So is crucifiction a bad or a good thing?

[Cecelia]

Yeah, I don't get it either.

How is it a sacrifice?

Jesus didn't opt to be put up on that cross. The Romans did that after Judas betrayed him. Was Satan in on the plan all along? I mean it's said that he entered Judas, and Judas betrayed Jesus. But is it really a betrayal if he did what Jesus wanted all along? And the Romans weren't sacrificing him. They were executing him. If I kill a fly, have I sacrificed that fly to God?

It's really confusing the more I think about it. I mean Judas is a bad guy for betraying Jesus, but if he didn't betray Jesus then Jesus would have never been put on the cross. Could Jesus have died of old age? And if so, what would Christians have chosen to wear around their necks if not the cross? Also isn't putting the cross up kind of like taunting god "Hey, remember what we did to you? Yeah, we used it as a symbol to remember how the Romans executed you and we called it a sacrifice." Can God even die of old age? I mean he was able to die by conventional means. why was god able to die by conventional means? I mean I imagine if he got the flu he might have healed himself, but imagine if Jesus had been stabbed to death in the middle of the night, or fell from a very large height. Through him anything is supposed to be possible... except surviving really sharp things being hammered into him I guess...

[TrueChristian]

It is bad because it caused Jesus so much pain and suffering, and truly is one of the most horrible ways to go.

Burning to death, freezing to death, or even being eatne by bugs takes much quicker.

Imagine being whipped and exhausted and having a crown of thorns stuck into your head. Then imagine having nails driven through your wrists and feet and then hanging up on a cross for 4-5 hours, while your limbs slowly break and your lungs slowly collapse. That is what Jesus went through for you.

It was bad, yes. But great good came out of it, namely the chance to go to heaven.

And for all those who sympathize with Judas, I am oh so sorry. He is more than likely in Hell. Jesus said it would better for the one who betrayed him to "never have been born."

Judas knew God made flesh for 3 years, but still sneered at him, disbelieved in him, and was willing to sell him for 30 pieces of silver. It is rather like the false Christian preachers, like Joel Osteen, who are willing to be silent about Jesus' teaching and message, all for the sake of money.

In the 1600s, a notable Christian, Mary Agrada had a vision of what happened to Judas and "why he did it." It is troubling, but I encourage you all to watch and learn: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lMMN6tkLwc

[abaris]

What exactly was god's plan? Since he's immortal and eternal by definition to engage in some S&M action by letting himself be crucified?

I know, I know. There will be some knuklehead barging in here, saying, he allowed himself to become mortal. But since that same person will also claim, there hasn't been a single moment when there was no god and all three are actually one, there's a moot point if I ever seen one.

So, don't talk about the action of crucifiction here, talk about it not making any sense in lights of the trinity. And, it's not as if we haven't been there before.

[Crossless2.0]

This is worse than a Shyamalan movie

That might be going too far.

[Minimalist]

Depends on your point of view.

Jesus smiles lovingly and looks off into the distance as a weak smile plays across his face, "Look Peter, I can see your house from here!"

[Homeless Nutter]

It is bad because it caused Jesus so much pain and suffering, and truly is one of the most horrible ways to go.

Yeah, well - f*** him. His dad wanted him killed - what the f*** do we care, how they resolve family disputes, up there in heaven?

Burning to death, freezing to death, or even being eatne by bugs takes much quicker.

"Eaten by bugs"??? LOL. I didn't realize that was an option - Jesus definitely should have gone for that - at least christian symbolic crap would look cool...

Imagine being whipped and exhausted and having a crown of thorns stuck into your head. Then imagine having nails driven through your wrists and feet and then hanging up on a cross for 4-5 hours, while your limbs slowly break and your lungs slowly collapse. That is what Jesus went through for you.
[...]

Meh - that's f***ing NOTHING compared to what many cancer patients go through - I'll take crucifiction over testicular cancer (which makes your balls swell to the size of a small bean-bag chair) - ANY DAY. And have you ever heard of impalement (people in eastern Europe used to stick enemies and criminals on poles, up in the air, alive for days until the tip of the pole went through their entire bodies - from ass to throat). Jesus got off easy...

And 4-5 hours on the cross? LOL Are you stupid?!!! (he asked knowingly...) People died on the crosses over days. Your Jesus was a pathetic pussy, if all he could manage was 4 hours...

[drfuzzy]

The dying and rising god myth was ancient around the Mediterranean long before a scruffy little tribe of El worshipers who avoided eating pork ever came on the scene.   Kersey Graves listed 16 crucified "saviors" who pre-dated Jesus of Nazareth:

• Thulis of Egypt, 1700 B. C.[5]
  
  
• Chrishna of India, 1200 B.C.
  
  
• Crite of Chaldea, 1200 B.C.[6][7]
  
  
• Atys of Phrygia, 1170 B.C.
  
  
• Thammuz or Tammuz of Syria, 1160 B.C.
  
  
• Hesus or Eros 834 B.C.
  
  
• Bali of Orissa, 725 B.C.[8]
  
  
• Indra of Thibet (Tibet), 725 B.C.
  
  
• Iao of Nepaul (Nepal), 622 B.C.[9][10]
  
  
• Buddha Sakia (Muni) of India, 600 B.C.[11]
  
  
• Mitra (Mithra) of Persia, 600 B.C.
  
  
• Alcestos of Euripides, 600 B.C.
  
  
• Quezalcoatl of Mexico, 587 B.C.
  
  
• Wittoba of the Bilingonese, 552 B.C.[12]
  
  
• Prometheus or Æschylus of Caucasus, 547 B.C.
  
  
• Quirinus of Rome, 506 B.C.
  

  Carrier challenged some of Graves' work but never managed to disprove it.  The book claims that a number of these deities or god-men shared at least some traits of Jesus as described in the New Testament, drawing the strongest similarities with Krishna. For example, some figures had miraculous or virgin births, were sons of supreme gods, were born on December 25, had stars point to their birthplaces, were visited by shepherds and magi as infants, fled from death as children, exhibited traits of divinity in childhood, spent time in the desert, traveled as they taught, had disciples, performed miracles, were persecuted, were crucified, descended into hell after death, appeared as resurrections or apparitions, or ascended into heaven. 

It was a story so old that everyone knew it.  There is a report by an early historian (sorry, can't find it, will keep looking) about some people scoffing at early Christians, saying "we didn't believe that about ____, why should we believe the same thing about this Jew?"  Crucifixion, virgin birth, miracles, etc., were all required by the story.

Oh, and yes, I looked up Graves' work on Wikipedia for the list and description.

[Thumpalumpacus]

I'll take "Crucifixion Sucks" for $500, Alex.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

It is bad because it caused Jesus so much pain and suffering, and truly is one of the most horrible ways to go.

But (the story goes) Jesus was God, so he knew that the pain and suffering was a necessity, which would ameliorate the pain and suffering.

Burning to death, freezing to death, or even being eatne by bugs takes much quicker.

What about being dissolved in corrosive natron (the Egyptians report that victims often took days to die)? How about being roasted alive? Whipped to death? I'm sure there are dozens of ways to die that are either more painful or more drawn out (or both) than crucifixion). Jesus was (allegedly) crucified because 1) it was the punishment appropriate for enemies of the state at the time and 2) it fit with the mythology.

Imagine being whipped and exhausted and having a crown of thorns stuck into your head. Then imagine having nails driven through your wrists and feet and then hanging up on a cross for 4-5 hours, while your limbs slowly break and your lungs slowly collapse. That is what Jesus went through for you.

Granted, it doesn't sound like the best way to spend a Friday afternoon, but remember - I didn't ask Jesus to do this.

It was bad, yes. But great good came out of it, namely the chance to go to heaven.

A Palestinian preacher being brutally murdered so I can go to heaven is anathema to me. The idea of a god being butchered so I can go to heaven is just silly.

And for all those who sympathize with Judas, I am oh so sorry. He is more than likely in Hell. Jesus said it would better for the one who betrayed him to "never have been born."

By your own statements, Jesus had to die for mankind to be saved. If Judas hadn't betrayed Jesus, the crucifixion might never have come off. You ought to be thanking Judas, not condemning him.

Judas knew God made flesh for 3 years

Or 1 year. The accounts vary.

but still sneered at him, disbelieved in him, and was willing to sell him for 30 pieces of silver. It is rather like the false Christian preachers, like Joel Osteen, who are willing to be silent about Jesus' teaching and message, all for the sake of money.

Again, Judas was fulfilling the role appointed for him. Who the hell are YOU to sneer at Judas for his absolutely vital role in the salvation of mankind?

Boru

[Longhorn]

I'm confused. How do you spell it? Crucifiction or crucifixion?