Posts: 15755
Threads: 194
Joined: May 15, 2009
Reputation:
145
RE: I sometimes doubt my countries sanity.
September 18, 2009 at 2:12 pm
16 actually  I could know that my boyfriend's (of 4 years) father, grandfather, uncles, and a few cousins have been in the military... And from the long (never-ending... oh my Dotard they never end) stories they insist upon telling: it is not hard to know that they despise the military.
And that makes up most of the military people I know  *shrug*, you speak personal experience, I speak it, and neither proves anything.
The contingency plan is in place so that the draft can be resumed as readily as possible... or did you already know that...?
Please give me a home where cloud buffalo roam
Where the dear and the strangers can play
Where sometimes is heard a discouraging word
But the skies are not stormy all day
Posts: 628
Threads: 13
Joined: December 1, 2008
Reputation:
13
RE: I sometimes doubt my countries sanity.
September 18, 2009 at 2:16 pm
(September 18, 2009 at 1:50 pm)dry land fish Wrote: I agree that we should not send soldiers to fight a war we can't win. When they are there they have to kill in order to save their own lives. Once you see someone who doesn't look like you trying to kill you every day then you suddely develop this instinct to kill everyone that looks like them. Especially when women and kids strap bombs to their bodies and walk up to soldiers and blow them up. At that point no one is off limits to be killed.
I can see how this would be the case. If I were out there fighting I'd be shooting my rifle every which way out of fear for my life and the lives of my fellow soldiers. It's hard to fight against crazy. The troops need to come back. Move on to plan B.
dry land fish]
No...I'm not talking just about extremists. I mentioned WHY some of the would be extremists aren't so extreme when they suddenly find themselves living in a country that doesn't tolerate extremism. There is a book called not without my daughter" and there was also a movie called that as well. It's based on a true story of an American woman married to an Iranian doctor in America. He lies and says he's going to visit his family in Iran but will be back in two weeks and suggests she bring herself and their daughter. She agrees and when they get to Iran and to his radical Islamic family he throws away the passports, starts beating his wife and controlling her in true islamic fashion and tells her they are never leaving Iran. She isn't allowed to ever call her parents or family in America either. Then he puts his daughter in a Muslim school and terrifies the little girl. This really happened. The woman fled the country and risked her life to save her and her daughter. In America this man was completely peaceful. He practiced Islam in America and no one not even his wife ever thought he was capable of such violence. This is an example of how you never know about Muslims and you never know if they are truly extreme or not.
[/quote Wrote:The law of the land certainly does turn a lot of extremists mild. However, if I take a quote from Stephen Pinker's "The Blank Slate":
[quote="Stephen Pinker"]
I was a true believer in Bakunin's anarchism. I laughed off my parents' argument that if the government ever laid down its arms all hell would break loose. Our competing predictions were put to the test at 8:00 A.M. on October 17, 1969, when the Montreal police went on strike. By 11:20 A.M. the first bank was robbed. By noon, most downtown stores had closed down because of looting. Within a few more hours, taxi drivers burned down the garage of a limousine service that competed with them for airport customers, a rooftop sniper killed a provincial police officer, rioters broke into several hotels and restaurants, and a doctor slew a burglar in his suburban home. By the end of the day, six banks had been robbed, a hundred shops had been looted, twelve fires had been set, forty cartloads of storefront glass had been broken, and three million dollars in property damage had been inflicted, before city authorities had to call in the army and, of course, the Mounties to restore order.
Basically, without the restrictions placed upon people by their governments, they go batshit crazy. While you can say "the reason muslims in America don't seem extreme is because it wouldn't be accepted here", you could just as easily say "the reason average civilians in America don't seem like villainous scumbags is because it wouldn't be accepted here". Both observations would be valid, but neither grants you the right to go on a killing spree of an entire group of people.
Sorry for the long post.
Posts: 295
Threads: 6
Joined: August 10, 2009
Reputation:
3
RE: I sometimes doubt my countries sanity.
September 18, 2009 at 2:23 pm
(This post was last modified: September 18, 2009 at 2:27 pm by dry land fish.)
Posts: 15755
Threads: 194
Joined: May 15, 2009
Reputation:
145
RE: I sometimes doubt my countries sanity.
September 18, 2009 at 2:25 pm
Bye, don't look back too fast, or you'll sprain your neck 
Please give me a home where cloud buffalo roam
Where the dear and the strangers can play
Where sometimes is heard a discouraging word
But the skies are not stormy all day
Posts: 628
Threads: 13
Joined: December 1, 2008
Reputation:
13
RE: I sometimes doubt my countries sanity.
September 18, 2009 at 2:33 pm
(September 18, 2009 at 2:23 pm)dry land fish Wrote: Luke MC: Of course the law of the land turns extremists mild. A quiet extremists is still an extremist though. It's not the openly extreme ones people should be worried about. It's the quiet ones that portray a peaceful mentality but are secretly working on a plan. In this case we never really know if they are peaceful or not. I believe in order to put national security first we need to monitor all Muslims. If they are peaceful then they should know this is something that's going to keep them and the rest of us safe. If they don't like it..then they need to go live somewhere else. Religious profiling in this instance is warranted over the alternative outcome which is possibly more attacks.
Most bank robbers, serial killers, burglars and sex offenders don't go around telling the world how much of a threat they are (unless they is gangster). These people could be your average Carl at the supermarket, secretly hatching their plan to kill the wife. I find it unfair that you'll monitor all muslims in case they blow something up, when the damage caused by serial killers, sex offenders, drink-drivers, etc, produces a far greater impact on society. Why don't we just set up an Orwellian state on ALL citizens? You never know what frail old Suzie could be plotting behing the scenes... 
Posts: 295
Threads: 6
Joined: August 10, 2009
Reputation:
3
RE: I sometimes doubt my countries sanity.
September 18, 2009 at 2:47 pm
(September 18, 2009 at 2:33 pm)LukeMC Wrote: (September 18, 2009 at 2:23 pm)dry land fish Wrote: Luke MC: Of course the law of the land turns extremists mild. A quiet extremists is still an extremist though. It's not the openly extreme ones people should be worried about. It's the quiet ones that portray a peaceful mentality but are secretly working on a plan. In this case we never really know if they are peaceful or not. I believe in order to put national security first we need to monitor all Muslims. If they are peaceful then they should know this is something that's going to keep them and the rest of us safe. If they don't like it..then they need to go live somewhere else. Religious profiling in this instance is warranted over the alternative outcome which is possibly more attacks.
Most bank robbers, serial killers, burglars and sex offenders don't go around telling the world how much of a threat they are (unless they is gangster). These people could be your average Carl at the supermarket, secretly hatching their plan to kill the wife. I find it unfair that you'll monitor all muslims in case they blow something up, when the damage caused by serial killers, sex offenders, drink-drivers, etc, produces a far greater impact on society. Why don't we just set up an Orwellian state on ALL citizens? You never know what frail old Suzie could be plotting behing the scenes...
Serials killers don't share a common religion.
Posts: 15755
Threads: 194
Joined: May 15, 2009
Reputation:
145
RE: I sometimes doubt my countries sanity.
September 18, 2009 at 2:48 pm
Quote:Serials killers don't share a common religion.
And this makes any difference... how?
Please give me a home where cloud buffalo roam
Where the dear and the strangers can play
Where sometimes is heard a discouraging word
But the skies are not stormy all day
Posts: 831
Threads: 24
Joined: August 15, 2009
Reputation:
5
RE: I sometimes doubt my countries sanity.
September 18, 2009 at 2:48 pm
I think the reason you (dry land fish) feel the way you do is because, to put it simply, you are paranoid of muslims. That is basically what it is. I'm not saying its wrong to be wary. You definitely have every right to feel so, but not "all" muslims are bomb makers and have evil plans stashed away in their homes, you have to understand that.
Quote:In this case we never really know if they are peaceful or not. I believe in order to put national security first we need to monitor all Muslims. If they are peaceful then they should know this is something that's going to keep them and the rest of us safe. If they don't like it..then they need to go live somewhere else. Religious profiling in this instance is warranted over the alternative outcome which is possibly more attacks.
Do you not think religious profiling, and so obviously anti-muslim profiling, is going to cause even more anger and damage to the country? This is precisely what will cause even more retaliation. Whats worse, instead of finding the real killers, being the muslim radicals, you are aiming the innocent muslim communities that mind their own business but get labelled unjustly just because they happen to carry the same faith.
The dark side awaits YOU...AngryAtheism
"Only the dead have seen the end of war..." - Plato
“Those who wish to base their morality literally on the Bible have either not read it or not understood it...” - Richard Dawkins
Posts: 628
Threads: 13
Joined: December 1, 2008
Reputation:
13
RE: I sometimes doubt my countries sanity.
September 18, 2009 at 2:56 pm
(September 18, 2009 at 2:47 pm)dry land fish Wrote: Serials killers don't share a common religion.
I don't care if they share a bedroom, I still think it's ridiculous to monitor masses of people based on the actions of a minority.
Posts: 295
Threads: 6
Joined: August 10, 2009
Reputation:
3
RE: I sometimes doubt my countries sanity.
September 18, 2009 at 3:05 pm
(This post was last modified: September 18, 2009 at 3:06 pm by dry land fish.)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...21_pf.html
46 percent of Americans have a negative view of Muslims. Many Americans didn't even participate. Imagine what that number would be if more people participated.
A great writing. http://leftfieldperspectives.blogspot.co...slims.html
|
