Love the Lord your God with all your heart ?

[robvalue]

Yep, think they mistranslated obey.

Exactly my thoughts.

Love is completely the wrong word.

I can't love something, or even have an opinion about it, until I understand what it is and have had some experience of it. And the character of Yahweh is about the most unlovable thing I could think of.

The only thing I love about him is his continued absence from reality.

[Ignorant]

Yep, think they mistranslated obey.

Exactly my thoughts.

Love is completely the wrong word.

I can't love something, or even have an opinion about it, until I understand what it is and have had some experience of it. And the character of Yahweh is about the most unlovable thing I could think of.

The only thing I love about him is his continued absence from reality.

Amen to this. Authentic love seems to be interdependent with knowledge. The more we know, the better we love. The more we love, the better we know. At least I think so anyway.

[Thomas Kelly252525]

Yep, think they mistranslated obey.

Exactly my thoughts.

Love is completely the wrong word.

I can't love something, or even have an opinion about it, until I understand what it is and have had some experience of it. And the character of Yahweh is about the most unlovable thing I could think of.

The only thing I love about him is his continued absence from reality.

robvalue,

I'm wondering if you say that you don't love someone, what might you mean by the word love in that ?

[robvalue]

Ignorant: Thank you Again I appreciate your response.

Thomas: If I don't love someone?

Well, that would usually imply that I have some experience of them and my reaction isn't one of love. It's different to not being able to even have the opportunity to love someone, because I've never met them.

Love is tricky to define. I don't consider it a binary condition: love or not love. In fact, it's more like an extreme version of like. But you can also love, and like, things in different ways.

I'd say I love someone, in one way or another, if I care about them deeply. I'd even go so far as to put their happiness ahead of my own much of the time. I probably think about them frequently, and I'd be very sad if I lost them for whatever reason.

So if I don't love someone, it could be that I don't like them at all, or it could be I do like them, but not to the point where I feel very close to them in the ways I suggested above.

[Thomas Kelly252525]

Ignorant: Thank you Again I appreciate your response.

Thomas: If I don't love someone?

Well, that would usually imply that I have some experience of them and my reaction isn't one of love. It's different to not being able to even have the opportunity to love someone, because I've never met them.

Love is tricky to define. I don't consider it a binary condition: love or not love. In fact, it's more like an extreme version of like. But you can also love, and like, things in different ways.

I'd say I love someone, in one way or another, if I care about them deeply. I'd even go so far as to put their happiness ahead of my own much of the time. I probably think about them frequently, and I'd be very sad if I lost them for whatever reason.

So if I don't love someone, it could be that I don't like them at all, or it could be I do like them, but not to the point where I feel very close to them in the ways I suggested above.

robvalue,

Thanks.  I think thoughtful answers are right for rational discussion.

Do you think it's fair to say that if someone does or says something to please you then you love them ?

If someone does or says something to displease you then you don't love them ?

That goodwill is constant in you if pleased by someone or displeased by them ?

That if someone pleases you all the time that you are close to them and you love them ?

[robvalue]

robvalue,

Thanks.  I think thoughtful answers are right for rational discussion.

Cheers, no problem

Do you think it's fair to say that if someone does or says something to please you then you love them ?

I find your wording confusing. Are you saying I love them as a result, or by definition? I assume the former as the latter doesn't appear to make sense.

If they do or say one thing to please me? No, I wouldn't necessarily love them after that. That's pretty unlikely unless it was something truly astonishing.

I wouldn't necessarily love someone even if they did and said loads of things to please me. It would depend on many factors, and in a lot of ways it's out of my control how much I like or love someone.

If someone does or says something to displease you then you don't love them ?

Again if it's one thing, then that's unlikely to stop me loving someone, unless it's something really bad.

If someone I love starts doing a high proportions of things to displease me, then it's quite possible I will stop loving them.

That goodwill is constant in you if pleased by someone or displeased by them ?

I don't understand what this means, sorry. If you mean do I (try to) treat people with respect regardless of my opinion of them, that is correct. I try and give people a "minimum package", instead of returning whatever they do to me in kind. Those people who give me a reason to like them more will receive more from me in return.

That if someone pleases you all the time that you are close to them and you love them ?

If someone pleases me all the time... I'm not too sure what this means. If it means their company causes me to be pleased, then that may well mean I love them. It depends on how much. If they please me a great deal all the time, or even the majority of the time, I probably love them in some capacity.

[Drich]

34 Hearing that Jesus had silenced the Sadducees, the Pharisees got together. 35 One of them, an expert in the law, tested him with this question: 36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”

37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

Matthew 22:34-40

Love... perhaps the greatest mystery of all.  Is it a feeling, or is it a choice?  The greatest commandment says to love God with all your heart.  This would seem to imply that love is a choice, that we can choose to love or not love God. 

The greeks believed love was sub divided into four distinct form or expressions. (and this is important because the sub-division of love expressed follows the greek model in that we have been commanded to Agape'/Love God)

Agape' was a form of respect and reverance. Agape' was a choice.

Eros was passion/emotion.


Philia was a brotherly/friend based love it too was a choice

Storge' is the type of love or bond between parent and child.

So from A historical perspective it is possible to both choose and to simply feel love, it just depends on what aspect of love one is referring to.
But here the command is for one to Agape' but the command does not end there, which kinda leads to your next questions

Those who advocate that love is a choice talk of choosing to commit to the one you love and engage in loving acts towards the loved one, but do these same choices apply to loving a disembodied spirit?  Loving somebody with all your heart and mind and soul seems to speak to love as a feeling.  Does the heart or soul choose?  Is it possible to choose to "love God with all your heart and soul and mind"?

The command is to Agape' God with all your being. as we are only heart mind body/strength and spirit this would mean all of our aspects are needed to full fill this command. As you pointed out not all aspects are fully under our control (hence the heart wants what the heart wants.) So then this process must start with what we do have control over and that is our minds.

We must decide this full expression of Love God is asking of us is something we want to give Him. Then we simply ask God to provide us with the ability to harness and control the love he has asked us to provide.

It's simple, in that we use what he gives us to His glory and he will give us more.

[Thomas Kelly252525]

robvalue,

Thanks.  I think thoughtful answers are right for rational discussion.

robvalue,

"Cheers, no problem "

You're welcome. I think it's good when people want to do good to other people and don't want to think of it as being an inconvenience to them.  I think the strength of great patience may be shown in thinking that way.

Do you think it's fair to say that if someone does or says something to please you then you love them ?

"I find your wording confusing. Are you saying I love them as a result, or by definition? I assume the former as the latter doesn't appear to make sense."

I was wondering what your thoughts were about how love happens.

"If they do or say one thing to please me? No, I wouldn't necessarily love them after that. That's pretty unlikely unless it was something truly astonishing."

"I wouldn't necessarily love someone even if they did and said loads of things to please me. It would depend on many factors, and in a lot of ways it's out of my control how much I like or love someone."

I think it's possible someone may work to please you by what they say or do to you one time and you may be pleased by it and experience what you may think of as love.

If someone does or says something to displease you then you don't love them ?

"Again if it's one thing, then that's unlikely to stop me loving someone, unless it's something really bad."

I think it's right to have goodwill all the time and you may see partly what I mean by goodwill below.  Do you think the word love has the same definition as the word goodwill ?

"If someone I love starts doing a high proportions of things to displease me, then it's quite possible I will stop loving them."

I think we may have similar thoughts about this.  I'm thinking a person may have goodwill all the time and be sometimes displeased by what someone says or does.

That goodwill is constant in you if pleased by someone or displeased by them ?

"I don't understand what this means, sorry. If you mean do I (try to) treat people with respect regardless of my opinion of them, that is correct. I try and give people a "minimum package", instead of returning whatever they do to me in kind. Those people who give me a reason to like them more will receive more from me in return."

I think we have had similar thoughts. By goodwill I was meaning things like not wanting to return evil for evil or insult for insult, doing or saying to people the same as I want someone to do or say to me if I were in their position, working for people advantage even in disagreements, wanting to be impartial, wanting to do justice. I think sometimes there may be people who are beyond being helped and there is nothing more we can give them.

That if someone pleases you all the time that you are close to them and you love them ?

"If someone pleases me all the time... I'm not too sure what this means. If it means their company causes me to be pleased, then that may well mean I love them. It depends on how much. If they please me a great deal all the time, or even the majority of the time, I probably love them in some capacity."

I think my level of goodwill shouldn't change. I think a person may not change their level of goodwill and be pleased many times.

[Thomas Kelly252525]

Love... perhaps the greatest mystery of all.  Is it a feeling, or is it a choice?  The greatest commandment says to love God with all your heart.  This would seem to imply that love is a choice, that we can choose to love or not love God. 

The greeks believed love was sub divided into four distinct form or expressions. (and this is important because the sub-division of love expressed follows the greek model in that we have been commanded to Agape'/Love God)

Agape' was a form of respect and reverance. Agape' was a choice.

Eros was passion/emotion.


Philia was a brotherly/friend based love it too was a choice

Storge' is the type of love or bond between parent and child.

So from A historical perspective it is possible to both choose and to simply feel love, it just depends on what aspect of love one is referring to.
But here the command is for one to Agape' but the command does not end there, which kinda leads to your next questions

Those who advocate that love is a choice talk of choosing to commit to the one you love and engage in loving acts towards the loved one, but do these same choices apply to loving a disembodied spirit?  Loving somebody with all your heart and mind and soul seems to speak to love as a feeling.  Does the heart or soul choose?  Is it possible to choose to "love God with all your heart and soul and mind"?

The command is to Agape' God with all your being. as we are only heart mind body/strength and spirit this would mean all of our aspects are needed to full fill this command. As you pointed out not all aspects are fully under our control (hence the heart wants what the heart wants.) So then this process must start with what we do have control over and that is our minds.

We must decide this full expression of Love God is asking of us is something we want to give Him. Then we simply ask God to provide us with the ability to harness and control the love he has asked us to provide.

It's simple, in that we use what he gives us to His glory and he will give us more.

Drich,

It may be thought that by serving people in the right way for God it shows a person's respect or reverence for him and the person's goodwill towards other people and God.

I think there are many ways a person may work to serve people and God and goodwill must be the force behind serving people and God.

I think it may be thought that a man may be thought of as a brother, friend, parent, son, teacher, servant, doctor and so on and it may be thought of how many different ways a man's goodwill may be shown in the various positions.

[Drich]

The greeks believed love was sub divided into four distinct form or expressions. (and this is important because the sub-division of love expressed follows the greek model in that we have been commanded to Agape'/Love God)

Agape' was a form of respect and reverance. Agape' was a choice.

Eros was passion/emotion.


Philia was a brotherly/friend based love it too was a choice

Storge' is the type of love or bond between parent and child.

So from A historical perspective it is possible to both choose and to simply feel love, it just depends on what aspect of love one is referring to.
But here the command is for one to Agape' but the command does not end there, which kinda leads to your next questions



The command is to Agape' God with all your being. as we are only heart mind body/strength and spirit this would mean all of our aspects are needed to full fill this command. As you pointed out not all aspects are fully under our control (hence the heart wants what the heart wants.) So then this process must start with what we do have control over and that is our minds.

We must decide this full expression of Love God is asking of us is something we want to give Him. Then we simply ask God to provide us with the ability to harness and control the love he has asked us to provide.

It's simple, in that we use what he gives us to His glory and he will give us more.

Drich,

It may be thought that by serving people in the right way for God it shows a person's respect or reverence for him and the person's goodwill towards other people and God.

I think there are many ways a person may work to serve people and God and goodwill must be the force behind serving people and God.

I think it may be thought that a man may be thought of as a brother, friend, parent, son, teacher, servant, doctor and so on and it may be thought of how many different ways a man's goodwill may be shown in the various positions.

The first of the greatest commands is to Love God with all your being, the second is to love your neighbor as yourself. In these two command Jesus said the whole Law can be honored or full filled. Meaning if one can love God with all that he is and simply Love his neighbor as himself then then the basis of all of God's law can be honored.

Now I completely understand what you are saying, in that loving your fellow man is apart of loving God. The answer to that is both yes and no. No in that if by simply loving your fellow man was the same as loving God with all of your heart mind spirit and strength their would not need to be the second of the two greatest commands Jesus points out. ...And Yes loving your fellow Man is the apart of Loving God, because loving only those who love God follow His commands.. and as "loving your neighbor" represents 50% of all of God's commands one can not love God without loving his neighbor.

But again, the love of God does not stop there with loving your fellow man. The love God asks of us encompasses all of our being, this is something we do not have access to and is impossible to do with out God helping us. so then again we take what we have access to (our will/minds) and ask God to turn the rest of ourselves over to us so that we may choose to give him the Agape' asked of us.