'Drich, which of the millions of different christian denominations goes to Heaven?'

[dyresand]

You got caught lying, Drich.

Pity you're not man enough to own your mistakes; you'll never learn from them without this step. What a little pissant.

Could Dirch get a custom award for being a lair? It should be a Dunce hat.

[Ryantology]

No you can't Because Attonement Is Just As Much Appart of the Law and the Do's and Don't's If youre not serious about attonement then you have not followed the law. That is what you can not seem to grasp.

And you can't logically be serious about atonement if you think atonement is the only part of the law that applies to you. That is what you cannot seem to grasp. If the law is perfect, then every word of it is to be followed at all times, to the best of your ability.

"Attonement" is the "Smallest part" Jesus talks about that does not go away. It is also the part (when attoned through His blood) that elevates one's efforts to being greater than the pharisees.

Which, to you, means "I don't have to follow any of the other rules that make up the law", and Jesus very plainly and directly warns against interpreting it that way.

Do you have a biblical example of this or is this ryantology doctrine?

If this is just ryantology doctrine know we are having a biblical Christianity discussion and your particular doctrine does not apply.

It's not doctrinal at all. It's common sense that words not backed up with actions are meaningless. You say all the right things, but you don't respect the law or hold to it. You invent your own Drichian interpretation which would be accepted under no circumstances by anybody, unless they want rewards they don't feel like working to earn.

Ok, great let's do it your way. Show me book Chapter and verse oh great prophet.

James 2:10

For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.

For some reason, you read this as As long as you say you're sorry on a regular basis for breaking the law, you can ignore all of the laws you want."

Because you only see 1/2 the law as having any meaning. Because you hold a ryantologist doctrine of sincerity over that of the biblical doctrine of repentance, need I go on?

I hold the common sense idea that insincere repentance isn't repentance at all. It's lying for personal gain.

Then please support your assertion. Remeber Book Chapter and verse no 'doctrine.'

I don't think you're so important that the Bible would have anything to say about what a liar and a fraud you are. All I have to say is that inventing your own personal idea of canon doesn't mean jack to anybody but yourself. And, in the end, you are the god you worship and love.

Honestly, that doesn't make you a false Christian, but only because most Christians worship themselves and their perceptions just like you do.

[dyresand]

No you can't Because Attonement Is Just As Much Appart of the Law and the Do's and Don't's If youre not serious about attonement then you have not followed the law. That is what you can not seem to grasp.

And you can't logically be serious about atonement if you think atonement is the only part of the law that applies to you. That is what you cannot seem to grasp. If the law is perfect, then every word of it is to be followed at all times, to the best of your ability.

"Attonement" is the "Smallest part" Jesus talks about that does not go away. It is also the part (when attoned through His blood) that elevates one's efforts to being greater than the pharisees.

Which, to you, means "I don't have to follow any of the other rules that make up the law", and Jesus very plainly and directly warns against interpreting it that way.

Do you have a biblical example of this or is this ryantology doctrine?

If this is just ryantology doctrine know we are having a biblical Christianity discussion and your particular doctrine does not apply.

It's not doctrinal at all. It's common sense that words not backed up with actions are meaningless. You say all the right things, but you don't respect the law or hold to it. You invent your own Drichian interpretation which would be accepted under no circumstances by anybody, unless they want rewards they don't feel like working to earn.

Ok, great let's do it your way. Show me book Chapter and verse oh great prophet.

James 2:10

For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.

For some reason, you read this as As long as you say you're sorry on a regular basis for breaking the law, you can ignore all of the laws you want."

Because you only see 1/2 the law as having any meaning. Because you hold a ryantologist doctrine of sincerity over that of the biblical doctrine of repentance, need I go on?

I hold the common sense idea that insincere repentance isn't repentance at all. It's lying for personal gain.

Then please support your assertion. Remeber Book Chapter and verse no 'doctrine.'

I don't think you're so important that the Bible would have anything to say about what a liar and a fraud you are. All I have to say is that inventing your own personal idea of canon doesn't mean jack to anybody but yourself. And, in the end, you are the god you worship and love.

Honestly, that doesn't make you a false Christian, but only because most Christians worship themselves and their perceptions just like you do.

Dirch has already been caught.. lying its pointless to keep dragging it on.

[Spooky]

[h4ym4n]

Yes, I did not have a house for a while and I was cast out of my Father's house for my beliefs. (We/my sister and myself) decided to work an innercity program to late one sunday night rather than honoring my father's birthday. He told me then in their it was him or God. I choose God so that night in a drunk rage threw me and my sister out cramed everything I owned in the back of his truck and dumped on the front lawn of the house I was staying. Everything was wet from the rain so I threw it the damaged stuff away, and gave away everything else. (To those in greater need.) It wasn't long till it all came pouring back 10x's over. This is something that has happened a few more times durning my life and each time more is returned than what was lost. This happened again when I took my sister and her new born in (her husband went up north to work, and was supposed to send money home..) I lost almost everything helping them out. again, when my first business failed and my partner ran up huge bills in my name, I had to sell everything to pay his debt. And again I gave everything helping my new wife out of a 2 or 3 hundred dollar aday herorin addiction. (Literally everything I had of value was at a pawn shop) I had to let all of that go to help her. would have lost the place we were staying if not for God's help, even so was willing to let it all go. and it has all come back 10x's over.

Even now we live at a very minimal level so we can do or give when we see a need. we could easily live up with or even exceed the jones' if we went into massive debt like everyone else. Even with our business everything is paid for just incase I have to give it all back, and start over. (I can do so with out stiffing anyone)

I don't look forward to doing these give aways, but will do so willingly when God

Hey drich, what do you think the 20,000 children that God kills with starvation each and everyday need to do differently?

[Drich]

Yes, I did not have a house for a while and I was cast out of my Father's house for my beliefs. (We/my sister and myself) decided to work an innercity program to late one sunday night rather than honoring my father's birthday. He told me then in their it was him or God. I choose God so that night in a drunk rage threw me and my sister out cramed everything I owned in the back of his truck and dumped on the front lawn of the house I was staying. Everything was wet from the rain so I threw it the damaged stuff away, and gave away everything else. (To those in greater need.) It wasn't long till it all came pouring back 10x's over. This is something that has happened a few more times durning my life and each time more is returned than what was lost. This happened again when I took my sister and her new born in (her husband went up north to work, and was supposed to send money home..) I lost almost everything helping them out. again, when my first business failed and my partner ran up huge bills in my name, I had to sell everything to pay his debt. And again I gave everything helping my new wife out of a 2 or 3 hundred dollar aday herorin addiction. (Literally everything I had of value was at a pawn shop) I had to let all of that go to help her. would have lost the place we were staying if not for God's help, even so was willing to let it all go. and it has all come back 10x's over.

Even now we live at a very minimal level so we can do or give when we see a need. we could easily live up with or even exceed the jones' if we went into massive debt like everyone else. Even with our business everything is paid for just incase I have to give it all back, and start over. (I can do so with out stiffing anyone)

I don't look forward to doing these give aways, but will do so willingly when God

Hey drich, what do you think the 20,000 children that God kills with starvation each and everyday need to do differently?

What makes you think God killed them? What "evidence" do you have?

[Spooky]

Hey drich, what do you think the 20,000 children that God kills with starvation each and everyday need to do differently?

What makes you think God killed them? What "evidence" do you have?

Often times it's what isn't there that can be submitted as "evidence". Neither god nor her assistance are present. Silence can speak volumes.

[Drich]

That is what you cannot seem to grasp. If the law is perfect, then every word of it is to be followed at all times, to the best of your ability.

i have biblically shown that 'doing your best' per the very words of Christ and the deeds of the Pharisees are not enough, even with them following the rules of attonement as they knew them. Christ himself has expressly told us through his interactions with everyone concerning matters of sin/the law that doing you best to follow the law is not enough I even showed this in verse 20 of Matt 5 where he says our 'righteousness' must exceed the efforts of the holiest people to ever live by the law of Moses. So your claim that one must live by the law and do their best to just up hold the do's and don't's of the law is in error. That is unless you can show with BCV that what you claim here is supported, your preaching unfounded empty religious doctrine.

And you can't logically be serious about atonement if you think atonement is the only part of the law that applies to you.

no I never said that. The whole law applies to everyone, as it is the standard we will all be judged by. Jesus even went so far as to extend the law to include involentary thought. Why? To show us we all sin all the time and it is truly not possible to keep the law as we will never have that kind of control over ourselves as being slaves to sin. Therefore a sacrifice was offered to cover all sin for all of man's time. Again the law still applies even to the n'th degree Christ stepped it up in mat 5. As per Paul in the book of Romans more specifically chapter 7 says the whole law still applies, but we being literal slaves to sin have no hope in full filling that law. And as "doing your best" to full fill that law is a fairy tale preists made as a short cut to explaining the love needed to to have us keep the law. We must find an alternative to following the law as a means to righteousness. Why? Because Christ's work on the cross cancels out sin. If we die in Christ if we put on Christ's death as our own payment for sin, then according to Paul in romans 7 again we are free from the consenquences of the law. Why? Because Christ took those consenquences upon Himself. He literally pay our sin debt with His death.

7 Brothers and sisters, you all understand the Law of Moses. So surely you know that the law rules over people only while they are alive. 2 It’s like what the law says about marriage: A woman must stay married to her husband as long as he is alive. But if her husband dies, she is made free from the law of marriage. 3 But if she marries another man while her husband is still alive, the law says she is guilty of adultery. But if her husband dies, she is made free from the law of marriage. So if she marries another man after her husband dies, she is not guilty of adultery.

4 In the same way, my brothers and sisters, your old selves died and you became free from the law through the body of Christ. Now you belong to someone else. You belong to the one who was raised from death. We belong to Christ so that we can be used in service to God. 5 In the past we were ruled by our sinful selves. The law made us want to do sinful things. And those sinful desires controlled our bodies, so that what we did only brought us spiritual death. 6 In the past the law held us as prisoners, but our old selves died, and we were made free from the law. So now we serve God in a new way, not in the old way, with the written rules. Now we serve God in the new way, with the Spirit.

Which, to you, means "I don't have to follow any of the other rules that make up the law", and Jesus very plainly and directly warns against interpreting it that way.

again we are still completely under the same law. We are just operating under the rules of a completed attonement, rather than a partial attonement.

Under partial attonement people had to watch and count what they did so as to properly atone for their sin. Now as Paul says in romans 7 we have been freed from the rules of attonement because Christ died in our place.

It's not doctrinal at all. It's common sense that words not backed up with actions are meaningless. You say all the right things, but you don't respect the law or hold to it. You invent your own Drichian interpretation which would be accepted under no circumstances by anybody, unless they want rewards they don't feel like working to earn.

when I showed you where Christ rebuked the pharisees for holding to the law
As you have described, I proved that your version of 'common sense' is not what we are being judged by. Again we were told we much exceed the righteousness of the Pharrisees. Not mirror it by doing the best we can. The reason you can't find anything to support this claim is because this is not a biblical concept. I went 3 weeks with a pulpit minister on this and he really pulled out all the stops, but in the end his best efforts were to point to tradition, and his authority in the church. Why? Because the people who wrote the bible knew that keeping the law was not possible, therefore any effort would be pointless because our righteousness was not based on the law anymore. It was completely based in attonement. (Which again is indeed the law)

So rather that adhearance to the dos and donts they taught attonement and adhearance to the moral law as a tribute of love to God. Why? Because mat 22:36 He said, “Teacher, which command in the law is the most important?”

37 Jesus answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, and all your mind.’[a] 38 This is the first and most important command. 39 And the second command is like the first: ‘Love your neighbor[b] the same as you love yourself.’[c] 40 All of the law and the writings of the prophets take their meaning from these two commands.”

James 2:10

For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.

For some reason, you read this as As long as you say you're sorry on a regular basis for breaking the law, you can ignore all of the laws you want."

nuupe. Again more church/ryantology doctrine. Our sins are forgiven by God as we forgive those who sin against us. As per the Lord's Prayer and the parable of the unmerciful servant. (Both Jesus taught principles) Not as a result of some traditional confession ritual.

I hold the common sense idea that insincere repentance isn't repentance at all. It's lying for personal gain.

don't get me wrong I am all for common sense, but the problem is common sense is not so common any more. So what we generally have left is personal sense. Like I show you before Jesus Himself told us following the law was not good enough. To me "common sense" demands that a common sense abider looks for another means to righteousness. But here you are play the same tune, over and over again despite the fact the bible does not support your 'personal sense.'

Brother if it did know you would be hating me for a whole bunch of different reasons. I would be the Pharisees of pharisees. But, sadly we must all live in freedom and worship God with all of our being.

I don't think you're so important that the Bible would have anything to say about what a liar and a fraud you are. All I have to say is that inventing your own personal idea of canon doesn't mean jack to anybody but yourself. And, in the end, you are the god you worship and love.

Honestly, that doesn't make you a false Christian, but only because most Christians worship themselves and their perceptions just like you do.

Again I have parables, rebukes and chapters of teachings from Christ not to mention an entire book from Paul to support everything I have said here. What do you have? What you remember from a failed attempt at Christianity? Brother, it failed for a good reason. Your understanding of the religion and of God was corrupt. It was doomed to fail because the God of the bible did not support what you understood. That is the reason your on the otherside of this conversation and why you can not find a scrap of scripture to support your position, and why I have volumes to support mine.

---

And you can't logically be serious about atonement if you think atonement is the only part of the law that applies to you. That is what you cannot seem to grasp. If the law is perfect, then every word of it is to be followed at all times, to the best of your ability.


Which, to you, means "I don't have to follow any of the other rules that make up the law", and Jesus very plainly and directly warns against interpreting it that way.


It's not doctrinal at all. It's common sense that words not backed up with actions are meaningless. You say all the right things, but you don't respect the law or hold to it. You invent your own Drichian interpretation which would be accepted under no circumstances by anybody, unless they want rewards they don't feel like working to earn.


James 2:10

For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.

For some reason, you read this as As long as you say you're sorry on a regular basis for breaking the law, you can ignore all of the laws you want."


I hold the common sense idea that insincere repentance isn't repentance at all. It's lying for personal gain.


I don't think you're so important that the Bible would have anything to say about what a liar and a fraud you are. All I have to say is that inventing your own personal idea of canon doesn't mean jack to anybody but yourself. And, in the end, you are the god you worship and love.

Honestly, that doesn't make you a false Christian, but only because most Christians worship themselves and their perceptions just like you do.

Dirch has already been caught.. lying its pointless to keep dragging it on.

Lying about what? What evidence do you have?

---

What makes you think God killed them? What "evidence" do you have?

Often times it's what isn't there that can be submitted as "evidence". Neither god nor her assistance are present. Silence can speak volumes.

I don't get it how is that evidence against God?

God provided the food, the medicines and the infrastructure to get everything these people need, and even charged us with doing that very thing... So again how does this relate to God's failure?

Now I could see an arguement if planet wide there was nothing, but in western cultures we have such an over abundance of food we date it, and throw it away whether it is good or bad...

To me this seems like a failure of those whom God entrusted with an over abundance and charged to feed those in need...

Remember to the measure you use to judge, will be used against you.

If you did not see God or his servants helping those twenty thousand children who died, I would ask did you expect to from Where you are sitting?

---

I made the dyslexia comment because you have made grammar and spelling mistakes in previous posts, and because you seemed to struggle with understanding and reading some posts.

We brought this up when he first took up residence. He doesn't care. Apparently spellcheck is not A Thing.

If you misspell something long enough the same way spell check 'learns' your spelling and does not correct.

[dyresand]

---

That is what you cannot seem to grasp. If the law is perfect, then every word of it is to be followed at all times, to the best of your ability.

i have biblically shown that 'doing your best' per the very words of Christ and the deeds of the Pharisees are not enough, even with them following the rules of attonement as they knew them. Christ himself has expressly told us through his interactions with everyone concerning matters of sin/the law that doing you best to follow the law is not enough I even showed this in verse 20 of Matt 5 where he says our 'righteousness' must exceed the efforts of the holiest people to ever live by the law of Moses. So your claim that one must live by the law and do their best to just up hold the do's and don't's of the law is in error. That is unless you can show with BCV that what you claim here is supported, your preaching unfounded empty religious doctrine.

And you can't logically be serious about atonement if you think atonement is the only part of the law that applies to you.

no I never said that. The whole law applies to everyone, as it is the standard we will all be judged by. Jesus even went so far as to extend the law to include involentary thought. Why? To show us we all sin all the time and it is truly not possible to keep the law as we will never have that kind of control over ourselves as being slaves to sin. Therefore a sacrifice was offered to cover all sin for all of man's time. Again the law still applies even to the n'th degree Christ stepped it up in mat 5. As per Paul in the book of Romans more specifically chapter 7 says the whole law still applies, but we being literal slaves to sin have no hope in full filling that law. And as "doing your best" to full fill that law is a fairy tale preists made as a short cut to explaining the love needed to to have us keep the law. We must find an alternative to following the law as a means to righteousness. Why? Because Christ's work on the cross cancels out sin. If we die in Christ if we put on Christ's death as our own payment for sin, then according to Paul in romans 7 again we are free from the consenquences of the law. Why? Because Christ took those consenquences upon Himself. He literally pay our sin debt with His death.

7 Brothers and sisters, you all understand the Law of Moses. So surely you know that the law rules over people only while they are alive. 2 It’s like what the law says about marriage: A woman must stay married to her husband as long as he is alive. But if her husband dies, she is made free from the law of marriage. 3 But if she marries another man while her husband is still alive, the law says she is guilty of adultery. But if her husband dies, she is made free from the law of marriage. So if she marries another man after her husband dies, she is not guilty of adultery.

4 In the same way, my brothers and sisters, your old selves died and you became free from the law through the body of Christ. Now you belong to someone else. You belong to the one who was raised from death. We belong to Christ so that we can be used in service to God. 5 In the past we were ruled by our sinful selves. The law made us want to do sinful things. And those sinful desires controlled our bodies, so that what we did only brought us spiritual death. 6 In the past the law held us as prisoners, but our old selves died, and we were made free from the law. So now we serve God in a new way, not in the old way, with the written rules. Now we serve God in the new way, with the Spirit.

Which, to you, means "I don't have to follow any of the other rules that make up the law", and Jesus very plainly and directly warns against interpreting it that way.

again we are still completely under the same law. We are just operating under the rules of a completed attonement, rather than a partial attonement.

Under partial attonement people had to watch and count what they did so as to properly atone for their sin. Now as Paul says in romans 7 we have been freed from the rules of attonement because Christ died in our place.

It's not doctrinal at all. It's common sense that words not backed up with actions are meaningless. You say all the right things, but you don't respect the law or hold to it. You invent your own Drichian interpretation which would be accepted under no circumstances by anybody, unless they want rewards they don't feel like working to earn.

when I showed you where Christ rebuked the pharisees for holding to the law
As you have described, I proved that your version of 'common sense' is not what we are being judged by. Again we were told we much exceed the righteousness of the Pharrisees. Not mirror it by doing the best we can. The reason you can't find anything to support this claim is because this is not a biblical concept. I went 3 weeks with a pulpit minister on this and he really pulled out all the stops, but in the end his best efforts were to point to tradition, and his authority in the church. Why? Because the people who wrote the bible knew that keeping the law was not possible, therefore any effort would be pointless because our righteousness was not based on the law anymore. It was completely based in attonement. (Which again is indeed the law)

So rather that adhearance to the dos and donts they taught attonement and adhearance to the moral law as a tribute of love to God. Why? Because mat 22:36 He said, “Teacher, which command in the law is the most important?”

37 Jesus answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, and all your mind.’[a] 38 This is the first and most important command. 39 And the second command is like the first: ‘Love your neighbor[b] the same as you love yourself.’[c] 40 All of the law and the writings of the prophets take their meaning from these two commands.”

James 2:10

For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.

For some reason, you read this as As long as you say you're sorry on a regular basis for breaking the law, you can ignore all of the laws you want."

nuupe. Again more church/ryantology doctrine. Our sins are forgiven by God as we forgive those who sin against us. As per the Lord's Prayer and the parable of the unmerciful servant. (Both Jesus taught principles) Not as a result of some traditional confession ritual.

I hold the common sense idea that insincere repentance isn't repentance at all. It's lying for personal gain.

don't get me wrong I am all for common sense, but the problem is common sense is not so common any more. So what we generally have left is personal sense. Like I show you before Jesus Himself told us following the law was not good enough. To me "common sense" demands that a common sense abider looks for another means to righteousness. But here you are play the same tune, over and over again despite the fact the bible does not support your 'personal sense.'

Brother if it did know you would be hating me for a whole bunch of different reasons. I would be the Pharisees of pharisees. But, sadly we must all live in freedom and worship God with all of our being.

I don't think you're so important that the Bible would have anything to say about what a liar and a fraud you are. All I have to say is that inventing your own personal idea of canon doesn't mean jack to anybody but yourself. And, in the end, you are the god you worship and love.

Honestly, that doesn't make you a false Christian, but only because most Christians worship themselves and their perceptions just like you do.

Again I have parables, rebukes and chapters of teachings from Christ not to mention an entire book from Paul to support everything I have said here. What do you have? What you remember from a failed attempt at Christianity? Brother, it failed for a good reason. Your understanding of the religion and of God was corrupt. It was doomed to fail because the God of the bible did not support what you understood. That is the reason your on the otherside of this conversation and why you can not find a scrap of scripture to support your position, and why I have volumes to support mine.

---

Dirch has already been caught.. lying its pointless to keep dragging it on.

Lying about what? What evidence do you have?

---

Often times it's what isn't there that can be submitted as "evidence". Neither god nor her assistance are present. Silence can speak volumes.

I don't get it how is that evidence against God?

God provided the food, the medicines and the infrastructure to get everything these people need, and even charged us with doing that very thing... So again how does this relate to God's failure?

Now I could see an arguement if planet wide there was nothing, but in western cultures we have such an over abundance of food we date it, and throw it away whether it is good or bad...

To me this seems like a failure of those whom God entrusted with an over abundance and charged to feed those in need...

Remember to the measure you use to judge, will be used against you.

If you did not see God or his servants helping those twenty thousand children who died, I would ask did you expect to from Where you are sitting?

---

We brought this up when he first took up residence. He doesn't care. Apparently spellcheck is not A Thing.

If you misspell something long enough the same way spell check 'learns' your spelling and does not correct.

---

Sorry Dirch but lairs don't need rebuttals you lost this one after being caught last page. Just be a bigger man and claim defeat.

[Drich]

Sorry Dirch but lairs don't need rebuttals you lost this one after being caught last page. Just be a bigger man and claim defeat.

So you can't substantiate your accusation, yet you persist in your charge..

Do you think you will be continuing this ad hoc attack on an on going basis or are you just trying this out in hopes that you might win an arguement for once?

You know what you could do is everytime I say anything you could just say I was lying and demand a confession no matter what I say. That might make you a hero to atheist everywhere. Heck you might even start a movement among your peers! Everytime a christian wipes the floor with them they could just randomly call them a liar and demand a confession.. Oh but wait I think some muslims already do that... Hmm,

I know! if a muslim says you stole his sthick just call Him a liar and demand a confession!

I bet this way of 'winning' arguements and getting in the last word will go far with your peer group!