Problem of good and evil for an atheist

[darkwolf176]

Killing Hitler would not have prevented the Second World War which was pretty much inevitable as a brought on by the growing economic and nationalistic factors of the time. In all likelihood another perhaps more successful leader would have risen to replace him (someone who would have made less mistakes and possibly won the second world war), his ideas where shared by many at the time.

[Minimalist]

Killing a baby, an innocent baby for any reason is evil. (please dont derail this thread with attacking the Bible)

We don't have to. You just did it for us. Thanks.

Slay utterly old [and] young, both maids, and little children, and women: but come not near any man upon whom [is] the mark; and begin at my sanctuary. Then they began at the ancient men which [were] before the house.

Ezekiel 9:6

This is not an "attack" on your bible. This is what is in your fucking bible. Apparently, baby killing is okay with god at times so it is outside of your assertion that killing one is "evil."

Now, by all means, let the apologetics flow like a river!

[Rev. Rye]

Killing Hitler would not have prevented the Second World War which was pretty much inevitable as a brought on by the growing economic and nationalistic factors of the time. In all likelihood another perhaps more successful leader would have risen to replace him (someone who would have made less mistakes and possibly won the second world war), his ideas where shared by many at the time.

And, from what I've read, it seems that Hitler himself was not directly responsible for the details of many of the atrocities his nation committed. According to Ian Kershaw, it seems that Hitler's main methods were to give vague instructions to his followers and have them hammer out the details, and he'd reward the one he'd like the most. For instance, he'd probably have said something like, "Heydrich and Himmler, try and figure out a way to take care of the Jews of Europe once and for all," and they'd come up with plans for concentration camps with built-in gas chambers and a crematorium that can handle up to 4000 bodies daily.

Oh, and while we're on the subject of Baby-killing and the Bible, here's Hosea 13:16 (Amplified Version)
Samaria shall bear her guilt and become desolate, for she rebelled against her God; they shall fall by the sword, their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their pregnant women shall be ripped up.

Or Better yet, Psalm 137 (also Amplified):
1BY THE rivers of Babylon, there we [captives] sat down, yes, we wept when we [earnestly] remembered Zion [the city of our God imprinted on our hearts].
2On the willow trees in the midst of [Babylon] we hung our harps.
3For there they who led us captive required of us a song with words, and our tormentors and they who wasted us required of us mirth, saying, Sing us one of the songs of Zion.
4How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
5If I forget you, O Jerusalem, let my right hand forget its skill [with the harp].
6Let my tongue cleave to the roof of my mouth if I remember you not, if I prefer not Jerusalem above my chief joy!(A)
7Remember, O Lord, against the Edomites, that they said in the day of Jerusalem's fall, Down, down to the ground with her!
8O Daughter of Babylon [you devastator, you!], who [ought to be and] shall be destroyed, happy and blessed shall he be who requites you as you have served us.(B)
9Happy and blessed shall he be who takes and dashes your little ones against the rock!

[Minimalist]

Yep.

[Rhage]

See Min, we I make that point to the godbots, it makes them all huffy. Makes me laugh, but they sure do get huffy.

[Minimalist]

Their sky-daddy tells them to be huffy.

[TheDarkestOfAngels]

Whether you like it or not. There ARE things which are absolutely evil and things which are absolutely good.
I know most atheists atempt to discredit this idea (There is a huge problem if there is such thing).

Absolutes aren't. We abhor killing baby humans because they're babies of our species. Humans also trigger that emotion in things that remind us of babies, extending to the 'cuteness' of other species as well, including dogs, cats, apes, horses, and so forth.
But do you feel guilty for murdering baby ants? Baby spiders? Baby anything that isn't 'cute'?
Have you ever eaten veal? What about children that you've killed indirectly through purchasing goods from companies who severely damage the environment and becomes responsible for murdering vast tracks of wildlife and ruining the families of everyone whose livelyhood depends on there being a stable ecosystem? (You know, like BP, but there are plenty of other examples).

Since we are the only creature on this planet, who has the ability to do evil and good and not just to respond to external stimuli. This notion of good and evil had to come from somewhere.
Evolutionarily speaking why should I care if a child was killed in Africa?
There is no natural explanation for the concept of good and evil. So where did it come from?
I personally think it came from a cosmological battle between good and evil, although I cant conclude and prove that it, it explains things much better than anything else.

It came from us. It couldn't have come from anywhere else. Evolution isn't an outlook on life. It's not a system of morals or beliefs - it's a process by which life can diversify.

[Oldandeasilyconfused]

[downbeatplumb]

[The Omnissiunt One]

Morality, if I can chip in with my view, is an ongoing debate within society about how to prioritise people's interests, which include their pre-existing moral beliefs. Some things we worked out ages ago; societies can't exist if everyone is allowed to rape, murder and steal on a whim. Other things vary wildly from culture to culture. Still, I believe that we can claim the existence of an objective moral standard (like, for instance, going against a person's wishes, unless not doing so goes against more people's wishes, is bad). This is not because of some supernatural command, but because of our compassion, our ability to reason and our need to decide what we can allow and what we can't.