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Current time: 16th October 2017, 20:06

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Atheist hate having to constantly repeat this....
#31
RE: Atheist hate having to constantly repeat this....
(14th October 2017, 23:46)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: Not exactly. I'm saying that least when I was an atheist, I wasn't some pussified version. I could at least say that the proposition "God exists" was not true.

I also can (and frequently do) say that. I also say that I not only don't believe that God exists but I also believe he doesn't. That doesn't mean I'm claiming to KNOW he doesn't exist.

Quote:To profess that "God exists" is not true is a knowledge statement about the proposition. So what say you? Is the proposition "God exists" true or not true, because those are the only options.

I agree. Those are the only two options (besides "I am exactly 50/50 on the matter." to just be pedantic for a hot second). I would say God doesn't exist.

Technically, I believe God almost certainly doesn't exist. God is not logically impossible (well, some versions of God aren't logically impossible at least)... but I'm still very much in the whole "God doesn't exist" camp then. There are many things I would say don't exist without me having to claim to absolutely know it doesn't exist or be absolutely 100% sure it doesn't exist.
Steven Wilson Wrote:A good impression of myself
Not much to conceal
I'm saying nothing
But I'm saying nothing with feel

I simply am not here
No way I...
Shut up, be happy
Stop whining please

Because of who we are
We react in mock surprise
The curse of "there must be more"
So don't breathe here,
Don't leave your bags

*
But am I here?
It's kind of hard to tell
I do a good impression of myself
But what's normal now anyhow?
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#32
RE: Atheist hate having to constantly repeat this....
There's nothing illogical or weak (from a character standpoint) in saying "I don't know if a god exists. None of the evidence I've encountered thus far leads me to believe that one does, but I reserve the right to change my mind upon examining any new evidence I may encounter."

Demanding a yes/no when "I don't know" is perfectly valid is the hallmark of sloppy thinking.

Put another way, not everything is a binary proposition. The question of god's existence isn't. It's more akin to database programming, which has three states:

TRUE: The value 'true' or actual data
FALSE: The value 'false' or, depending on the comparison, an empty string or 0
NULL: This denotes the utter absence of a value, including true or false

Agnostic atheism is the null state. It can be filled with true/false regarding god's existence, but neither are currently in that cell. Because of that, belief (which relies on knowledge) defaults to no. It's a perfectly logical state to be in. Your emotional reaction to it doesn't negate the logic of it.
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#33
RE: Atheist hate having to constantly repeat this....
(14th October 2017, 23:46)Neo-Scholastic Wrote:
(14th October 2017, 20:00)Hammy Wrote: Huh. Isn't that what atheists do when they say they don't believe in a God?

Oh let me guess... you're conflating belief with knowledge and pretending an atheist has to pretend to know there isn't a God merely because they don't believe in one. You sure love your pretending.

Not exactly. I'm saying that least when I was an atheist, I wasn't some pussified version. I could at least say that the proposition "God exists" was not true. To profess that "God exists" is not true is a knowledge statement about the proposition. So what say you? Is the proposition "God exists" true or not true, because those are the only options.

Why wasn't " I don't know" listed as a possible option?  Currently, it would seem that the existence of a supernatural world or god is in the unproven category.  Hence, in the absence of rational proof and conclusive evidence/data, why not, in the spirit of intellectual honesty and curiosity, refrain from making any guesses or speculations and open oneself up to considering all of the possibilities (whatever those might be)?
"I'm fearful when I see people substituting fear for reason." Klaatu, from The Day The Earth Stood Still (1951)














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#34
RE: Atheist hate having to constantly repeat this....
(14th October 2017, 23:46)Neo-Scholastic Wrote:
(14th October 2017, 20:00)Hammy Wrote: Huh. Isn't that what atheists do when they say they don't believe in a God?

Oh let me guess... you're conflating belief with knowledge and pretending an atheist has to pretend to know there isn't a God merely because they don't believe in one. You sure love your pretending.

Not exactly. I'm saying that least when I was an atheist, I wasn't some pussified version. I could at least say that the proposition "God exists" was not true. To profess that "God exists" is not true is a knowledge statement about the proposition. So what say you? Is the proposition "God exists" true or not true, because those are the only options.

Well, did the pussification come with the god-belief?

The term "god" would have to be defined.
The existance of "god" would have to be proven with objective, verifiable evidence in order to accept the claim "God exists"

It has none, so it is a false claim.

Therefore, "god exists" is not a true claim.
"The last superstition of the human mind is the superstition that religion in itself is a good thing."  - Samuel Porter Putnam
 
           

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