Evidence God Exists

[Welsh cake]

I've experienced the presence of God. But like the man said, it's difficult to put into words. A lot of you will say that it was just what I imagined based on my belief. But to live it is to breathe it.

Talk about brainfarts - if you can't even describe what kind of personal experience you had why should anyone take your position even remotely seriously, why should people even humour you at this point?

Basically you're saying you experienced something, good for you, though it may not necessarily be a brush with the supernatural as some could argue it was more probably a bad case of indigestion. At any rate, expecting your audience to accept you've had an encounter with magic man is simply unrealistic and senseless - we've no independent access to what actually happened, therefore we can't acknowledge said claims since you've yet again surprise-fucking-surprise presented only personal testimonies and not a single shred of empirical evidence.

[Entropist]

"One day I played Black Sabbath at 78 speed."

"Oh, and then what happened?"

"I SAW GOD!"

(Cheech and Chong)

[Captain Scarlet]

Maybe if unbelievers would experience what you and I have, they'd be believers.

And what exactly have you "experienced"?

I've experienced the presence of God. But like the man said, it's difficult to put into words. A lot of you will say that it was just what I imagined based on my belief. But to live it is to breathe it.

I was first a Christian, and then an atheist. But it wasn't until I let myself be open to experiencing God that I was able to experience him. Before that I never really did, even as a Christian.

How do you know it was a god? How do you know it was the xtian god (assuming it was)? Why should the creator of the entire universe seek to get your attention?

[downbeatplumb]

I've experienced the presence of God

It was probably constipation. Ex-Lax should help.

Or it couldve been trapped wind.

[Entropist]

Or it couldve been trapped wind.

Hole-ly spirit (pneuma) indeed.

(I seem to recall that was Bertrand Russell's half-joking explanation of the Pythagoreans' aversion to eating beans)

[AngelThMan]

Most believers who become atheists do it as a result of some traumatic disappointment. Something goes horribly wrong in their lives and they lose faith in God.

Others do it because their lifestyles (e.g. sexuality) do not fit in with/is not supported by their particular religions.

And then there are those who were born into religious homes, and went through the motions as children based on their parents' faith, but never really gave God or religion much thought, and therefore were never really open to experiencing God. Driven by certain studies and scientific findings as they get older, they find that the notion of atheism speaks to them.

I also forgot those who became atheists to rebel against strict, faith-based parenting.

---

Why is it so difficult to believe that I am an atheist precisely because I was given as much exposure to religion as a normal person and just as much thought (or more, considering I have thoughts on the topic) and rejected the beliefs for the irrational imaginings that they appear to be?

You may have given it thought, but that doesn't mean you ever experienced or allowed yourself to experience God. If you had experienced God, the likelihood is that you wouldn't have become an atheist, unless you went through some sort of hardship or terrible disappointment in your life.

[Oldandeasilyconfused]

Most believers who become atheists do it as a result of some traumatic disappointment. Something goes horribly wrong in their lives and they lose faith in God.

I guess that's intuitive for believers, and probably true for some to varying degrees. However, I've never actually seen any such evidence for a specific case, and certainly no evidence to allow the inference of a general principle.

So what? Generally speaking, reason has nothing to do with the formation of our most powerful attitudes and beliefs.EG about self,gender,race,relationships,marriage----and religion. These things are all uncritically absorbed before the age of reason,and few people ever seriously,objectively question them. If they did, there would be vastly more atheists in the world.

I think it's just as rational to say at some point in their lives, many now-atheists felt 'let down by God'. That disappointment caused them to question their beliefs,which they found wanting.I began questioning my Catholic faith at age 16. I left the Church at 20.It took me another 20 years of questioning to reach the inevitable conclusion of atheism.IE I was simply no longer able to believe.It was not a matter of choice.

Perhaps in future take care before making such facile and patronising generalisations,there's a good chap. Just makes you seem ignorant and rather dim, reducing your already almost non existent credibility.(at least with me)


The questioning from trauma: I refer you to an excellent film "God On Trial"

God on Trial is a 2008 BBC/WGBH Boston television play written by Frank Cottrell Boyce, starring Antony Sher, Rupert Graves and Jack Shepherd. The play takes places in Auschwitz during World War II. The Jewish prisoners put God on trial in absentia for abandoning the Jewish people. The question is if God has broken his covenant with the Jewish people by allowing the Nazis to commit genocide.[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_on_Trial




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See also ' socialisation'

Socialization is a term used by sociologists, social psychologists, anthropologists, politicians and educationalists to refer to the process of inheriting norms, customs and ideologies. It may provide the individual with the skills and habits necessary for participating within their own society; a society itself is formed through a plurality of shared norms, customs, values, traditions, social roles, symbols and languages. Socialization is thus ‘the means by which social and cultural continuity are attained’.[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialisation

[TheDarkestOfAngels]

You may have given it thought, but that doesn't mean you ever experienced or allowed yourself to experience God. If you had experienced God, the likelihood is that you wouldn't have become an atheist, unless you went through some sort of hardship or terrible disappointment in your life.

Alternatively, I could have experienced god in the exact same manner you have, but I didn't reach the conclusion that god is a real thing like you did. I'm sorry, you can't justify your irrational beliefs because of some ambiguous 'thing' you felt that I may not have because more likely than not, it was simply your brain doing something it probably doesn't normally do.

Like out of body and near death experiences, which has been shown to be the result of brain activity.

If anything, you're attempting to set up an artificial difference to justify your erroneous views on atheists and atheism in general. In other words, there has to be something wrong with us when the fact of the matter is that there isn't. We're not traumatized, we didn't feel things differently, and many of us has had as much or more exposure to religion as you have.
Your position becomes weaker still when not only are there those who choose simply not to buy into religion, but buy into a completely different religious faith or even into religious cults, counter-religions, or even religions that seem to be forming like a massive sarcastic parady of other religions (like pastafarianism, sandwitchism, pink unicornism, santa clausim, ronald reagonism, and rondald mcdonaldism).

[Welsh cake]

I also forgot those who became atheists to rebel against strict, faith-based parenting.

But you conveniently ignored all those who realised the beliefs were all a steaming pile of fallacious dogmatic bullshit.

The disappointment we've got in our lives mate is that you fundamentalists can't figure this out for yourself.

[chatpilot]

AngelThMan when you find "evidence that God exists" I would love to see it, so far you haven't shown me any in this entire thread.