In a world without God...

[Godscreated]

...if a Christian decides to leave the faith because they just can't accept it then we have nothing more to say.

Considering the fact that there are about 35 million books in the library of Congress, and yet you base your entire existence on one, and only one book, I can certainly understand why you'd have nothing to say to anyone who doesn't profess your faith in the one book. How could you? It is kind of like expecting DOS 3.0 to perform at the same level as Windows 7.

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I do not accept evolution period, I believe it's made up science without anything to prove it.

Then you would have no problem coming to Kentucky and letting a geologist such as myself take you on a day tour of the geology of our fine state so I can show you how utterly and completely wrong you are.

You can't date rock.

[Rahul]

I think fossils are stone.

This is just a fucking stone?

[orogenicman]

Considering the fact that there are about 35 million books in the library of Congress, and yet you base your entire existence on one, and only one book, I can certainly understand why you'd have nothing to say to anyone who doesn't profess your faith in the one book. How could you? It is kind of like expecting DOS 3.0 to perform at the same level as Windows 7.

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Then you would have no problem coming to Kentucky and letting a geologist such as myself take you on a day tour of the geology of our fine state so I can show you how utterly and completely wrong you are.

You can't date rock.

Indeed, I prefer to date women. But I can also use the same mathematics that is used to operate nuclear reactors to determine the absolute date of igneous rocks. And relative dating is a very straight forward enough thing to perform. But none of this addresses the real issue. And that is that you appear to have no education or experience whatsoever to come to the conclusion that rocks can't be dated or that evolution is not real science. I am offering you the chance to turn that around by taking you into the field and showing you how it is done. So what do you say, grasshopper? Want put your money where your mouth is? Take me up on my challenge? Or are you just blowing more creationist smoke?

[Cato]

Except all the fossil records that have been radiometrically dated to show the progression of a species, not to mention all the DNA evidence. Or are you one of those nuts that think fossils are a conspiracy and that humans rode dinosaurs

I think fossils are stone.

A fossil IS stone, dumbass.

P.S., For the geologists, I understand the difference between a stone and a rock. I am assuming that GC is using the term stone synonymously with the term rock.

[Drich]

I've always found that particular bit to be so very telling. Christians like to say that you don;t have to "convert" to judaism to be a christian - but it's a hollow distinction. You have to believe in the same god, who did the same horrid shit, from the same horrid texts. The only functional difference between the two is that the christians just couldn't stand the thought of following all those inconvenient rules.

So I suppose, since we're imagining gods in this thread...we could imagine one that says "fuck the rules" just as easily as any other.

Do you know what it takes to be converted to OT Judaism? Simple belief in the same God is not enough. The entry into these two different religions are worlds apart.

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Because you don't know God, you think God is unknowable?

There is no God to know.

Again, because you say so??? Or because someone who you believe to be smarter than you says so?? (Hint: I am looking for your source not your feelings on the matter)

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I guess you are the liar, and did not actually read either one of those threads. As I did not see Heaven/Paradise.

No, I am not a liar, you said you saw Jesus, who is God, and this is part of your belief. I said that people of different religions see what they believe when they supposedly die and come back e.g. Christians see God and heaven, Muslims see Allah and paradise. You saw God, this is part of your belief, therefore I am not a liar.

Again I did not see Heaven. I saw my judgements, I saw the potential love God had for me, then I saw it all taken away and then I got to see the gates of Hell. Where is heaven in all of this? Where is the paradise?

[Cato]

Again, because you say so??? Or because someone who you believe to be smarter than you says so?? (Hint: I am looking for your source not your feelings on the matter)

Captain James Tiberius Kirk is my source. Kirk asked God for his driver's license. God couldn't produce it, got pissed and ended up getting dead. (Hint: I'm looking for you to understand that 2000 year old fiction doesn't have a hold on reality anymore than 20 year old fiction does).

[Godscreated]

You can't date rock.

Indeed, I prefer to date women. But I can also use the same mathematics that is used to operate nuclear reactors to determine the absolute date of igneous rocks. And relative dating is a very straight forward enough thing to perform. But none of this addresses the real issue. And that is that you appear to have no education or experience whatsoever to come to the conclusion that rocks can't be dated or that evolution is not real science. I am offering you the chance to turn that around by taking you into the field and showing you how it is done. So what do you say, grasshopper? Want put your money where your mouth is? Take me up on my challenge? Or are you just blowing more creationist smoke?

I'll check you out on that and get back with you, I have a friend at Oak Ridge National Labs, he and his father are both nuclear engineers.

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I think fossils are stone.

This is just a fucking stone?

That ain't bone.

[Drich]

Whether one accepts evolution as fact or not has no bearing on whether evolution is factual. The evidence is abundant and speaks for itself. It requires no special understanding to accept. You do not have to a/s/k according to a vague passage in a book for answers that can never be verified, nor risk the possibility that you a/s/k exactly as proscribed and come away with nothing.

Drich personally informed me that my Christian experience failed because I didn't a/s/k properly. Evolution makes no such demand. The evidence is not only available to those who assume ahead of time that the concept is certain truth. It is available, in full and without restriction, for even those who are most stringently in denial of reality.

We might very well 'jump on' someone who denied science, but the difference between science and Christianity is that one is rooted in physical evidence, and one is rooted in tales entirely indistinguishable from fiction. Your beliefs are beneath anything revealed by physical evidence.

I informed you that you did not A/S/K as outlined by what Jesus said do in Luke 11, after you shared with me what you did do. It really simple. Christ says do x,y,z and this is what it looks like... And you do w,y,x, but feel it is close enough because you meant it. Either you've done what you've been asked to do or you haven't.

It's not about the x,y,z. God doesn't even need you to do x,y,z He already knows who is or will do what he has been asked to do. The x,y,z is for you to see and understand the hard callous heart you possess that will not allow you the humility to follow God where He may lead you. For if you can not simply do x,y,z as trivial as it is to save yourself then, nothing else will matter to you. The XYZ here or A/S/K as Christ describes in luke 11 is a self measure of ones own heart. If you know you can not or will not ASK as Christ commanded here, but want to, or even want to, want to then just ASK for that desire.

[Rahul]

You can't date rock.

No, you can't. Very true.

Interesting thing though. As the centuries roll by layer after layer of sediment pile up. Occasionally there is a volcanic eruption or forest fire leaving charred remains in a thin layer sandwhiched between these sediments.

You can date that. Quite easily.

So let's say there was a lava flow and it's dated at 135 million years. Then you have some dirt and what not with a fossilized skeleton of some animal. Then right above that layer is a layer containing charcoal from a forest fire and it's dated at 130 million years.

You can say that this animal probably existed between 135 and 130 million years ago.

And the funny thing is other scientists are doing the same thing all over the world.

And it all seems to be in agreement with each other.

Hrm. What can we deduce from this?

If just one group finds a rabbit or chicken dated to within the Cambrian geological period, well that fucks up everything.

Funny it never happens.

[orogenicman]

Indeed, I prefer to date women. But I can also use the same mathematics that is used to operate nuclear reactors to determine the absolute date of igneous rocks. And relative dating is a very straight forward enough thing to perform. But none of this addresses the real issue. And that is that you appear to have no education or experience whatsoever to come to the conclusion that rocks can't be dated or that evolution is not real science. I am offering you the chance to turn that around by taking you into the field and showing you how it is done. So what do you say, grasshopper? Want put your money where your mouth is? Take me up on my challenge? Or are you just blowing more creationist smoke?

I'll check you out on that and get back with you, I have a friend at Oak Ridge National Labs, he and his father are both nuclear engineers.

Fine. In the mean time, want to put your money where your mouth is? Take me up on my challenge?