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RE: Yes I pick on all religions.
September 13, 2014 at 4:19 pm
(September 13, 2014 at 4:07 pm)Pickup_shonuff Wrote: (September 13, 2014 at 3:50 pm)Simon Moon Wrote: No.
They just compartmentalize their theistic beliefs.
They put them in a special place in their minds where they refuse or fail to evaluate them with the same level of critical thinking they use for all the other supernatural and extraordinary claims they have rejected.
Ask these critical thinking theists why they reject; bigfoot, UFO abductions, ancient aliens, levitating gurus, crystal healing, Tarot, etc, etc and they will almost assuredly reject them for the correct reasons (lack of: evidence, reasoned argument and valid/sound logic).
Ask them why they believe in a god, and you will not get the same level of critical thinking. You will get mental gymnastics.
Not really.
Where are the elite scientists and professors at prestigious schools who ascribe to any of those ideas you just mentioned? Maybe they're non-existent because there's a stark difference in the reasoning behind them?
You don't think the psychologists, psychiatrists, neuroscientists and philosophers at the elite schools accept and understand (at least to some degree) mental compartmentalization?
There certainly no lack of experiments that demonstrate it.
You'd believe if you just opened your heart" is a terrible argument for religion. It's basically saying, "If you bias yourself enough, you can convince yourself that this is true." If religion were true, people wouldn't need faith to believe it -- it would be supported by good evidence.
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RE: Yes I pick on all religions.
September 13, 2014 at 4:21 pm
So you have nothing Brian... You want me to go discuss it with someone else because you don't actually have those logical objections that you claimed to have.
I'm fine defending my faith and discussing it openly. I'm fine with all exploration of belief, including non belief. I can go do that, and let you of the hook in here.
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RE: Yes I pick on all religions.
September 13, 2014 at 4:23 pm
I think that what brian is getting at here is that jews and muslims and hindus and all the rest, will use the same arguments and reasoning as you but come to different conclusions.
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: Yes I pick on all religions.
September 13, 2014 at 4:29 pm
To me they all say the same thing Wolfie. It's an exploration of a particular subject. Atheism has a perspective on it too. I find all if it interesting. I'm not a universalist though. I can still keep my own identity whilst appreciating complimentary ideas. I certainly don't see the reason for hostility, which is what motivated me to post in this thread. It seems that the hostility it groundless, which is good.
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RE: Yes I pick on all religions.
September 13, 2014 at 4:32 pm
They use the same reasoning as you and yet come to different conclusions. That means that there is something wrong with your reasoning.
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: Yes I pick on all religions.
September 13, 2014 at 4:38 pm
That's too simplistic a view Wolfie. Any isolated idea can be perfect on its own. Any ideas on God can be good or bad. How do I consider non belief if I'm not prepared to entertain it?
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RE: Yes I pick on all religions.
September 13, 2014 at 4:39 pm
(September 13, 2014 at 4:29 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: To me they all say the same thing Wolfie. It's an exploration of a particular subject. Atheism has a perspective on it too. I find all if it interesting. I'm not a universalist though. I can still keep my own identity whilst appreciating complimentary ideas. I certainly don't see the reason for hostility, which is what motivated me to post in this thread. It seems that the hostility it groundless, which is good.
You think you have a playbook for this but we've played this chess game before and years before we even met you personally.
If they are all the same, then you should be able to put that ball on the roulette wheel and whatever the ball lands on you simply buy and believe. They are not all the same to you otherwise it would not matter to you what god you believe in.
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RE: Yes I pick on all religions.
September 13, 2014 at 4:44 pm
I'm interested in the subject and adhere to one particular belief Brian. Sure. I can see similarities across them all. I don't dismiss alternate views out of hand. I think they're interesting and helpful to understand. If I come across information that trumps my own I have no option but to go with it. I cant believe something that I disagree with. I don't think that's possible. I would imagine that's the same for you too. We all believe what to the best of our knowledge is correct.
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RE: Yes I pick on all religions.
September 13, 2014 at 4:50 pm
(September 13, 2014 at 4:32 pm)Bad Wolf Wrote: They use the same reasoning as you and yet come to different conclusions. That means that there is something wrong with your reasoning.
BINBO!
When you have competing claims once you listen to all those competing claims you notice the pattern that they are using the same flawed logic, the fact that they come to different god claims and different books to justify those claims still starts with a naked assertion.
Once you start from a naked assertion, anything that follows is going to be a house of cards built on sand. It is the same no matter who does this or what pet god claim they have.
Evidence that is universal is not based on a naked assertion. It is built on prior established and tested data, and will pass any scrutiny of outsiders when the data is correct and the methodology is sound.
"Faith" does not do that nor can it do that.
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RE: Yes I pick on all religions.
September 13, 2014 at 5:01 pm
(September 13, 2014 at 4:50 pm)Brian37 Wrote: once you listen to all those competing claims you notice the pattern that they are using the same flawed logic
... but I don't know what that flawed logic is, so please don't ask
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