Is there free will in heaven?

[salty]

I'm simply shocked by how many angry responses I receive instead of objective arguments, they can't seem to separate me personally from the ideas and thoughts I have and many don't take the time to understand if I'm trying to be insulting or if I'm unaware of how I come across...

It is nothing to be shocked at... You support a system that has been the cause of some of the most vile things in human history... It annoys me when people don't understand the anger that a lot of atheists feel.

I'm still learning where the anger comes from Frankie, it's different per person. I just want people to keep being clear with me like you are, but I also hope that someone can recognize that good things have come from the Christian movement as well as bad.

[ElDinero]

Now, it's obvious I wouldn't agree to these parameters, and you've already said I'm going somewhere else salty, so where am I going?

[frankiej]

Good people do good shit regardless of religion.

[lucent]

I read this argument from a brilliant poster named Brian Sodding Boru, an instrument-maker residing in New Zealand; on the recently exclusive board (now closed to all but actual customers) at Insight Broadband.

Christians often give free will credit/blame for man's choice to reject god and perform evil. God, we are told, wanted to make certain that our belief and our worship was genuine. He didn't want a race of sheep.

So,what happens in Heaven? Heaven is the ultimate reward, is it not? And those who make it past the Pearly Gates will be there a very, very, very, very long time. Will they have free will there? Could they commit evil? Could they reject god? Lucifer did? If we have free will, what would prevent us (and this is an editorial "us") from having differences of opinion about god, his rules and the nature of the universe he created?

And if we do not have free will, have we not lost something of immense value; something so valuable that god would rather see 99 of 100 of us burn in eternal fire, torment and damnation for the next trillion^trillion years rather than see us do without it? Surely it is something humans have PAID for.

So... what gives?

1 Corinthians 13:12
Now we see but a poor reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.

On the New Earth, we will have full knowledge of the truth. We will know fully, just as now we are fully known. People sin because of of a lack, but there will be no lack there. The former order of things will have passed away:

Revelation 21:4

He will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and death shall be no more, neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain anymore, for the former things have passed away.”

There will be no more loss, pain or sorrow. Death will be no more.

Isaiah 65:17

"Behold, I will create new heavens and a new earth. The former things will not be remembered, nor will they come to mind.

The former things won't come to mind, so sin will have no way to even be conceived of. In short, it will be perfect.

1 Corinthians 2:9

But, as it is written, “What no eye has seen, nor ear heard, nor the heart of man imagined, what God has prepared for those who love him”—

We can't imagine what it will be like, which is amazing in itself, because human beings have pretty good imaginations. It's a place where eternity can be spent in peace and joy. Think about it..ultimately, this is what everyone wants. To live forever in an eternal paradise with unlimited possibilities and fellowship. That is because He placed such a desire in our hearts. And God is making it happen in this very moment and all are welcome.

[salty]

Actually, most have picked your arguments apart. 90% of the time I see someone tearing down your opinions and points, not you as a person.

I guess I need example. Really, from what I've read there's a huge attack on my intelligence instead of a counter argument. If there's no attack on intelligence it's an attack on my personal character. Also, "you made that up" or "your Bible isn't true" isn't acceptable as a counter argument.

I'm just trying to get people to a place where they're not running after me personally, but are instead exciting about pursuing the topic.

[KichigaiNeko]

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I'm simply shocked by how many angry responses I receive instead of objective arguments, they can't seem to separate me personally from the ideas and thoughts I have and many don't take the time to understand if I'm trying to be insulting or if I'm unaware of how I come across...

It is nothing to be shocked at... You support a system that has been the cause of some of the most vile things in human history... It annoys me when people don't understand the anger that a lot of atheists feel.

I'm still learning where the anger comes from Frankie, it's different per person. I just want people to keep being clear with me like you are, but I also hope that someone can recognize that good things have come from the Christian movement as well as bad.

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[ElDinero]

I guess I need example. Really, from what I've read there's a huge attack on my intelligence instead of a counter argument. If there's no attack on intelligence it's an attack on my personal character. Also, "you made that up" or "your Bible isn't true" isn't acceptable as a counter argument.

I'm just trying to get people to a place where they're not running after me personally, but are instead exciting about pursuing the topic.

How about the ten or so pages where we showed you how empty your arguments about homosexuality were? How about how people have explained to why 'free will....within certain parameters' is a contradiction in terms? Is that attacking you? Or is it decimating your arguments with ease?

When you can't understand a concept as simple as 'free will is by definition not restricted by rules', why do you think people are attacking your intelligence? If you say stupid things, expect to be treated as stupid.

[salty]

Salty is delusional. (Sorry, Salty, but you took the Bible and turned it into your own fairy tale).

On a side note, we may do an AF calendar, considering Slutty Summer and Smutty Shelly have taken over the Member Photos thread. You should donate your wife for a pic.

Np.

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Now, it's obvious I wouldn't agree to these parameters, and you've already said I'm going somewhere else salty, so where am I going?

I don't know. Wherever you choose to go.

[ElDinero]

No, I want to go to heaven. I'm apparently not allowed in. What other choices are available? You can say it, don't be shy.

[KichigaiNeko]

Now, it's obvious I wouldn't agree to these parameters, and you've already said I'm going somewhere else salty, so where am I going?

I don't know. Wherever you choose to go.

That usually is sans your deities salty.

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