racist, but I really enjoyed that beer at the pub with the guys in SS uniforms tonight.

and I added:

Seems like moral principles are something for sale.

which means that I accuse you of having no moral principles and not of being a racist. Meaning that you have no problems to engage with the worst scum as long as it pays off for you!

The intention was clear to me; it was clear to everyone else too. You didn't directly call me a racist, but you insinuated it strongly.

Wrong, I mocked you for considering that it alright to gain profit or any kind of personal good from engaging with racists. And that you are therefor an opportunist.

[The Grand Nudger]

If that is true, what do you suggest about farmers depending on one company for services? A farmer who buys a crop from monsanto has to constantly rebuy the pesticides and the feriliser from that same company because the plant only responds to these. This dependency can ruin the farmer when the company choses to rise prices.

That's an anti-trust issue, to be sure...but only where anti-trust laws exist. A farmer -could- buy his seed from someone else, there are competitors (their main pesticide is off-patent now so it's a non-issue) - but Monsanto's seed is very well engineered, it is demonstrably superior and so farmers -choose- to continue buying it and planting it to increase their net. If Monsanto raises their prices to a point where a producer would net more with another product that's what they'll plant - if they figure the difference is worth it.

That's how this is done. Think of agricultural producers as short term investment specialists, because that's what they are.

Other than that, why should it be wise to open to an american market which can export far cheaper goods to Europe?

Because it would free up your capital and your productive land (which can then be used to generate more capital). If somebody can do something cheaper and better than you, you let them do that and focus on something else (while leveraging their ability an products) to maximize your own efforts. That's why agricultural producers - for example, rarely breed their own seedstock - and why mixed vegetable producers buy plants well beyond their seedling phase to transplant into their fields. They can save money (on equipment, labor, and skills)- increase productivity - and simplify their operation (which all translates to increased profit), by availing themselves of the services of another.