Is there objective Truth?

[Edwardo Piet]

All truth is objective.

[bennyboy]

Perfect enough for government work.

Not. . . sure. . . how to. . . respond.

[Edwardo Piet]

With honesty.

[Soldat Du Christ]

Of course! Maybe a little too formal calling me sir alot, lol, but still refreshing. If you are okay with it i still have questions and propositions. Just can't tell if you are done or not so feel free to ignore me or call it quits.

So i'm curious to know what you mean when you imply something other than human sense making, as being a possible alternitive.

And rythm made me realise somthing i havn't been direct about, and that is, i see worldviews, and epistemology as being structured. While the contrary it's more of a mish mash of beliefs and facts, and you are just attempting to connect all the dots is that correct? Like a big puzzle piece of life? In that light, i comprehend alot more about the points you where making before.

Thanks for your response, Soldat Du Christ.  I think you are starting to understand my inquiries.  I like your "big puzzle piece of life" phrase. 

Now if this is correct or mostly correct, could you could give me your synopsis on the idea of these different ways to visualise a world view. (Negate the supernaturalism vs naturalism atm)

Unfortunately, my position is one of uncertainty. As a result, I do not think I'm capable of giving a meaningful and original response to your inquiry.  However, IMO, if theists and non-theists were to suspend their judgement of one another and be open to what each one has to bring to the table, then perhaps a new way of thinking can emerge, which will aid humanity in their quest to find objective truth.

I'm glad we are on the same page! That to me is important. Unfortunetly, the christian position is that we do have the truth of life. We have a proper explanation for laws, logic, objective morality. The reason why we fell behind in education, and succesively led to the ignorant christian stigma, is because that's not what's important in our word view. Love god, love your neighbor. That's all that is demanded of us. If you love god you will do your best to live how he intended for us. And if you love others you would do your best to help them find grace in gods eyes. Serve them, love them, pray for them. This life is realy nothing, no amount of comfort, or misery, makes a difference in the end.

Now erlier you say you think recognising universalism raises more questions than answers. I can't understand how one could see it that way, when there is an obvious answer. Even if you decline that answer, recognising objectivity is still a more sane, and cohisive than trying put the pieces together in a world without order IMO. I think it's a losing battle. And i'm also starting to realise that these are irreconcilable differences...

[Kernel Sohcahtoa]

[Arkilogue]

All truth is objective.

As long as you don't open the window and let in the cold....

[The Grand Nudger]

Christianity, based on peace and understanding?  Well now you're just blowing smoke up somebody's hole Kernel. Are you really treating a person with respect or understanding by pandering?

 It's based on vicarious redemption through blood sacrifice.  I'm sure plenty of christians find peace or understanding in it (after all, they;re good at seeing things that aren't there), or are..themselves, peaceful and understanding people (like most of us, some of the time)...but that doesn't change the core concept of the religion, the nature of the narrative and title of Christ from which the faith and term "Christianity" is derived. You;re not honestly addressing their faith if you have to whitewash it, and in doing so you are not respecting or accepting it for what it is, but rather what you wish for it to be. It's difficult to find the integrity in -that-.

It's not jesus-ism...it's not peace and understanding-ism.

Allow me to present a demonstration.

-Soldat (or any other christian who wishes to answer). Did Christ die on the cross for your sins, and is there any way to salvation apart from him? Would being a peaceful and understanding person...for example, atone for my sins and grant me salvation?

[Arkilogue]

Christianity, based on peace and understanding?  Well now your just blowing smoke up somebodies hole Kernel.

 It's based on vicarious redemption through blood sacrifice.  I'm sure plenty of christians find peace or understanding in it (after all, they;re good at seeing things that aren't there), or are..themselves, peaceful and understanding people (like most of us, some of the time)...but that doesn't change the  core concept of the religion, the nature of the narrative and title of Christ from which the faith and term "Christianity" is derived.  It's not jesus-ism...it's not peace and understanding-ism.

Get saved!




Penny for your thoughts: According to popular literature, when did Jesus become anointed/Christened?

[Kernel Sohcahtoa]

Christianity, based on peace and understanding?  Well now you're just blowing smoke up somebodies hole Kernel.

 It's based on vicarious redemption through blood sacrifice.  I'm sure plenty of christians find peace or understanding in it (after all, they;re good at seeing things that aren't there), or are..themselves, peaceful and understanding people (like most of us, some of the time)...but that doesn't change the  core concept of the religion, the nature of the narrative and title of Christ from which the faith and term "Christianity" is derived.  You;re not honestly addressing their faith if you have to whitewash it, and in doing so you are not respecting or accepting it for what it is, but rather what you wish for it to be.  Framing the narrative as-such presents nothing other than a fundamentally dishonest conversation.  How is that supposed to help anyone involved?  

It's not jesus-ism...it's not peace and understanding-ism.  

I respect how you feel about this Rhythm; I'm very aware about the atrocities and barbarism that have been committed in the name of religion, especially Christianity.  To be clear, I should have stated that I was basing my understanding of Christianity on my personal experiences and dealings with other Christians.  Based on these experiences, in particular, my experience at a Christian University, many Christians make the statement that their faith is based in peace.  Hence, it is this idea that I'm interested in understanding and exploring.

[The Grand Nudger]

Nothing to do with how -I- feel about it Kernel.  It's -their- faith, -their- story, -their- rules.  

You can either accept them for and as what they are or talk over and around them, albeit in a way designed to circumvent conflict regarding their very beliefs in conversation because they are unpalatable as they are...to you. If you want to understand, then you have to accept, first, what it is you're attempting to understand. Peace and understanding, apparently, means vicarious redemption through blood sacrifice. Take it up with them...or avoid it, and in doing so have -no- chance to understand it. Not sure how historical atrocities and barbarism got in there, the crucifixion of christ was neither. It's just a story.

"I'd really like to understand why you believe that chocolate is better than vanilla...so let's talk baseball!"
..................?