Open to all-would you sacrifice your child if god told you to?

[Mudhammam]

God said He would never require child sacrifice.

GC

Man, he like deserves a gold star for that. Though admittedly, it wouldn't matter if he did, because he would still be awesome in your mind and you'd still obey.

[ShaMan]

I would ask why he didn't tell me to do it before I paid 15 years of child support!

[Bob Kelso]

---

There you go again throwing out hypothetical delusions that have nothing to do with my life, like I said I have no fear of God ever asking anyone to do such a thing because I know Him well enough to understand He want.

GC, quit being overly literal: I was asking you to employ what us normal humans call "empathy" and place yourself in Isaac's shoes.

If you were to look past the end of your biased nose, you would see that Christians do not even consider that God would ask such. These kind of things come from the ignorance of non believers.
I understand what the story says, and Issac goes through the rest of his life without any negative effects from the experience, you do not understand what trusting God means, so how do you even believe you can speak for those who do.

Great, so the story is an unrealistic mess with bad characterization. Now that we've got that established, would you accept that, for a child, being threatened with murder is a frightening act?

It's not me who has bias problems, I rely on God's truth and it has worked out just fine for many years.

Except that it's turned you into an intractable douchebag without a shred of empathy in you. If that's fine to you, then so be it.

I know it did.

Once again you abuse the word "knowledge." Knowledge is demonstrated, not merely asserted. You believe it happened, but you can't know anything you have no evidence for.

No, and it is ridiculous for you to even say so, you're getting desperate for an argument. Like I told you the answer is in scripture but it resides in many places in the OT and NT, I'm not posting something that is so long you or no one will read it, I promised myself after being told atheist were not interested in my long but necessary posts, that I wouldn't trouble myself or them. Can you understand this little quote from Abraham, "God will Provide."

So basically, you refuse to support any of your assertions? Can anyone say "rule one violation"?

Why should I care, then? You bugged me for proof earlier, and now you won't provide any? Hypocrisy, much?

The stories about Abraham's faith that God will provide and his trust that God would not go back on His promise of this son. Yes Abraham was taking Issac all the way because he knew God was faithful in His promise. If you do not think Abraham had faith that his son would not be a sacrifice, then explain why he told the servant that went with them to the mountain, we will return, not I but, we. I've not undercut anything the entire stories about faith and righteousness not sacrifice, this is apparently something you can't see.

GC

So, to be clear: you don't think that Abraham might be lying, because his son was present and to speak of returning by himself might be seen as ominous? Or that the two guys he brought with him might find what he planned to do to be somewhat messed up? Or that it's a translation error?

The whole point of the story is that Abraham was willing to sacrifice Isaac, that he was "a god-fearing man, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son, from me." He might have had faith that the lord would provide, but the thing that's exalted in the story as a noble act was Abraham's willingness to go all the way. If you remove that motivation from the story by saying he figured god would hook him up in the end, then everything the angel says to him at the climax of the tale makes no sense, it'd just be an elaborate game of make believe.

---

Oh, look at that, another post that rammed logic up GC's ass and he ignores it yet again. Huh, interesting, it's... it's almost like a pattern.

[Godscreated]

---

There you go again throwing out hypothetical delusions that have nothing to do with my life, like I said I have no fear of God ever asking anyone to do such a thing because I know Him well enough to understand He want.

---

GC, quit being overly literal: I was asking you to employ what us normal humans call "empathy" and place yourself in Isaac's shoes.

You're the one who brought up the idea of my dad and me, if you wanted me to put myself in Issac's place you should have said so. Issac never indicates he has a problem with the situation, you need to prove he did before making a claim that he was scared for life.

If you were to look past the end of your biased nose, you would see that Christians do not even consider that God would ask such. These kind of things come from the ignorance of non believers.
I understand what the story says, and Issac goes through the rest of his life without any negative effects from the experience, you do not understand what trusting God means, so how do you even believe you can speak for those who do.

Great, so the story is an unrealistic mess with bad characterization. Now that we've got that established, would you accept that, for a child, being threatened with murder is a frightening act?

I didn't say that, it's all part of your delusional idea to misrepresent scripture. So, nothing is established that comes from that deluded mind of your's. Issac wasn't threatened with murder, God as creator has the right to take the life of any of His creations. Besides in the story Issac shows no doubt of his part in this action between him, his father and God.

It's not me who has bias problems, I rely on God's truth and it has worked out just fine for many years.

Except that it's turned you into an intractable douchebag without a shred of empathy in you. If that's fine to you, then so be it.

You have no idea as to who I am and what I do, you are a judgmental person that claims Christians are the only ones who judge, double standard me thinks. You judge unjustly making you the one with no empathy for others.

I know it did.

Once again you abuse the word "knowledge." Knowledge is demonstrated, not merely asserted. You believe it happened, but you can't know anything you have no evidence for.

Just because you refuse to believe doesn't make what I know untrue, your biased opinions are worthless.

---

No, and it is ridiculous for you to even say so, you're getting desperate for an argument. Like I told you the answer is in scripture but it resides in many places in the OT and NT, I'm not posting something that is so long you or no one will read it, I promised myself after being told atheist were not interested in my long but necessary posts, that I wouldn't trouble myself or them. Can you understand this little quote from Abraham, "God will Provide."

---

So basically, you refuse to support any of your assertions? Can anyone say "rule one violation"?

No, I did not say that either and, it's not a violation when one is told it want be read. I bet you think your cute using all those little icons, just shows how inadequate you are.

Why should I care, then? You bugged me for proof earlier, and now you won't provide any? Hypocrisy, much?

Where's your proof, pot calling the kettle black me thinks.

---

The stories about Abraham's faith that God will provide and his trust that God would not go back on His promise of this son. Yes Abraham was taking Issac all the way because he knew God was faithful in His promise. If you do not think Abraham had faith that his son would not be a sacrifice, then explain why he told the servant that went with them to the mountain, we will return, not I but, we. I've not undercut anything the entire stories about faith and righteousness not sacrifice, this is apparently something you can't see.

GC

---

So, to be clear: you don't think that Abraham might be lying, because his son was present and to speak of returning by himself might be seen as ominous? Or that the two guys he brought with him might find what he planned to do to be somewhat messed up? Or that it's a translation error?

Yes let's be clear that you're interjecting your opinion into the story to change the story to suit your purpose, a purpose of delusional hypothesis that has no place in real life, it's not Christians who are living deluded lives through what you call fairy tales, it's people like you who delude themselves with hypothetical lives.
Abraham told Issac that God would provide the sacrifice and God did, Abraham knew God had a perfect plan and was willing to follow it to see what God's desire was, and he found out what God wanted because of his trust and faith.

The whole point of the story is that Abraham was willing to sacrifice Isaac, that he was "a god-fearing man, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son, from me." He might have had faith that the lord would provide, but the thing that's exalted in the story as a noble act was Abraham's willingness to go all the way. If you remove that motivation from the story by saying he figured god would hook him up in the end, then everything the angel says to him at the climax of the tale makes no sense, it'd just be an elaborate game of make believe.

If Abraham did go through with the sacrifice, he would have done it knowing God would have raised Issac from death, the promise of the nation was going to continue through Issac and Abraham knew this, his faith in God's justice was complete. Do you really think that an omniscient God would need to put Abraham through this to know what he would do, this was for Abraham and to show future generations he was worthy to be the father of this nation God was building.

GC

[Mr Greene]

That's a heck of a lot of effort trying to evade a fairly obvious question.
I usually only encounter this sort of thing when someone is trying to 'explain' items on their criminal records...

[Mudhammam]

GC is a hopeless cause. He doesn't want to embrace reality, or maybe he feels he can't. Perhaps, for reasons free thinkers can only pity, he'd rather squander his life in pursuit of delusional fantasies.

[Godscreated]

GC is a hopeless cause. He doesn't want to embrace reality, or maybe he feels he can't. Perhaps, for reasons free thinkers can only pity, he'd rather squander his life in pursuit of delusional fantasies.

I live a fuller life than you will ever be able to understand, so save your pity for yourself I certainly don't need it.

GC

[Rampant.A.I.]

GC is a hopeless cause. He doesn't want to embrace reality, or maybe he feels he can't. Perhaps, for reasons free thinkers can only pity, he'd rather squander his life in pursuit of delusional fantasies.

I live a fuller life than you will ever be able to understand, so save your pity for yourself I certainly don't need it.

GC

[Esquilax]

You're the one who brought up the idea of my dad and me, if you wanted me to put myself in Issac's place you should have said so. Issac never indicates he has a problem with the situation, you need to prove he did before making a claim that he was scared for life.

"Isaac was totally okay with his dad tying him to an altar and almost killing him with a knife!"

Seriously? Is that your claim?

Have you ever, like, seen another human being?

I didn't say that, it's all part of your delusional idea to misrepresent scripture. So, nothing is established that comes from that deluded mind of your's. Issac wasn't threatened with murder, God as creator has the right to take the life of any of His creations. Besides in the story Issac shows no doubt of his part in this action between him, his father and God.

GC, part of writing well is being able to portray realistic emotional nuance. It's not a controversial claim to say that people don't like being killed or stabbed, is it? The fact that the story- constructed from the ground up to impart a message that represents an untenable bias against showing any of the realistic consequences of the actual actions- doesn't show Isaac reacting negatively only shows that the writer probably thought having a child react in the properly traumatized way would detract from the message he wanted to impart, which was that it's totally cool to sacrifice everything for god.

I'll ignore your absolutely terrible sentence construction as a favor to you, and I'll ignore the "god has the right to kill us!" line because it's patently ridiculous, but the fact that you point out yet more unrealistic writing doesn't excuse that it's bad writing.

You have no idea as to who I am and what I do, you are a judgmental person that claims Christians are the only ones who judge, double standard me thinks. You judge unjustly making you the one with no empathy for others.

"No, you!" - GC, 2014.

When did I ever say christians are the only ones who judge, incidentally?

Just because you refuse to believe doesn't make what I know untrue, your biased opinions are worthless.

Okay, let's play it this way, then: I know god doesn't exist. I know you're wrong. I know the Abraham story didn't happen. I know it, I know it, I know it.

Whoops, guess that's all true now, huh?

Where's your proof, pot calling the kettle black me thinks.

Are you... are you seriously still asking me to provide proof that people don't like to be stabbed? Is this seriously a thing, that you're doing?

Also, how can you accuse me of hypocrisy during the part of my post where I was pointing out your initial hypocrisy that's exactly the same as what you're accusing me of without your head exploding through sheer irony?

Yes let's be clear that you're interjecting your opinion into the story to change the story to suit your purpose,

I don't know where I ever could have gotten the idea to do that! hock:

a purpose of delusional hypothesis that has no place in real life, it's not Christians who are living deluded lives through what you call fairy tales, it's people like you who delude themselves with hypothetical lives.

Man, you are really swinging wild and responding to things I never said, here. Can anyone say "projection"?

Abraham told Issac that God would provide the sacrifice and God did, Abraham knew God had a perfect plan and was willing to follow it to see what God's desire was, and he found out what God wanted because of his trust and faith.

If the angel hadn't stopped him, would Abraham have gone through with the sacrifice? Or would he have just stood there, frozen like a statue with the knife raised aloft until narrative momentum resumed?

If Abraham did go through with the sacrifice, he would have done it knowing God would have raised Issac from death,

Where in the bible is that line?

the promise of the nation was going to continue through Issac and Abraham knew this, his faith in God's justice was complete. Do you really think that an omniscient God would need to put Abraham through this to know what he would do, this was for Abraham and to show future generations he was worthy to be the father of this nation God was building.

GC

The line the angel speaks immediately after stopping Abraham says otherwise. But hey, I'm only reading what the text says, what would that say?

For all your accusations of twisting the text, you sure as fuck don't seem to be terribly interested in what it says yourself, GC.

[Mudhammam]

GC is a hopeless cause. He doesn't want to embrace reality, or maybe he feels he can't. Perhaps, for reasons free thinkers can only pity, he'd rather squander his life in pursuit of delusional fantasies.

I live a fuller life than you will ever be able to understand, so save your pity for yourself I certainly don't need it.

GC

Yes, I'm sure your life is on par with Napoleon at the psyche ward. Which is to say, what a sad waste of pathetic delusions.