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RE: What Human Rights?
July 16, 2015 at 10:44 pm
(This post was last modified: July 16, 2015 at 11:02 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Meh, it's still a right, but rights that we can't exercise or enforce have little -utility-. That's why we defend them in the first place, eh? So that we can use them. We really do have to account for shit like the KKK stringing people up in trees....elsewise we're claiming that there is no right to life or liberty : because the KKK exists and occasionally strings someone up in a tree. We can't always use our rights, we don't always enjoy their benefits, that's just a fact. If we have to be able to use it at any given time, if we have to be able to enjoy it at any given time, regardless of any circumstance, there are -no- rights, of any kind, anywhere. Never have been. Never will be.
The requirements for the existence of a right must not be manufactured so as to be impossible to attain....eh? Otherwise we shouldn't be surprised when we find that we have none, and that the entire subject is an empty set.
@Cath
Quote:Sorry, this is all that comes to mind when reading your posts:
I'll grant you this, it's certainly simpler to daydream about that than it would be to accept a little responsibility for the negatively valued outcomes of one's own interactions, and the manner in which one chooses to manage those interactions.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: What Human Rights?
July 16, 2015 at 11:16 pm
Thanks JennyA for the clarification. 
I obviously don't agree, but what you're saying does make sense as being the atheist view on this. If I did not believe in God I would have 0 reason to believe that people have inherent rights.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: What Human Rights?
July 16, 2015 at 11:17 pm
(This post was last modified: July 16, 2015 at 11:21 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
There you go again, saying stupid shit...lol.
"If I didn't believe in god, I would have no reason to be good" part duex.
Since you -already- believe that human beings have inherent rights, on such a shaky foundation as a "god"..I can -guarantee- that you would continue to believe that they do, even if you didn't believe in a god. It clearly takes very little for you to believe in human rights. There's no shortage of points other than "god" from which to proceed, many of which you are already well aware of.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: What Human Rights?
July 16, 2015 at 11:20 pm
(This post was last modified: July 16, 2015 at 11:21 pm by Catholic_Lady.)
(July 16, 2015 at 10:44 pm)Rhythm Wrote: @Cath
Quote:Sorry, this is all that comes to mind when reading your posts:
I'll grant you this, it's certainly simpler to daydream about that than it would be to accept a little responsibility for the negatively valued outcomes of one's own interactions, and the manner in which one chooses to manage those interactions.
As you can see, I do perfectly fine having discussions with the respectful people here. All you did was basically say that I suck without providing any sort of valid argument to any points I was making.
Don't take it as an insult. I like Big Tom, and I want to like you. But you say such nasty things to me sometimes, I can't tell if you're joking or not.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: What Human Rights?
July 16, 2015 at 11:22 pm
(This post was last modified: July 16, 2015 at 11:26 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
No, I explained, you're simply pretending to be dense. Blaming the reaction you get on others in toto is absurd (and you've done it over, and over, and over.....). Its the martyr card, we see it constantly. You have a great deal to do with how people treat you. Own it. I say nasty things because you seem to be determined to convince me that you're a nasty person. I'm constantly trying to argue against that....but you insist......
Please, don't start using phrases like "valid argumentation"....in your shitposts....you think I'm nasty now.......
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: What Human Rights?
July 16, 2015 at 11:23 pm
(This post was last modified: July 16, 2015 at 11:24 pm by Catholic_Lady.)
(July 16, 2015 at 11:17 pm)Rhythm Wrote: There you go again, saying stupid shit...lol.
"If I didn't believe in god, I would have no reason to be good" part duex.
Since you -already- believe that human beings have inherent rights, on such a shaky foundation as a "god"..I can -guarantee- that you would continue to believe that they do, even if you didn't believe in a god. It clearly takes very little for you to believe in human rights. There's no shortage of points other than "god" from which to proceed, many of which you are already well aware of.
my bold.
Oh please. That's not AT ALL what I said.
And why are you picking on me for saying that? A lot of atheists here are saying the exact same thing - That people don't have inherent rights. All I was saying was that I understand why they would think that if they don't believe in a God to assign people those inherent rights.
I don't think I'm going to respond to you anymore.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: What Human Rights?
July 16, 2015 at 11:28 pm
(This post was last modified: July 16, 2015 at 11:30 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
No, what you said was....
Quote:If I did not believe in God I would have 0 reason to believe that people have inherent rights.
Own it. I've suggested, strongly, that this is not true. Care to convince me?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: What Human Rights?
July 16, 2015 at 11:30 pm
(July 16, 2015 at 11:28 pm)Rhythm Wrote: No, what you said was....
Quote:If I did not believe in God I would have 0 reason to believe that people have inherent rights.
Own it.
Um, I did.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: What Human Rights?
July 16, 2015 at 11:32 pm
(This post was last modified: July 16, 2015 at 11:36 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
No, you didn't...and I quote...again....
Quote:All I was saying was that I understand why they would think that if they don't believe in a God to assign people those inherent rights.
All you -actually- said...was what I quoted before. Again, I'll suggest that you have more to do with how people respond to you than your repeated whining would imply. It isn't because you're a catholic....Catholic.....that I respond the way that I do. You say strange things, you refuse to own those strange things, and then you get pissy when those strange things are criticized. Well....maybe you should keep them to yourself? Fuck me, I almost thought you wanted another opinion, sharing them here?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: What Human Rights?
July 16, 2015 at 11:34 pm
(July 16, 2015 at 8:51 am)ChadWooters Wrote: The idea of inalienable human rights is inconsistent with modern atheism. Period.
Care to defend that assertion or are you going to shit and run?!?
Thief and assassin for hire. Member in good standing of the Rogues Guild.
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