Is Eve in Hell right now?

[Foxaèr]

Any evidence I gave would be rejected by you, there's no need in trying.

Real evidence cannot be dismissed. Therefore, you have no real evidence in support of your claim.

How else would I have gotten the idea you did.

Through your need for self validation whereby your imagination gets the better of you.

in this country Christians are riding on the easy train.

That is the truth at least, albeit a truth that should not be reality. After all, theists hold too much sway in how others should live their lives. Thank goodness that is changing. The fortunate truth is that everything evolves except religion. Therefore, religion gets left behind.

[Bob Kelso]

All of God's punishments are just, an omniscient God could do nothing else.

An omniscient God has literally infinite solutions at it's disposal... yet the Judeo-Christian God seems to be hung up on blood, gore, violence and absolutes. Seems rather small minded for a supposed all-knowing god wouldn't you say?

Eve understood if she or Adam ate from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil that death would result, she understood what death was and that it was a punishment, scripture makes that very clear. Many atheist say they do not believe she ans Adam did anything wrong, yet God found both of them hiding in the Garden, they both believed they were wrong in what they did. So her punishment was just.

GC

Saying that Eve understood that she would receive punishment if she and her counterpart ate from the tree is irrelevant. Taking the scripture from a literal standpoint Adam and Eve had absolutely no knowledge of moral action (good & evil), so how could one hold another morally responsible for their actions if they literally knew no better?

That would be akin to holding a beast morally responsible for it's actions (like a lion eating a man).

Furthermore, who is really morally wrong in this situation? The mortals who did not have the capacity to understand the concepts of right and wrong, and how to apply said concepts to their actions, or the infinitely knowledgeable deity who knew that his creations would eat from the tree but still put it there in the bloody garden anyway? Sounds like a set-up to me...

[Wyrd of Gawd]

This is pretty much what I was going to say.

She wouldn't be in heaven because she wouldn't have been able to accept Jesus as her lord and savior, and heaven didn't exist yet. She wouldn't be in hell because hell didn't exist yet.

Apparently, she's in sheol, as is everyone from the first 4,000 years of creation.

I could would probably agree with you on that, except I believe that as of Jesus's sacrifice on the cross, the old testament believers either went to heaven then or will be taken to heaven upon his final coming.

Why can't Bible believers get the damn Bible fairy tale correct? It plainly says that no one has gone to heaven except for Jesus. And guess what? No one will go to heaven. The old heaven will pass away and all of the "good souls" will spent eternity in a giant gaudy bejeweled golden cube called New Jerusalem behind a high wall on a waterless planet in constant light. You can call that heaven if you want but it seems like a maximum security prison to me.

And hell is temporary since everyone in it will get out on Judgment Day. Just because a person spent time in hell doesn't mean that he won't get into the heavenly maximum security prison called New Jerusalem. Of course if he's lucky he will be tossed into the lake of fire and won't spend eternity as a zombie worshiping a nutty deity.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

In the final analysis, God punished Eve unjustly. She ate the fruit from the Tree of Knowledge of Good And Evil. Even though God told her and her hubby not to eat this fruit, prior to eating it, they couldn't possibly have known that disobeying God was an evil act.

So, it doesn't much matter if Eve is in hell or not. Simply by visiting women with pain in childbirth and ejecting the couple from the Garden, God meted out punishment for what was, in Eve's mind, not a sin, not a crime, not an evil act - she simply lacked the requisite knowledge to know that what she was doing was wrong.

It is as if you told your teenage son that he has an 11:00 PM curfew, but you tell him in Mandarin, which he does not speak. He arrives home that night at 11:03 and you beat him with a stick, all the while shouting, 'I told you! I told you!' It doesn't matter whether you told him or not, when he has no way of knowing WHAT you told him.

This sort of thing makes me wonder if there's anything - anything at all - that the Bible got right.

Boru

All of God's punishments are just, an omniscient God could do nothing else.
Eve understood if she or Adam ate from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil that death would result, she understood what death was and that it was a punishment, scripture makes that very clear. Many atheist say they do not believe she ans Adam did anything wrong, yet God found both of them hiding in the Garden, they both believed they were wrong in what they did. So her punishment was just.

GC

Actually, an omniscient God couldn't justly punish anyone at all. If God knows when and where sins are going to be committed (and he does, you just said so yourself) but metes out punishment AFTER the sin takes places, that isn't justice, it is simply some bizarre form of divine entrapment.

Adam and Eve knew what they had done was wrong, but only after the fact - they had no way to know right from wrong until after they committed the act (eating the fruit) for which they were punished. The sin they committed was what gave them the knowledge to know that what they had JUST done was a sin, they couldn't possibly have known beforehand, regardless of what God told them. If God were interested in justice, he would have let them off with a finding of 'diminished capacity'.

Boru

[Confused Ape]

Where Eve ended up depends on what beliefs individual Christians have. Here are examples of how Genesis can be interpreted from the BioLogs site (founded by Francis Collins).

Were Adam And Eve Historical Figures?

Genetic evidence shows that humans descended from a group of several thousand individuals who lived about 150,000 years ago. This conflicts with the traditional view that all humans descended from a single pair who lived about 10,000 years ago. While Genesis 2-3 speaks of the pair Adam and Eve, Genesis 4 refers to a larger population of humans interacting with Cain. One option is to view Adam and Eve as a historical pair living among many 10,000 years ago, chosen to represent the rest of humanity before God. Another option is to view Genesis 2-4 as an allegory in which Adam and Eve symbolize the large group of ancestors who lived 150,000 years ago. Yet another option is to view Genesis 2-4 as an “everyman” story, a parable of each person’s individual rejection of God. BioLogos does not take a particular view and encourages scholarly work on these questions.

[Brakeman]

I think this can help clarify the matter.

[Cato]

You wouldn't see the truth if it kicked your teeth out. You claiming the Bible is a book of fairy tales?

Gnashed out, not kicked out. At least attempt to remain consistent regarding your god's preferred means of dental destruction.

[Bob Kelso]

You wouldn't see the truth if it kicked your teeth out. You claiming the Bible is a book of fairy tales?

Gnashed out, not kicked out. At least attempt to remain consistent regarding your god's preferred means of dental destruction.

Cut him some slack, even the Bible can't get it's consistency straight. With that precedent it's no wonder Christians can't keep it between the lines.

[Chad32]

In the final analysis, God punished Eve unjustly. She ate the fruit from the Tree of Knowledge of Good And Evil. Even though God told her and her hubby not to eat this fruit, prior to eating it, they couldn't possibly have known that disobeying God was an evil act.

So, it doesn't much matter if Eve is in hell or not. Simply by visiting women with pain in childbirth and ejecting the couple from the Garden, God meted out punishment for what was, in Eve's mind, not a sin, not a crime, not an evil act - she simply lacked the requisite knowledge to know that what she was doing was wrong.

It is as if you told your teenage son that he has an 11:00 PM curfew, but you tell him in Mandarin, which he does not speak. He arrives home that night at 11:03 and you beat him with a stick, all the while shouting, 'I told you! I told you!' It doesn't matter whether you told him or not, when he has no way of knowing WHAT you told him.

This sort of thing makes me wonder if there's anything - anything at all - that the Bible got right.

Boru

All of God's punishments are just, an omniscient God could do nothing else.
Eve understood if she or Adam ate from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil that death would result, she understood what death was and that it was a punishment, scripture makes that very clear. Many atheist say they do not believe she ans Adam did anything wrong, yet God found both of them hiding in the Garden, they both believed they were wrong in what they did. So her punishment was just.

GC

How could she possibly understand what death was? Nothing had ever died in front of her. He may as well have said don't do this thing, or you will surely flacshook. There's no reference point here. The only reason they were hiding is because the authors of the bible had been raised to think covering up your body was good. I'm not sure what gave Adam and Eve the idea that being naked was bad. Humans need to be taught this kind of thing, much like everything else.

The Eden story doesn't make sense. Especially if you go with the version that had a Tree of Life, where they'd be immortal if they ate the fruit. Meaning eating the Tree of Knowledge fruit wasn't even what caused them to die. It was Yahweh being mad at them for disobedience.

I don't know how it's possible to convince anyone that a being who punishes people for the crimes of others is a just individual. It should be very easy to convince someone that it's evil. If you believe it's impossible for an omnicient god to do evil, then your god isn't omnicient.

[Confused Ape]

I don't believe in the Genesis story but I still find it interesting. I'm going to use the King James Bible because it's my favourite version and it says the same as other translations for this.

The tree wasn't just knowledge.

9 And out of the ground made the Lord God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

The serpent finds Eve.

4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.

7 And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.

Knowledge and wisdom are two different things. After all, humans can have a lot of knowledge but they don't always use that knowledge wisely.

The first thing Adam and Eve did with the knowledge of good and evil was decide that nakedness was shameful and make aprons to cover the naughty bits. Yes, they invented sexual hangups even though God had told them to be fruitful and multiply and hadn't given them clothes.

11 And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat?

12 And the man said, The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat.

13 And the Lord God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.

When God turned up he gave them a chance to explain why they disobeyed but, instead of taking responsibility for their own actions, Adam blamed Eve and Eve blamed the serpent. So, for all their knowledge of good and evil they didn't have the wisdom to figure out that putting the blame on someone else is wrong.

So what happens if we take God out of it and just go with evolution?

Humans evolved big brains and the ability to judge things as good or evil but our species has an awful tendency to think on the lines of "My group good, other group bad so kill other group". We have a lot of knowledge but the way we've wrecked the planet proves that we haven't always been wise when it comes to applying our knowledge. And how often do humans blame other humans for their own actions?

So where did Eve end up? The same place as Adam. They're in the 21st century wondering if we're going to survive climate change and all the pollution.