If Allah has a plan, what is the point of Dua?

[Sheed1980]

You're not offending me by not accepting my belief. I'm doing this to try to help others see what we as Muslims believe is true and why we believe it to be true. The deep part of it is that we need to accept it as the truth now because once we're gone from this life and the truth that was told to us comes forward, it'll be too late to say I know now so I'll go back and do better. So the proof my friend is being shown to us now in ways but the real proof is after we die

---

First of all I'm not threatening u at all. I simply challenged u since u speak so negatively towards God. And I see that u haven't written the comment, so some part of ur conscience is telling maybe I shouldn't say that. Secondly the comments u make negatively towards my God Allah and my Prophet Muhammad pbuh aren't hurting me in the long run. Sure I take offense to it, but it is ur God given free right to believe as u will. But u don't have to stand b4 me in judgment u as well as everybody else has to stand b4 Allah

---

Another point u miss is that God doesn't need anyone for anything He i s All Powerful, free of all needs, worthy of all praise. He places us here to see if we're going to speak the truth about Him and live righteously worshipping Him alone, and living righteously amongst each other. This life is a test to pass, and pleasing God to receive whatever our minds and heart desire only times and times better than we can possibly imagine. It is also a test to fail and angering God to receive punishment more severe than we could imagine as well. So long story short we're living this life for ourselvesnot God. We can get whatever we want by passing or everything we don't want by failing

No you are missing the point. If you agree god does not need humans, then the fact you are trying to make an argument for it, you are being hypocritical. Why are you even here if you agree he doesn't need humans?

Prove he doesn't need you, stop posting here, OR admit it is flawed logic you are using. Each post you make after this and even the ones prior prove that you don't really believe what you claim, you only merely truly like the idea of what you claim.

Oh and don't use the word "test". That is a vile way to think of human beings. A "test" is something you take in school. A "test" is something you take to get a job. A "test" is something you take to get on a sports team, or to get into a music program.

I find it sick that you'd think it a "test" and justify things like childhood cancer, or child murder or rape, as a "test". Much less all the 50 million humans who die worldwide from everything every year. If you consider all that death a "test", your morality as a human being sucks.

If you want to think of yourself as a lab rat you can, I don't consider myself a toy to be fucked with in violent ways just to glorify one selfish sky bully.

As said b4 I am not living my life to help God He doesn't need my help nor anyone elses. I am living this life for myself. And this life is a test. It's a test of morals and judgment. If we pass we get to have the most magnificent reward from God. Where if we fail we get the most severe painful and humiliating punishment from God. All of our deeds are being recorded as we live life on Earth. 2 angels, one on our right records our good deeds and the one on the left records our bad deeds. There is a chapter in the Qur'an 101: 1)The Day of noise and clamour.2)What i The Day of noise and clamour? 3)And what will explain to you what The Day of noise and clamour is? 4)It is a day when men will be like moths scattered about.5)And the mountains will be as carded wool. 6)Then he whose good deeds will be found heavy.7)Will find his home in a mead of joy and delight.8)But he whose good deeds will be found light.9)Will find his home in a bottomless pit. 10)And what will explain to you what that is? 11)It's a fire blazing fiercely.
So in this God tells us about Judgment day and about our deeds being weighed against each other to determine our fate in the Hereafter. So this is a test my friend. If we pass we are rewarded with the best reward beyond our imagination. But if we fail, there will be a punishment worse than anything ever. So God continually tells us "Believe and do righteous deeds in order to succeed". We can't just do one and not the other

[Brian37]

No you are missing the point. If you agree god does not need humans, then the fact you are trying to make an argument for it, you are being hypocritical. Why are you even here if you agree he doesn't need humans?

Prove he doesn't need you, stop posting here, OR admit it is flawed logic you are using. Each post you make after this and even the ones prior prove that you don't really believe what you claim, you only merely truly like the idea of what you claim.

Oh and don't use the word "test". That is a vile way to think of human beings. A "test" is something you take in school. A "test" is something you take to get a job. A "test" is something you take to get on a sports team, or to get into a music program.

I find it sick that you'd think it a "test" and justify things like childhood cancer, or child murder or rape, as a "test". Much less all the 50 million humans who die worldwide from everything every year. If you consider all that death a "test", your morality as a human being sucks.

If you want to think of yourself as a lab rat you can, I don't consider myself a toy to be fucked with in violent ways just to glorify one selfish sky bully.

As said b4 I am not living my life to help God He doesn't need my help nor anyone elses. I am living this life for myself. And this life is a test. It's a test of morals and judgment. If we pass we get to have the most magnificent reward from God. Where if we fail we get the most severe painful and humiliating punishment from God. All of our deeds are being recorded as we live life on Earth. 2 angels, one on our right records our good deeds and the one on the left records our bad deeds. There is a chapter in the Qur'an 101: 1)The Day of noise and clamour.2)What i The Day of noise and clamour? 3)And what will explain to you what The Day of noise and clamour is? 4)It is a day when men will be like moths scattered about.5)And the mountains will be as carded wool. 6)Then he whose good deeds will be found heavy.7)Will find his home in a mead of joy and delight.8)But he whose good deeds will be found light.9)Will find his home in a bottomless pit. 10)And what will explain to you what that is? 11)It's a fire blazing fiercely.
So in this God tells us about Judgment day and about our deeds being weighed against each other to determine our fate in the Hereafter. So this is a test my friend. If we pass we are rewarded with the best reward beyond our imagination. But if we fail, there will be a punishment worse than anything ever. So God continually tells us "Believe and do righteous deeds in order to succeed". We can't just do one and not the other

Yet another dodge.

If you are going to claim he does not need your help, every time you post you defy your own logic. 

Now what is really going on is your own flawed perception of reality. You merely like the idea of having a super hero, and that is why you continue to keep making excuses to cling to believing in him and why you keep trying to make arguments for it.

[Sheed1980]

As said b4 I am not living my life to help God He doesn't need my help nor anyone elses. I am living this life for myself. And this life is a test. It's a test of morals and judgment. If we pass we get to have the most magnificent reward from God. Where if we fail we get the most severe painful and humiliating punishment from God. All of our deeds are being recorded as we live life on Earth. 2 angels, one on our right records our good deeds and the one on the left records our bad deeds. There is a chapter in the Qur'an 101: 1)The Day of noise and clamour.2)What i The Day of noise and clamour? 3)And what will explain to you what The Day of noise and clamour is? 4)It is a day when men will be like moths scattered about.5)And the mountains will be as carded wool. 6)Then he whose good deeds will be found heavy.7)Will find his home in a mead of joy and delight.8)But he whose good deeds will be found light.9)Will find his home in a bottomless pit. 10)And what will explain to you what that is? 11)It's a fire blazing fiercely.
So in this God tells us about Judgment day and about our deeds being weighed against each other to determine our fate in the Hereafter. So this is a test my friend. If we pass we are rewarded with the best reward beyond our imagination. But if we fail, there will be a punishment worse than anything ever. So God continually tells us "Believe and do righteous deeds in order to succeed". We can't just do one and not the other

Yet another dodge.

If you are going to claim he does not need your help, every time you post you defy your own logic. 

Now what is really going on is your own flawed perception of reality. You merely like the idea of having a super hero, and that is why you continue to keep making excuses to cling to believing in him and why you keep trying to make arguments for it.

Allah is my Lord and Creator and I worship Him alone. So I can't prove it to you now but the time will come where it will be proven and I hope for ur sake u r on the believing side

[GUBU]

Yet another dodge.

If you are going to claim he does not need your help, every time you post you defy your own logic. 

Now what is really going on is your own flawed perception of reality. You merely like the idea of having a super hero, and that is why you continue to keep making excuses to cling to believing in him and why you keep trying to make arguments for it.

Allah is my Lord and Creator and I worship Him alone. So I can't prove it to you now but the time will come where it will be proven and I hope for ur sake u r on the believing side

Sheed cut the bullshit. Just because you're willing to blindly follow a phantasm over a cliff doesn't allow you to throw shit at the rest of us and pronounce what you believe to threats in our direction. The fact of the matter is that your god doesn't exist, and even if he did, to use the immortal words of Havelock Vetinari, "it is up to all of us to become his moral superior" because frankly your god if real is a piece of shit of the most pungent order.

[Sheed1980]

Allah is my Lord and Creator and I worship Him alone. So I can't prove it to you now but the time will come where it will be proven and I hope for ur sake u r on the believing side

Sheed cut the bullshit. Just because you're willing to blindly follow a phantasm over a cliff doesn't allow you to throw shit at the rest of us and pronounce what you believe to threats in our direction. The fact of the matter is that your god doesn't exist, and even if he did, to use the immortal words of Havelock Vetinari, "it is up to all of us to become his moral superior" because frankly your god if real is a piece of shit of the most pungent order.

I know ur trying to get me to retaliate against u speaking so negatively towards my belief and my Lord. But I won't. As I said b4 I pose no threats and have not said one single disrespectful or negative statement towards atheism. The only thing I have done is told what I believe as true and have simply warned you about God. He is Loving, and Most Merciful to those who obey Him, worship Him alone, and seek His forgiveness. But He is also strict in punishment, and should be feared by all mankind

[Brian37]

Yet another dodge.

If you are going to claim he does not need your help, every time you post you defy your own logic. 

Now what is really going on is your own flawed perception of reality. You merely like the idea of having a super hero, and that is why you continue to keep making excuses to cling to believing in him and why you keep trying to make arguments for it.

Allah is my Lord and Creator and I worship Him alone. So I can't prove it to you now but the time will come where it will be proven and I hope for ur sake u r on the believing side

Nope, there will never be a time it will be proven. Anymore than there will be a time the Christian or Jewish or Hindu gods will be proven. Humans make up gods and that is it. You merely like what you believe just like they do. I is all in your head, nowhere else.

You cant prove it to me now, well of course you cant, and that should tell you something.

[robvalue]

Ah, this is kind of awkward...

Turns out Islam is true. Here's Creationist Cat to tell us all about it. I'm sure he'll agree and sign right up.

http://youtu.be/KJIe087a2do

[Brian37]

The worst part of your argument you don't even realize is the language you use. And again, this also applies to Jews and Christians.

"Lord" denotes a king, not an elected official like in the secular west in real life. In real life back then, both in polytheism and monotheism, most humans were ruled by kings called "Lords". Lords were not someone you could remove from their positions. Even Rome under Caesar while they allowed a senate, the Caesar was still the ultimate power who could override the Senate. It was still ultimately a puppet government. Christianity did not invent modern secular law. It simply copied the Roman empire and replaced their polytheism with Christian dictators and puppet governments.

Islam also reflects the same feudal mentality. The literary reason you see "Lord" used in all three books, is literally because that is what most humans lived under.

Now, if any Christian or Muslim or Jew values a secular pluralistic west, as I think they should, then they need to be self reflective as to why those books were written, and the truth is they were written for the humans back then reflecting the social norms of life back then. None of them have any modern value as far as reflecting modern pluralism. Those books were written in a very tribal time because that is how people lived, under kings, dictators.

[Brian37]

Now you may not wish violence on non Muslims, and we are happy with any human who values non violence. Unfortunately even with non violent believers of ANY label, what they, like you, fail to see is that the violent people are picking up the same book you use to justify non violence, to justify violence.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world.../79623914/

But the same can be said for any religion.

[GUBU]

Sheed cut the bullshit. Just because you're willing to blindly follow a phantasm over a cliff doesn't allow you to throw shit at the rest of us and pronounce what you believe to threats in our direction. The fact of the matter is that your god doesn't exist, and even if he did, to use the immortal words of Havelock Vetinari, "it is up to all of us to become his moral superior" because frankly your god if real is a piece of shit of the most pungent order.

I know ur trying to get me to retaliate against u speaking so negatively towards my belief and my Lord. But I won't. As I said b4 I pose no threats and have not said one single disrespectful or negative statement towards atheism. The only thing I have done is told what I believe as true and have simply warned you about God. He is Loving, and Most Merciful to those who obey Him, worship Him alone, and seek His forgiveness. But He is also strict in punishment, and should be feared by all mankind

I'm not denigrating your god, I am simply making factual statements about him, based on available evidence. Given what we know allah either doesn't exist (about 99% certain) or he's a giant shit (based off the fucked up instructions in the quran). You can try to prove me wrong if you want, but be warned your evidence must be far superior than the rubbish supplied to now.