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(October 11, 2013 at 6:48 am)Ilovemyself Wrote: Hi there!
I'm sick and tired of Islam. It's so evil & mean towards non believers also unfair to women. My parents are punjabi pakistani's by their parents, they pray 5 times a day, fast. But they ask me to pray and I say that I'm still learning. I just want to get out of this trash whole religion, Christianity isn't any different but at least Jesus Christ didn't have sex with an 6 year old when he was 55 like mohammed did. I'm still young so i can't move out. I just want some help & advice, thanks.
I think a lot of people are in your position, I guess if all they are asking is for you to pray a bit things could be worse, as long as they aren't asking you to strap a bomb to your chest and blow up some jews.
I do feel sorry for you though I know how boring praying can be.
Are you ready for the fire? We are firemen. WE ARE FIREMEN! The heat doesn’t bother us. We live in the heat. We train in the heat. It tells us that we’re ready, we’re at home, we’re where we’re supposed to be. Flames don’t intimidate us. What do we do? We control the flame. We control them. We move the flames where we want to. And then we extinguish them.
Every religion is true one way or another. It is true when understood metaphorically. But when it gets stuck in its own metaphors, interpreting them as facts, then you are in trouble. - Joseph Campbell
(October 16, 2013 at 6:42 am)MysticKnight Wrote: I left Islam only to return to it.
Well, that fucking blows.
Stop contorting religious words until you can discern some meaning. Open your eyes and discover the truth for yourself.
Even if the open windows of science at first make us shiver after the cozy indoor warmth of traditional humanizing myths, in the end the fresh air brings vigor, and the great spaces have a splendor of their own - Bertrand Russell
October 16, 2013 at 3:29 pm (This post was last modified: October 16, 2013 at 3:36 pm by Mystic.)
(October 16, 2013 at 12:22 pm)Faith No More Wrote: Stop contorting religious words until you can discern some meaning. Open your eyes and discover the truth for yourself.
I am willing to learn different perspective on words from different people.
We have to do charitable reading as well as critical reading. We have to try to find faults as well find truths. Be as charitable as possible. With the Quran it's more difficult. It seems something is totally disconnected from a previous few verses, but when you learn wisdom, when you ponder about life in it's complexity and simplicity, it is so obvious still. Still it so obvious even with little pondering about life, that even if I knew very little about life, you can make the connection of one to the next. So why can't people do it? It seems to me it's own explanation of why makes more sense than any other.
Still I haven't been able to articulate why I am inclined to Quran being revealed by God, because I am not sure.
I have to patient. I can't believe in it without critical analysis of why it might not be true but still I can't deny it being true without a sure explanation of why it isn't.
Still I can't say I don't care when I do care.
I may not be obligated to know whether it is true or not, but if it has drawn me into inclining towards the idea it will help me a lot and be a mercy and way of peace and remembering, then I can't really help it.
You all see me post problems and problems. Rayaan didn't want to get into a discussion of verses with me.
I am not a stubborn person. We may have learned a lot from one another if we had this discussion. It could've been a cool journey if Rayaan ended up solving the problems I had.
But I am learning. All I can say, I am learning. It maybe that many of the problems I found don't have a solution. But this hasty way of showing contradictions is not healthy I think.
If I do this with Quran, even if the Quran is false, and some person wants to share with me his perspective, I have to be able to do charitable reading but will not do be able to do so. Still I have to read the intention he means by words even if they are expressed in a none sense manner.
So if nothing at all, I might learn to distinguish knowing and not knowing, and ability to be charitable in reading as much as critical and balance each other, till I reach certainty, if I will ever do so.
(October 11, 2013 at 6:48 am)Ilovemyself Wrote: Hi there!
I'm sick and tired of Islam. It's so evil & mean towards non believers also unfair to women. My parents are punjabi pakistani's by their parents, they pray 5 times a day, fast. But they ask me to pray and I say that I'm still learning. I just want to get out of this trash whole religion, Christianity isn't any different but at least Jesus Christ didn't have sex with an 6 year old when he was 55 like mohammed did. I'm still young so i can't move out. I just want some help & advice, thanks.
Studies have shown that many young people are religious in name only - so that they do not have arguments with older family members - but they do not actually believe in the religion.
Just remember that there will come a day when YOU will be able to openly make that decision and not be in control of others.
Meanwhile - as you go through the motions - just remember that both the christ and mohammad are MYTHS - they never actually lived - even if their character was based on a human who lived at one time. IT is simply not possible for either to have existed and fulfill all the claims made for either man. THey are - more or less - created exaggeration - with claims to outdo prior religions - and match prior religions.
Say to yourself that you are a good person - and continue being that good person - and take pride in being a good person - that will get you through.
I am willing to learn different perspective on words from different people.
We have to do charitable reading as well as critical reading. We have to try to find faults as well find truths. Be as charitable as possible. With the Quran it's more difficult. It seems something is totally disconnected from a previous few verses, but when you learn wisdom, when you ponder about life in it's complexity and simplicity, it is so obvious still. Still it so obvious even with little pondering about life, that even if I knew very little about life, you can make the connection of one to the next. So why can't people do it? It seems to me it's own explanation of why makes more sense than any other.
Still I haven't been able to articulate why I am inclined to Quran being revealed by God, because I am not sure.
I have to patient. I can't believe in it without critical analysis of why it might not be true but still I can't deny it being true without a sure explanation of why it isn't.
Still I can't say I don't care when I do care.
I may not be obligated to know whether it is true or not, but if it has drawn me into inclining towards the idea it will help me a lot and be a mercy and way of peace and remembering, then I can't really help it.
You all see me post problems and problems. Rayaan didn't want to get into a discussion of verses with me.
I am not a stubborn person. We may have learned a lot from one another if we had this discussion. It could've been a cool journey if Rayaan ended up solving the problems I had.
But I am learning. All I can say, I am learning. It maybe that many of the problems I found don't have a solution. But this hasty way of showing contradictions is not healthy I think.
If I do this with Quran, even if the Quran is false, and some person wants to share with me his perspective, I have to be able to do charitable reading but will not do be able to do so. Still I have to read the intention he means by words even if they are expressed in a none sense manner.
So if nothing at all, I might learn to distinguish knowing and not knowing, and ability to be charitable in reading as much as critical and balance each other, till I reach certainty, if I will ever do so.
The problem, as I see it, is that you're looking to have the truth fed to you, rather than observing life and coming to your own conclusions based on your own perceptions. People vary differently, and there is no-one-size-fits-all way to perceive and live your life. By concentrating only on the Quran, you are boxing yourself in you are not availing yourself of the true pleasure of life, which is searching and figuring out on your own where you fit and what you should be.
Even if the open windows of science at first make us shiver after the cozy indoor warmth of traditional humanizing myths, in the end the fresh air brings vigor, and the great spaces have a splendor of their own - Bertrand Russell
(October 16, 2013 at 7:06 pm)Faith No More Wrote: The problem, as I see it, is that you're looking to have the truth fed to you, rather than observing life and coming to your own conclusions based on your own perceptions.
This is how I was before. It's true. I went to Quran to be fed the truth. But the Quran doesn't feed the truth, it makes you reflect. It calls you to remember. It warns that from it both will come what seems to be from the book but is not of it's clear signs. Still it tries to show us we can't often connect and be reminded of the simplest of wisdoms, and see a connection of one verse to another because we have an enemy, a real living enemy with many forces working to keep up from doing so.
Quote: People vary differently, and there is no-one-size-fits-all way to perceive and live your life.
This is true and untrue. It is true from one angle, but it maybe a half truth, and you are missing another angle, or even many angles.
And in this is a huge trial. In learning how we can't ever understand simple advice in Quran, I learn the same is true when we listen to each other.
Still, we may think we understood advice, and it be against us and to our detriment.
Quote: By concentrating only on the Quran, you are boxing yourself in you are not availing yourself of the true pleasure of life, which is searching and figuring out on your own where you fit and what you should be.
"on your own" can be interpreted many ways. Explain what you mean by it and perhaps what you mean by it doesn't contradict my stance or not.
October 17, 2013 at 8:06 am (This post was last modified: October 17, 2013 at 8:23 am by Aractus.)
(October 11, 2013 at 6:48 am)Ilovemyself Wrote: I just want to get out of this trash whole religion, Christianity isn't any different but at least Jesus Christ didn't have sex with an 6 year old when he was 55 like mohammed did.
LOL, well you're dead wrong about Christianity being "no different"!
(October 11, 2013 at 11:34 am)Minimalist Wrote: Don't be mislead by any of these pious xtian assholes you see around here. Given a chance they would be as bloody a bunch of bastards as the muslims you seek to flee.
Oh go grow a pair of balls you fuckwit. I was at a funeral this week for a lady who led an extraordinary Christian life, and in fact one of the things that she did - while she still had her own children living at home, and then after they'd moved out as well - was that she housed the homeless in her own home. I've never in my life met anyone else who has done such a thing, been so generous with their own home as that. And just like op shops, and soup kitchens, and other relief programs run by churches across Australia, we never - ever - discriminate on race, religion, sex, sexuality, or any other lifestyle choice when someone is in need.
(October 11, 2013 at 1:43 pm)Sword of Christ Wrote: Muslims believe in the same God so that's fine of course. I don't think Mohammed was genuine prophet but that's my opinion.
You are such a fucking idiot if you believe that, go and French-kiss your messiah Rick Warren.
(October 11, 2013 at 2:29 pm)Minimalist Wrote: And Hitler was one of you fuckheads.
No he fucking wasn't, go learn your history, he was no more a Christian at the time of Nazi Germany than Muhammad was.
For Religion & Health see:[/b][/size] Williams & Sternthal. (2007). Spirituality, religion and health: Evidence and research directions. Med. J. Aust., 186(10), S47-S50.-LINK
The WIN/Gallup End of Year Survey 2013 found the US was perceived to be the greatest threat to world peace by a huge margin, with 24% of respondents fearful of the US followed by: 8% for Pakistan, and 6% for China. This was followed by 5% each for: Afghanistan, Iran, Israel, North Korea.-LINK
"That's disgusting. There were clean athletes out there that have had their whole careers ruined by people like Lance Armstrong who just bended thoughts to fit their circumstances. He didn't look up cheating because he wanted to stop, he wanted to justify what he was doing and to keep that continuing on." - Nicole Cooke
Majority Muslims believe that besides the quran, other religion books called hadith bukhari/muslim etc, and religious gurus have authority to define islam.
the fact is.. Only al quran is guranteed by Allah.
All nonsense, like having sex with underaged, came from other besides quran.
(October 21, 2013 at 12:31 am)sofia86 Wrote: Majority Muslims believe that besides the quran, other religion books called hadith bukhari/muslim etc, and religious gurus have authority to define islam.
the fact is.. Only al quran is guranteed by Allah.
All nonsense, like having sex with underaged, came from other besides quran.
