Clinton Interview

[Europa!]

I also think that Hillary's feminist, "First Woman President" shtick rang a little hollow.

Yes she is a woman, and technically part of a marginalized demographic. Yet she is far more privileged than most white males.

Before she lost as president (again) she was one of the top 10-20 richest, most powerful human beings on the planet.

She and Billy boy are massively wealthy, and mostly made their money by selling themselves, by getting donations from Chinese businessmen and Arab princes with the implicit understanding they will help such when in office again.

She also charged like a million dollars for any speech she gave at a university. I wonder what the going rate for a Hillary speech is now? $50?
, through actually making a product. Bill and Hillary honestly made no effort to make their money, since it was guaranteed people would want them back in action.
Sure, the Big D was a sleaze bag, but he at least made his money from actually running businesses and trying his hand at the free market.

[Fireball]

I also think that Hillary's feminist, "First Woman President" shtick rang a little hollow.

Yes she is a woman, and technically part of a marginalized demographic. Yet she is far more privileged than most white males.

Before she lost as president (again) she was one of the top 10-20 richest, most powerful human beings on the planet.

She and Billy boy are massively wealthy, and mostly made their money by selling themselves, by getting donations from Chinese businessmen and Arab princes with the implicit understanding they will help such when in office again.

She also charged like a million dollars  for any speech she gave at a university. I wonder what the going rate for a Hillary speech is now? $50?
, through actually making a product. Bill and Hillary honestly made no effort to make their money, since it was guaranteed people would want them back in action.
Sure, the Big D was a sleaze bag, but he at least made his money from actually running businesses and trying his hand at the free market  inheriting wealth,  working with the Mob, and shafting contractors.

FTFY

[Clueless Morgan]

I was super busy intentionally not voting.  Remember, before the election, how I suggested that one way to effect change in government, if the government itself were competently resistant to change via it's own claimed channels, was for a situation to develop in which only a small minority of americans voted for some winning president.  How a "mandate" coming from, say, 25% of we the people isn't authoritative and would be internationally risible on it's face?

Looks like we've got that.

Wait.  Your solution to "fixing" our democracy is to stop voting?

How is that going to help anything?

You realize that if people stop voting and the Republicans carry on gerrymandering districts to the point where they end up gaining majority control in 34 states that they can call a Constitutional Convention and start amending the constitution?

How do you think the first amendment will fair after a party of Ted Cruz's and Mike Pence's get done with it?

Which religion do you think they'll enshrine as the one and only true religion that everyone now has to practice?

How long will it be before teaching evolution is completely outlawed?  Or climate change?

And how long after that will American scientific institutions start crumbling? And after that, the economy?

People like Donald Jackass Trump will not give a shit that they don't have a mandate to govern.  They will care that they've got the receipt that shows they won, no matter how it happened.  Evidence: the 2016 general election.

The solution to fixing our democracy isn't for everyone to stop voting, it's to educate people better and to get them to care enough and informed enough to vote.

[Divinity]

FTFY

You forgot abusing bankruptcy laws, conning people, refusing to pay people for work, and basically cheating fucking everybody!

BUT HILLARY MARRIED A GUY WHO EVENTUALLY MADE A LOT OF MONEY AND WAS A SUCCESSFUL ATTORNEY HERSELF AND SPENT TIME AS A PUBLIC DEFENDER!  SO TOTALLY MORE PRIVELEGED!

[The Grand Nudger]

I was super busy intentionally not voting.  Remember, before the election, how I suggested that one way to effect change in government, if the government itself were competently resistant to change via it's own claimed channels, was for a situation to develop in which only a small minority of americans voted for some winning president.  How a "mandate" coming from, say, 25% of we the people isn't authoritative and would be internationally risible on it's face?

Looks like we've got that.

Wait.  Your solution to "fixing" our democracy is to stop voting?

Part of it, yeah.

How is that going to help anything?

When complicity no longer yields the intended or advertised effect...then non-complicity becomes the only effective form of protest.  If I keep voting, the very act of voting provides legitimacy to whatever sham they might erect on top of that pile of slips - and in so doing lays some of the responsibility for whatever happens on me.

I'm not discussing a complete disengagement from civics or politics..I;m discussing a vote of no confidence by refusing to cast a vote between unsuitable candidates. There' really no other way, in the american system...to cast a vote of no confidence. Unfortunate, since most of our peers have some mechanism for doing so.

Add that to our polls, and make the results meaningful.....and I'll pull -that- lever.

Your solution, getting everyone to vote, carries with it the requirement that our voting system works, and that when we vote..we actually are being presented with amenable options. The trouble is that we aren't...and so no solution to that problem can depend upon the problem not existing in the first place............

I do understand the various incarnations of rocking the vote - the idea of more engagement with the system. If our system were functioning, that would be the best way to address our problems....but?

[Clueless Morgan]

Wait.  Your solution to "fixing" our democracy is to stop voting?

Part of it, yeah.

If you, and I, and everyone else stops voting... then we become a democracy in name only.

I would rather vote for imperfect candidates than let the likes of Steve Bannon, Jared Kushner, Bestie DeVos, Ted Cruz and Fuckface Trump run rampant through our government passing whatever laws they want because they can say they were "elected fairly" by a majority of voters - even if the turn out of that vote was 5% of the country.

I'm not discussing a complete disengagement from civics or politics..I;m discussing a vote of no confidence by refusing to cast a vote between unsuitable candidates.

We have suitable candidates to vote for. Hillary was a suitable candidate. You don't have to love every tiny little thing about her - I didn't - but she was suitable. Especially in light of the fact that she was running against a nightmare human.

[vorlon13]

Shattered* strongly calls into question the claim of Hillary's suitability. Is there a book you can reference I could put on my reading list that might counteract that (and I'm thinking What Happened is emphatically NOT the right choice there) ??


*The book HRC reinforces how terrible she is at candidacy, I'm only halfway through the Secretary of State part (so far she's doing really well with that) so I'm not drawing a firm conclusion, although the 'less' firm conclusion so far is that in comparing her (losing) 2008 presidential primary (and how damn good Obama was in comparison, hands down, no doubt about it) and her losing in 2016 to Trump, the 'success' of a Hillary administration is still in doubt, based on actual evidence.

Just a suggestion, but a line by line refutation of the entirety of Shattered by Hillary might have been a better format for What Happened . . . .

[Clueless Morgan]

She could string together a coherent sentence and doesn't poop tweet at 3am.

She's suitable.

[Fireball]

I may have said this before. I don't like Hilary. Her handling of classified information is an affront to the people of this country. If I had done that, I would have done time. It isn't just her, it had to have been some staffers, too. Given that, it still wasn't enough for me, (holding my nose while voting) to vote for the Chump. There is just so much wrong with him, that it's really a shame that he got the nod.

[Whateverist]

She could string together a coherent sentence and doesn't poop tweet at 3am.

She's suitable.

If only some people could give up hoping for a savior-genius Mr. Goodbar candidate. But oh no, they got be super duper special or burn the whole thing down.