Origin of Allah(Al-illah)

[DeistPaladin]

Gen 1:26 Let us make man in our image - hmm - one God but many

There are different interpretations behind Yahweh's curious use of the "royal we" in the early books of the OT. One is that it's a reference to the Trinity. However, the ancient Hebrews had no such concept and Yahweh's practice discontinued by the time of Isaiah (he uses the term "I" in referring to himself). A stronger explanation I believe is the idea that the ancient Hebrews were polytheistic. Indeed there are verses of the Bible that suggest there are multiple gods out there and that the ancient Hebrews were at least henotheistic. I have a video on that subject that reviews specific passages.

The vast majority of religions deal with forgiveness through sacrifice, I didn't say otherwise. What I said is that the God of mainstream Christianity is the evolutionary ultimate step having God doing the sacrifice.

The problem here is that if Jesus is God, who is he sacrificing himself to? Himself? To convince himself to forgive us? If Yahweh wishes to forgive, why doesn't he simply do so instead of making himself bleed on a cross? If the sacrifice was a display of Jesus' love for humanity, I can think of better displays of love than having people whip him and crucify him.

In Islam it's still down to the person to earn their way to God.

Advantage: Islam.

A god that considers our ethics and morality to be the most important considerations of our character is more moral than a god who considers only what our metaphysical beliefs about a sacrifice on a cross were.

My problem with Islamic morality, like with any religious code of morality, is that it demonizes victimless crimes like blasphemy, idolatry and homosexuality while exalting useless activities like prayer or rituals.

Islam is Abrahamic in source but unlike Christianity, is internally inconsistent.

So says the only religion in history that tries to be monotheistic and polytheistic at the same time. "We worship only one god... in three parts. The three are separate and yet part of the same god. One god and yet three at the same time."

[fr0d0]

I m actually a mainstream Christian as any other mainstream Christian here will tell you. I have no personal beliefs that conflict with that, and have expressed none here.

You are telling that stories from bible are not literal, genesis is just a poem But original christians disagre.They believed it's the story of real creation since the begining of christianity.

Your statement contradicts the facts : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allegorical...of_Genesis

Even today you are in the minority who accept evolution among christians. Most of the christians doesn't accept evolution. and that "nutjobs" holds the belief of original christianity.

Other way around I'm afraid. The vocal nutjob minority are spouting this shit.

You are sayin bible is not literal and they misunderstood it. Muhammed says some parts of bible is changed and they misunderstood it.They dont have a proof, you dont have a proof. I can't see any difference. So how do you consider your god same as "Original" christian god but allah is not? Allah is same with christian&judaism's god becouse it claims to be.(and believe me they are really really similar beliefs nearly every story in bible is in quran) its just that simple.

The Judaic and Christian God are one and the same. Both Christians and Jews agree. Both Christians and Jews also agree that Allah isn't God.

Personally I use hard logic to show me the truth of something. Allah fails on basic logical contradiction. This doesn't require me to be Christian to say that. It's just blatantly obvious. The Christian God has only lack of faith and unproven claims against his logical consistency.

[Minimalist]

If Yahweh wishes to forgive, why doesn't he simply do so instead of making himself bleed on a cross?

Yet one more example of god being a shmuck.

[Godscreated]

[/quote]

Gen 1:26 Let us make man in our image

Fr0d0 if you believe that Genesis is poetry then why use this to explain God.

The vast majority of religions deal with forgiveness through sacrifice, I didn't say otherwise. What I said is that the God of mainstream Christianity is the evolutionary ultimate step having God doing the sacrifice.

The problem here is that if Jesus is God, who is he sacrificing himself to? Himself? To convince himself to forgive us? If Yahweh wishes to forgive, why doesn't he simply do so instead of making himself bleed on a cross? If the sacrifice was a display of Jesus' love for humanity, I can think of better displays of love than having people whip him and crucify him.

It's not so much Jesus sacrificing Himself to the Father, it's more like Jesus sacrificing Himself for us. Please remember we're talking about a supernatural being so things like the Trinity, sacrifice, eternity, omniscient, omnipresent, omnipotent are far from our understanding.

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[quote='fr0d0' pid='89653' dateline='1282776673']
The differences between Allah of Islam and the mainstream Xtian God are so numerous it's difficult to see how anyone could say they are even related.

http://www.answering-islam.org/Shamoun/god.htm

IMO The Quran's depiction of Allah as a god is logically inconsistent if it shared any attributes with God.

They are pictured as the same god, stop being grumpy about it

Two very huge differences 1st allah is never referred to as heavenly father, nor not once in the 99 excellent names in the quran is allah ever called love. Makes for two very different pictures.

[annatar]

@frodo
lets be straight, are your beliefs same as beliefs of christians who live 1000 years ago? If it is you should go hunt witches. If not, then you do not believe in same god.
And of course christians and jews don't accept allah as same as their god. Its like jews don't accept jesus.. If they had accepted allah they would have to be muslim dont you think?

ahura mazda->Yehovah->jesus christ->allah
all the same god....

[Minimalist]

ahura mazda->Yehovah->jesus christ->allah
all the same god....

Yep. Same shit - different packaging.

[fr0d0]

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@frodo
lets be straight, are your beliefs same as beliefs of christians who live 1000 years ago? If it is you should go hunt witches. If not, then you do not believe in same god.
And of course christians and jews don't accept allah as same as their god. Its like jews don't accept jesus.. If they had accepted allah they would have to be muslim dont you think?

ahura mazda->Yehovah->jesus christ->allah
all the same god....

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Those Christians 1000 years ago weren't acting like Christians anna, they were people clearly going against Christ's teachings. People do that.

You said above that you agreed that Allah was not God. Now you're arguing that Allah is the same as God?!?!? To be the same god the definitions would have to be the same. Jews and Christians agree on the descriptions of God. Islam teaches that Allah has different attributes to those, therefore we conclude that Allah ≠ the Christian or Judaic God.

[Minimalist]

But they were 1,000 years closer to the source - whatever that may have been - than you are. Shouldn't they be closer to the original than you?

[annatar]

You said above that you agreed that Allah was not God. Now you're arguing that Allah is the same as God?!?!?

Yes I agreed allah is not god I also agreed jesus or yehovah is not god. Dude I dont believe in gods... But you call them gods what can I do? And your god and allah has too many similarities that we can say they are same. Plus Muhammed states that allah is the abraham's god and therefore your god. You cant deny him. this is one of the disadvantage of believe in feary tales. Everything you would have said about their differences can be eleminated with saying "they didn't understand it" or "they changed the words of god." When you look at the begining of this thread you can see that I pointed one significant difference between your god and allah. But even this wouldn't count.Becouse muhammed's intentions were different when he created that religion.And quran is not the rules of al illah but yehovah.. Names are not important.

Those Christians 1000 years ago weren't acting like Christians anna, they were people clearly going against Christ's teachings. People do that.

And to them you are not acting like a christian. Yes you have a better and more civilized religion but thats the truth. and by the way one source couses this much variety of beliefs, and you call your book consistent?

[fr0d0]

You seem to abandon reason anna. You can be shown logic and bare faced deny it. I can deny what Mohammed says where it it demonstrably and clearly contradictory of itself. The Quran contradicts itself when saying Allah = God and then saying that God is what he cannot be logically. It's quite simple.

To act like a Christian you have to follow Christ's teachings anna. If an action can be clearly demonstrated to violate that teaching then we can with justification classify the action as not Christian.