Forced Prayer

[Arkilogue]

Others have already better explained his options at such an age, I am offering something he can constructively do with his time and use to create dialog/space with/between the believers around him.

Simple gratitude and saying "thank you" is biologically beneficial and not addressed to any conception of deity, and if one exists, there is no way it could not reach such a being.

Islamic prayer is anywhere from 10 or 15 minutes to an hour, 5 times a day. That's a lot of time.

He said he's trying to avoid prayer since it's being forced on him. Suggesting another form of hokey religion as a replacement is probably offensive to someone who is going through this kind of crap at home. But go ahead and attempt to push your idea of religion on him if it makes you feel better. It doesn't matter how it makes him feel.

I don't always dislike believers, but I am starting to really dislike you.

I am not telling him what to believe, I am telling him what he can do with the time and ritual his parents are forcing him to participate in, in a language they would understand so that he can put their mind at ease and get them off his back.

If you are forced to kneel and touch your forehead to the ground, you can either repeat in your mind "f-you Islam, f-you Islam, f-you Islam." Or you can spend your time being grateful for, among many other things, the space of the atom's that compose your body and the trillions of stars that had to die to make them. Thus you are not some random burp of existence by a capricious God but a summation of universal order that has accumulated over billions of years.

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I don't always dislike believers, but I am starting to really dislike you.

As you wish...

[Jesster]

He said he's trying to avoid prayer since it's being forced on him. Suggesting another form of hokey religion as a replacement is probably offensive to someone who is going through this kind of crap at home. But go ahead and attempt to push your idea of religion on him if it makes you feel better. It doesn't matter how it makes him feel.

I don't always dislike believers, but I am starting to really dislike you.

I am not telling him what to believe, I am telling him what he can do with the time and ritual his parents are forcing him to participate in, in a language they would understand so that he can put their mind at ease and get them off his back.

If you are forced to kneel and touch your forehead to the ground, you can either repeat in your mind "f-you Islam, f-you Islam, f-you Islam." Or you can spend your time being grateful for, among many other things, the space of the atom's that compose your body and the trillions of stars that had to die to make them. Thus you are not some random burp of existence by a capricious God but a summation of universal order that has accumulated over billions of years.

So you're telling him to send a mental thank you to something that isn't sentient and can't receive that thank you anyway. Sounds like another form of prayer to me.

[ScienceAf]

I am not telling him what to believe, I am telling him what he can do with the time and ritual his parents are forcing him to participate in, in a language they would understand so that he can put their mind at ease and get them off his back.

If you are forced to kneel and touch your forehead to the ground, you can either repeat in your mind "f-you Islam, f-you Islam, f-you Islam." Or you can spend your time being grateful for, among many other things, the space of the atom's that compose your body and the trillions of stars that had to die to make them. Thus you are not some random burp of existence by a capricious God but a summation of universal order that has accumulated over billions of years.

So you're telling him to send a mental thank you to something that isn't sentient and can't receive that thank you anyway. Sounds like another form of prayer to me.

Why does it feel good to have a journal where I express my feelings to nothing?

[Jesster]

So you're telling him to send a mental thank you to something that isn't sentient and can't receive that thank you anyway. Sounds like another form of prayer to me.

Why does it feel good to have a journal where I express my feelings to nothing?

I wouldn't compare the two. If you want to, go ahead. That's none of my business.

[Arkilogue]

I am not telling him what to believe, I am telling him what he can do with the time and ritual his parents are forcing him to participate in, in a language they would understand so that he can put their mind at ease and get them off his back.

If you are forced to kneel and touch your forehead to the ground, you can either repeat in your mind "f-you Islam, f-you Islam, f-you Islam." Or you can spend your time being grateful for, among many other things, the space of the atom's that compose your body and the trillions of stars that had to die to make them. Thus you are not some random burp of existence by a capricious God but a summation of universal order that has accumulated over billions of years.

So you're telling him to send a mental thank you to something that isn't sentient and can't receive that thank you anyway. Sounds like another form of prayer to me.

Of course that assumes there is nothing to receive the prayer, but even that is sideline to the affect of gratitude on the human body and psyche.

There is no preconception of deity required and that completely gets in the way of fluency.

A preconceived idealization of this or that "God" to receive a prayer is static.
Expression of gratitude is fluent.

[Jesster]

So you're telling him to send a mental thank you to something that isn't sentient and can't receive that thank you anyway. Sounds like another form of prayer to me.

Of course that assumes there is nothing to receive the prayer, but even that is sideline to the affect of gratitude on the human body and psyche.

There is no preconception of deity required and that completely gets in the way of fluency.

A preconceived idealization of this or that "God" to receive a prayer is static.
Expression of gratitude is fluent.

And now we come to the crux of your argument. We now have a target for your prayer. Thank you for being honest about your intentions.

[Arkilogue]

So you're telling him to send a mental thank you to something that isn't sentient and can't receive that thank you anyway. Sounds like another form of prayer to me.

Why does it feel good to have a journal where I express my feelings to nothing?

Because you are not expressing it to nothing. You are expressing it at the very least, to yourself. The book and ink marks as letters and formed words/idea give you the reflective membrane, material information and space to know what you currently express. So that you can reflect upon it and refine it into new and greater expressions.

It is the development of purpose and meaning.

[Jesster]

Why does it feel good to have a journal where I express my feelings to nothing?

Because you are not expressing it to nothing. You are expressing it at the very least, to yourself. The book and ink marks as letters and formed words/idea give you the reflective membrane, material information and space to know what you currently express.  So that you can reflect upon it and refine it into new and greater expressions.

It is the development of purpose and meaning.

Self reflection is absolutely wonderful. That's not what you were saying before though. If you want to change your tune and deny what you meant before, then great. We'll go with that instead.

Now that is similar to writing in a journal. As soon as it comes to "being thankful" to some outside mystery, you are going far beyond the journal comparison.

[Arkilogue]

Of course that assumes there is nothing to receive the prayer, but even that is sideline to the affect of gratitude on the human body and psyche.

There is no preconception of deity required and that completely gets in the way of fluency.

A preconceived idealization of this or that "God" to receive a prayer is static.
Expression of gratitude is fluent.

And now we come to the crux of your argument. We now have a target for your prayer. Thank you for being honest about your intentions.

The "target" of the prayer is the quality of the prayer itself. Like interacts with and attracts like.

The effect of such an expression passing through you cannot be "helped". For every electric action there is an equal and opposite magnetic reaction.

The religious purpose of worship of a deity is to receive spiritual sustenance.

[Jesster]

And now we come to the crux of your argument. We now have a target for your prayer. Thank you for being honest about your intentions.

The "target" of the prayer is the quality of the prayer itself.  Like interacts with and attracts like.

The effect of such an expression passing through you cannot be "helped".  For every electric action there is an equal and opposite magnetic reaction.

The religious purpose of worship of a deity is to receive spiritual sustenance.

Now we're back to word salad. I'm calling on Poe's Law again. If not, then save your preaching for another thread.