Aziz Ansari Doesn't Pick Up On "Non-Verbal Cues" and Gets Treated Like A Rapist

[The Grand Nudger]

No..he didn't  He stopped --one- of the times she expressed the fact she no longer wanted to do things. The contention all along is that maybe she didn;t express it hard enough..or was sending mixed whorish smoke signals.

This is, ofc, according to her story..but if bitches be lyin to bitchy reporters....that doesn't mean much.

[Shell B]

I think that's pretty much the end of this thread. Lol.

Oh, you’re so naive.

[Joods]

I believe Joods is questioning why she went to a reporter instead of the police; not why she didn’t go to the police at all.

I'll try to follow that distinction, but it still strikes me as discrediting her story based on the absence of police contact. It seems to me that "why did she turn to the media?" has already been answered in the Babe article, though. She turned to friends in order to assess if her perception of events was justified.

Okay. I can easily see where that is gonna go. It's one thing to get support from friends and to try and "assess" the situation. It's quite another to say - "Hmmm... okay. I've been sexually assaulted. I'm gonna text that guy, tell him how I feel, then go to a reporter and have an article that will make national news, written up. All before I think about going to the cops."  

I wonder at what point in the conversation with her friends did it become a priority to get it out in the news and let the court of public opinion hang this guy, versus going to the police to have charges pressed.

Makes perfect sense to do it that way.  

[Shell B]

If what is in that article is sexual assault "by law," then let's see what would happen in court. (Waits for the token male privilege argument, as if no man has ever been accused of something he didn't do.)

You and your buds have spent pages acknowledging that his behavior while pushy, pressure-y, and creepy was in no way sexual assault. When it is indeed is. 

Why can't you just admit that you weren't aware that rape and sexual assault are NOT the exact same thing? And that you all spent hours denigrating this woman for having the audacity to state that she was sexually assaulted, when she in fact WAS in your own unwitting assessments?

Btw, I doubt this would hold it court...Because these things are difficult to prove. 
I'm pretty sure you don't need to start banging your "gender-war" gong just yet. I haven't seen any vicious man-haters in this thread. 

Have you?

I’m not taking the bait this time, sugar tits.

[The Grand Nudger]

So lets posit that she made some mystifyingly poor decisions, but that the narrative she tells about the encounter is true..... (I'm entertaining that they may both be telling us a meaningfully true story)? Would those mystifyingly poor decisions..in that case..be a legitimate reason to consider her story discredited and question her motives..and isn't that one of the things we're not supposed to say? Other indescretions, irrationality, not doing what you would have done, not being tied to a chair....what have you..what effect does that have? Many sex crime victims could leave...but don't.

[Joods]

So lets posit that she made some mystifyingly poor decisions, but that the narrative she tells about encounter is true.....?

Or better yet... 

They are grown adults capable of making decisions. They both made poor decisions that night. Luckily it didn't go any further when she finally said she didn't want to do that anymore. It's the one night stand that turned awkward and ended with her stopping it, him complying and her leaving.

[The Grand Nudger]

So lets posit that she made some mystifyingly poor decisions, but that the narrative she tells about encounter is true.....?

Or better yet... 

They are grown adults capable of making decisions. They both made poor decisions that night. Luckily it didn't go any further when she finally said she didn't want to do that anymore. It's the one night stand that turned awkward and ended with her stopping it, him complying and her leaving.

Again you say finally..but the story (her story) is one of expressing herself more than once, in more than one way..and in one way that I think might actually give me the creeps if some girl sai it to me while I was trying to sow my oats, lol. "You're all the same" is what you hear before her evil twin castrates you from behind in a b movie.....

When he stopped..it was already the end of a bizarre story.  Yes, it ended that way..but some things are alleged to have happened before that ending. I agree with you ofc, that two adults made poor decisions that night...but......?

[Joods]

Or better yet... 

They are grown adults capable of making decisions. They both made poor decisions that night. Luckily it didn't go any further when she finally said she didn't want to do that anymore. It's the one night stand that turned awkward and ended with her stopping it, him complying and her leaving.

Again you say finally..but the story (her story) is one of expressing herself more than once, in more than one way..and in one way that I think might actually give me the creeps if some girl sai it to me while I was trying to sow my oats, lol.   "You're all the same" is what you hear before her evil twin castrates you from behind in a b movie.....

When he stopped..it was already the end of a bizarre story.  I agree with you ofc, that two adults made poor decisions that night...but......?

I don't know really. This is all "he said, she said". It baffles me that she went to a reporter before going to the police - which she may or may not have done yet. Who knows? He hasn't been arrested or charged with anything yet. There's just too much speculation to try and say for sure. If only we could have been flies on the walls that night. I'm still not comfortable with considering what happened as sexual assault. And maybe my reasoning on that is because of how she put her priorities in order with regards to this whole incident. I look at that and I look at SA victims and I'd love to see some statistics on this sort of thing. There just isn't a whole lot to work with in this case. All we have is her story and his rebuttal. 

And maybe she did go to the police, but they felt, after their investigation, that there just isn't enough compelling evidence to charge him with anything. If that's the case, then, no - legally - she wasn't sexually assaulted. She will obviously see it differently, as is her right. But I believe that's where it ends. If law enforcement doesn't move forward with charges, what would the next step be to do?

[The Grand Nudger]

I also believe that thats where any -charges- end..but we don;t always see it necessarry to secure a charge or conviction to keep an eye on a creepy fucker just because a prosecutor didn't choose it as one of the 7 out of a thousand that could concievably yield jailtime..using earlier linked numbers.

I actually don't think that it not being a sex crime, in the sense of a conviction....changes anything about the justification for any adverse effect on his career, either, for example. An entertainer needs to stay in the good graces of the audience. Creeper did creeper shit..now his fanbase just might see him as a creeper.

[Athene]

Didn't you take a powder last year in part because that same first question was asked of you? Forgive me if I'm not remembering that correctly, but it seemed terribly upsetting to you at that time.

Unlike Grace, I was actually raped. The person responsible threatened my life and the life of my child. To those who think I don't know the difference - I do. Very much so. The person who raped me wasn't a celebrity. The person who raped me was someone whom I thought I could trust because unlike Grace, I knew this person. 

Oh - and unlike Grace, I never went to a reporter to get my story out.

---

I believe Joods is questioning why she went to a reporter instead of the police; not why she didn’t go to the police at all.

Exactly. But nice of people to bring up my actual rape and compare it to this. Like, what the actual fuck.

My guess that there are likely more women this forum who have been raped, or sexually abused in some way than not. 
And disturbingly high number of men as well.

Why do I think that? Because I find that case is real life. Tragically, these sort of events are not all uncommon.
People are ass.

The fact that someone's experience not have been as severe as your own, doesn't mean that it should negated and be subjected to the same victim-blaming you rightfully railed against when it pertained to you, does it? I'm not saying you should automatically believe any and every story presented, but must you utilize these shitty tactics when discussing it and coming to a judgement in a public forum where people can see it?

The premise doesn't even seem that she's lying, but that she "should've known better." Or that one shouldn't realistically expect to withdraw consent once it's been given. Or because someone doesn't take an opportunity to leave, that that they can't be forced to something and therefore MUST like it or at least be okay with it.

How do these sorts bullshit arguments these help anyone who experienced any sort of sexual assault, including rape?