It is true because you dont understand it

[Retorth]

The coach is annoying lol

[solarwave]

Christians don't always reply by saying 'God isn't fully knowable' so do try to explain it.

It is not. The many of atheists are first generation, meaning they believed and then converted.

It would be interesting to know what percent of those came from boring fundementalist churches.

[Eilonnwy]

It would be interesting to know what percent of those came from boring fundementalist churches.

No it wouldn't.


Obviously you're implying that if people have bad religious experiences they lose their faith. That couldn't be further from the truth. People disbelieve because reason leads them there.

[LukeMC]

we dont understand it therefore it is true.

I'm not sure that's precisely the logic they use. I would have thought it was more similar to "we don't understand it, therefore you can't dismiss it or doubt it or argue against because you don't understand enough to make that judgement".

On second thought... crazy people DO use some wonderfully exotic forms of logic unkown to the rest of the species...

[chatpilot]

Solar I have never seen you on here before so I would like to welcome you to the discussion.Eilonnwy I agree I am one of those fundamentalist Pentecostal bible thumpers that later came to atheism through the path of reason so I agree with your statement.

Solar:"Christians don't always reply by saying 'God isn't fully knowable' so do try to explain it. " In my opinion those Christians that do try to explain God or their reasons for belief, usually have to resort to stepping away from scripture and rationalize the unrational by using their so called version of philosophy: Apologetics.Defending God and the belief in God from the scriptures is illogical and unreasonable since both parties would have to accept the veracity of those scriptures as God inspired.An atheist would never do that and so a believer is forced to resort to psuedo science to try to explain the absurdity that is God.

[fr0d0]

@ E:

People believe because reason leads them there too. *Note I didn't need to attack you in making that point.

It's absurd to the highest degree to proclaim there is free will, but that "God has a plan". Is it absurd to the highest degree to assert you can't know or understand God then assert God planned for you to become a basketball player or win an award, yet these claims are made ALL the time.

And yet you have seen on here perfect rebuttal for this and you still assert it.

[solarwave]

No it wouldn't.

Obviously you're implying that if people have bad religious experiences they lose their faith. That couldn't be further from the truth. People disbelieve because reason leads them there.

No it wouldn't..... as in you hold what you say reguardless of the statistics? Sorry too easy

Well as I said I dont know I dont have the statistics, but it would make sense if it were partly down to bad experiences and also bad teaching and lack of the Holy Spirit.

And reason leads me to theism. Take a church my friend goes to. The dont promote the Holy Spirit or worship, it hasn't moved on with the times and is as dry as dust, I wouldn't be supprised if people saw the church and said God is dead. I would say more youth have walked away from God from that church than my own. And sorry that was quite a damning descriping of that church lol.

Solar I have never seen you on here before so I would like to welcome you to the discussion.Eilonnwy I agree I am one of those fundamentalist Pentecostal bible thumpers that later came to atheism through the path of reason so I agree with your statement.

Solar:"Christians don't always reply by saying 'God isn't fully knowable' so do try to explain it. " In my opinion those Christians that do try to explain God or their reasons for belief, usually have to resort to stepping away from scripture and rationalize the unrational by using their so called version of philosophy: Apologetics.Defending God and the belief in God from the scriptures is illogical and unreasonable since both parties would have to accept the veracity of those scriptures as God inspired.An atheist would never do that and so a believer is forced to resort to psuedo science to try to explain the absurdity that is God.

Hey, yeah Im new here, just joined yesterday..... I think.

Of course we step away from scripture because atheists don't accept scripture as a reason, nor should they. Whats wrong with using reason to help to understand God?

[Eilonnwy]

Solarwave: It's a common misconception that atheists hate god (ridiculous notion) or they turned away from God because of a bad experience, etc... When time and time again if you ask an atheist, they did so because the evidence of God was lacking.

Even if statistics showed the majority of atheists came from "boring fundy churches" as you carelessly claimed, it would not prove your point. It's irrelevant.

[chatpilot]

Because your (thiest) idea of reason is unreasonable.It has to start from a Christian worldview which we atheists don't have.You can't prove the existence of God in any natural and or scientific way.ID or Creationism is not in my view even close to real science it's more of a pseudo science.After the scriptures became available that was all that Christians had to defend their faith,I think philosophy forced the church to adopt a new way of defending the faith.A pathetic attempt to reconcile the faith with science and philosophy through the use of pseudo science and Christian apologetics.

Not to mention the early churches gestapo tactics of believe or die when they had the full authority and power of the Roman empire behind them.They established the faith through rivers of blood and forced coercion of the masses through the threat of death and torture.

[fr0d0]

Yes atheists quite often show hatred towards religion and what they imagine to be the concept of God