French Terror Attacks, scores dead

[Wyrd of Gawd]

I think all of the crocodile tears over the Paris massacre is asinine. We are at war. We have been at war for decades. There are no innocent victims. Everyone is on one side or the other. We kill the enemy and destroy their countries. France has been bombing in Syria for a long time, contributing to the exodus into Europe. So when a handful of the enemy counter attack with their limited means and cause mayhem and havoc we start bleating like scared sheep.

This war is expected to last 100 years. People on both sides will die. Misery will touch everyone. Deal with it.

[Edwardo Piet]

Yes you not only can talk about the negative consequences of religiously motivated extremism, we all should be talking about that. All I said is that atheist not having that particular baggage will not automatically make all atheist saints(strike the word saints, they were not the nice guys people painted them out to be).

I know that but you said I implied otherwise. Where??? Why would I ever imply that atheists can't do bad things as much as anybody else? I said they can't do things that are motivated by their atheism. But religion on the other hand can be a motivational factor.

But one thing though, "extremism" is coddled by the moderates and the left, all be it well intended, under the guise of protecting pluralism.

I don't even think extremism is the problem, check my earlier posts in this thread. I only said extremism on this occasion to give you some leeway because I didn't want you to argue against that point I wanted you to focus on this claim you have made that I'm somehow implying that I believe atheists don't do bad things for other reasons. You claim I said lots of things that I didn't say. I pointed that out and instead of conceding on that point you said I implied it. But I didn't imply it at all I didn't say it implicity or explicitly. I am asking for you to tell me where I said what you claim I said, and if I need to I will go back and quote you on the absurd claim that you misrepresented me as making. It offends me that you could possibily think that I was such an idiot that I would actually think atheists are incapable of doing bad things as much as theists are. Not only did I not say it or imply it but since I didn't say or imply it why would you think I would think that? Do you really think that little of me? 

 The word "bigot" and "racist" while can apply rightfully to some, it unwittingly is also used to shut down criticism of religion. X Muslims and even some still in it who cant speak in public where they live that they want us to have those "politically incorrect" conversations. Ayaan Hirsi Ali a former Muslim would not agree with the left that it is always good to censor to keep the peace.

I agree. You seem to have shifted more to my perspective but you still need to admit to the claim you made saying I said something that I didn't say, whether it's explicitly or implicitly said I simply didn't say it. I would never imply something so ridiculous unless I was a complete idiot and I'm not.

[Edwardo Piet]

I was too upset to respond to the other points on this post earlier after the misrepresentation. It turns out you made more than one!

So I'll respond now...

 Just because you take away religious motivations, other motivations will not exist.

I know, I never said nor implied otherwise. 

Atheists can suffer from flawed logic too.

I know I never said nor implied otherwise.

We are individuals too, we cant forget that just because we hold the common "off" position.

I know that I never said nor implied otherwise.

Honestly I never said those things neither implicitly nor explicitly and if you really think that I think such things despite my not even remotely alluding to them or suggesting them then you really must not have a very high opinion of me. It's quite upsetting to me because I have a high opinion of you, even now after this misrepresentation because I've liked so many of your posts. I'm just hoping we can come to an understanding here, I don't want to be misrepresented like this by someone who I respect so much in such a way that it seems as though they think so little of me when I thought the respect was mutual.

Normally being misrepresented would piss me off but I like you and so because I like you: it's more upsetting that annoying.

[abaris]

Good thing that France has strict gun control which prevents this kind of things.

And nevermind that these shooters were smuggled over the borders. You point was what exactly? Maybe that all these people in the theatre should have been packing?

[Wyrd of Gawd]

Good thing that France has strict gun control which prevents this kind of things.

And nevermind that these shooters were smuggled over the borders. You point was what exactly? Maybe that all these people in the theatre should have been packing?

Does anyone know how it took for the French cops to show up?  It seems like the shooters had hours to carry out their killing.

[SofaKingHigh]

Not wanting to get in an argument, but it seems to be a little bit petty to be getting so het up over being asked to pray, given the situation.

People are religious, quite what you expect I'm not sure.

It's the ridiculousness of being explicitly told that in situations as bad as this atheists should be praying too. They're religious so what do I expect? I expect them to pray. We're atheists though so if I refuse to pray what the fuck do they expect? Are they seriously going to suggest I'm a bad person for not praying to an imaginary God?

You're right... at times like this it's not important and that's why such bullshit like this pisses me off when people try to pressure me with that religious bullshit. Pray as much as you like, knock your socks off but don't expect atheists to pray for Paris that makes no fucking sense. As if praying actually means you give a shit. It means you're leaving an important matter to an imaginary person and if people didn't worship and pray to imaginary people there wouldn't be suicide bombings like this.

It is very relevant: It's thanks to religion that we have suicide bombers like this in the first place.

Sorry, I just get a bit saddened by some on here, the above post a perfect example, seeming to get more annoyed at the request to pray than the atrocity itself.

Like I said, no argument wanted here, just an observation.

[WinterHold]

[Jackie]

I think all of the crocodile tears over the Paris massacre is asinine.  We are at war.  We have been at war for decades.  There are no innocent victims.  Everyone is on one side or the other.  We kill the enemy and destroy their countries.  France has been bombing in Syria for a long time, contributing to the exodus into Europe.  So when a handful of the enemy counter attack with their limited means and cause mayhem and havoc we start bleating like scared sheep.  

This war is expected to last 100 years.  People on both sides will die.  Misery will touch everyone.  Deal with it.

What the fuck? Skip the nationality, skip the race and religion issues. When a individual, or group of people get hurt, they have an emotional reaction to that assault. Nobody should call the act unique, but it is nuts to expect humans not to react to trauma.

Agreeing that humans can and do fight, agreeing that there is plenty of blame to go around does not make the theocratic oppressive ideas far too much of the East is held hostage by, better than the secular west. Nobody should claim the west is perfect either. But that is fucking absurd to say French have no right to be pissed. You fuck with my family I'd get pissed too. Anyone would.

I'd say whatever response we have should not involve the same xenophobia or mob rule mentality, but all sides are NOT equal on this. 

"Shit happens" yea. Humans do this, yea. It is the downside of our species. But that doesn't mean humans cant our shouldn't have emotions in response to human cruelty.

[Jackie]

I am 49, Muslims and Jews and Christians have been at each other's throats even before I was born. I remember the hostages taken during the Olympics when I was a kid. But "get over it" no. I agree there is a war, but only one region of the world wants to stay stuck in it's own dark ages. That does not mean, Christians and Jews are guilt free. It merely means they have more of a leash on their religions.

[Jackie]

Christians used the bible to justify slavery. Christians used the bible to deny women the right to vote. Despite WW2 Jewish bigotry still existed in America, from Christians. Native Americans got fuck over because of Christianity. And sure, if I had my way Cheney would be on trial for war crimes. But two wrongs don't make a right. And the west is still collectively far more civil, and far more diverse than the East.