christian looking to understand athiests

[SteelCurtain]

if you are suggesting that these decisions are just an illusion and we are all being controlled and decieved i think that is a whole other subject

There is pretty good evidence that our "choices" are actually an illusion. Your brain, on the quantum level, is a machine which operates by certain parameters. There is evidence that everything you do is inevitable.

[Minimalist]

I have news for you. Death was happening long before the fictional events in your imaginary Eden.

there really is no discussion here if you are just going to shoot down everything i say.

And so we are supposed to accept everything you say because you think some silly 'god' is real?  Do take a close look at the banner on this site.  It might help you understand what you are up against.  Your god is not going to help you.

[brewer]

Checkmate robvalue!

Did you see the car before you paid for it?

So your god answered your prayers by degrading someone else's eyesight to the point where they were no longer allowed to drive, thereby compelling her to sell off her car at discounted price?

Did nobody think to pray for this woman's eyesight to improve?

he did not degrade a womans eyesight she was very old and frankly there were other reasons why she shouldnt drive. dont blame God for natural physical aging.  if he healed every single thing that was uncomfortable or inconvienent in anyones life he really would just turn into an automatic wish machine.  i believe she is also selling her house soon to move in with family so she wont need the car

I wonder who is praying for a house?

[msid]

if you are suggesting that these decisions are just an illusion and we are all being controlled and decieved i think that is a whole other subject

There is pretty good evidence that our "choices" are actually an illusion. Your brain, on the quantum level, is a machine which operates by certain parameters. There is evidence that everything you do is inevitable.

then this whole conversation is just being typed out by some other force that is controlling our lives so if that is true then there is really nothing we can do about that and our lives would have no meaning

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there really is no discussion here if you are just going to shoot down everything i say.

And so we are supposed to accept everything you say because you think some silly 'god' is real?  Do take a close look at the banner on this site.  It might help you understand what you are up against.  Your god is not going to help you.

Jesus does not cause any of this. because of our fallen world the Devil is constantly causing bad in the world.

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You'd think he would make exceptions when his followers ask for something. There's even a verse in the bible that says as and you shall receive, for what parent would give a child a stone when he asks for bread? If praying isn't consistent, there's no reason to pray. If following someone doesn't give you results, there's no reason to follow someone.

God wont automatically grant any prayer you pray just because your saved.  if he does not answer a prayer how you want immediately it means he has a plan that could be better then what you prayed

[Lemonvariable72]

There is pretty good evidence that our "choices" are actually an illusion. Your brain, on the quantum level, is a machine which operates by certain parameters. There is evidence that everything you do is inevitable.

then this whole conversation is just being typed out by some other force that is controlling our lives so if that is true then there is really nothing we can do about that and our lives would have no meaning

Well according to Christianity are lives are meaningless anyway. Just a short trial run.

[Crossless2.0]

There is pretty good evidence that our "choices" are actually an illusion. Your brain, on the quantum level, is a machine which operates by certain parameters. There is evidence that everything you do is inevitable.

then this whole conversation is just being typed out by some other force that is controlling our lives so if that is true then there is really nothing we can do about that and our lives would have no meaning

That really doesn't follow.

In any case, I'm still interested to hear all about the free will of the Amalekite children. Or better yet -- tell me about the free will of the child in Minimalist's post. Your god helped your family find an affordable fucking car but orders his 'people' to smash the heads of infants against the stones and won't lift a finger to help an innocent in dire need? And you worship this monster? Interesting.  

Fortunately for all of us, there is no evidence for the existence of this 'god' aside from his being the main character in an old collection of books -- your confirmation bias regarding prayer results notwithstanding.

[brewer]

If you'd like me and others to take stock in the prayers coming true motivation for belief I'll need a lot more details.

a couple of examples are some people at my church 

a woman almost lost her legs because they were filled with fluid and God had told her years ago that he would heal her.  she continued praying and within a week her legs were almost back to normal and the doctor had no medical explanantion

a man at our church had his hip bone injured by being crushed between two boats in the navy,  the bone was never healed right but one prayer meeting when everyone started praying for him there was a loud snap and his hip was healed

a woman at our church was bitten by an ant in her bed and the bite spread. when she went to the doctor he said there was no ant that could cause that huge of a rash.  the bite swelled and covered a lot of her arm.  she and others prayed for healing and the bite was gone within a week

my brother had a lott of warts on his hands that were causing a lot of pain and he had about 20 in all.  he tried all kinds of creams and ointments.  he was prayed for and overnight every single wart was gone with no sign they were ever there

These are all medical, interesting.

What you have provided are hear say testimonials (not first person) or anecdotes. There is a lack of any but the most basic details, just enough details to relate the story. And with HIPPA, none of the medical details can be released without consent of the patient/cured (not saying that was your intention from the start). While this may be enough explanation/motivation for you, these anecdotes come no where near to satisfying proof of prayer fulfillment for me.

In any case, thanks for responding.

[Faith No More]

if i decide to steal a car thats my decision. if i decide to give money to a charity that is my decision. if i decide to kill myself that is my decision.   
if you are suggesting that these decisions are just an illusion and we are all being controlled and decieved i think that is a whole other subject

No, the existence of free will is not a seperate subject when you say god created us with it. If you say god created us with something, you have to first demonstrate it exists. The problem is that neuroscience is constantly showing us more and more that our decisions and behavior are actually quite dependent upon our brain structure and that we don't actually have the freedom to choose from all options like we feel we do.

So that got me wondering, what evidence do you have that our will is free?

[msid]

well its been great discussing with everyone i now understand your point of view a little more. 
i am a 14 year old pastors daughter and i know if i mentioned that earlier i probobally would have been shot down immediately. 
thank you for the discussions and i will be praying for all of you

[brewer]

well its been great discussing with everyone i now understand your point of view a little more. 
i am a 14 year old pastors daughter and i know if i mentioned that earlier i probobally would have been shot down immediately. 
thank you for the discussions and i will be praying for all of you

Please don't, the "I'm praying for you" I take as an offensive unwanted intrusion. You are belittling my belief. Keep your prayers for your own kind. Thanks.