What is wrong with FW?

[Graufreud]

Nothing is wrong with free will. Without it bible would be a boring book. Daughters of Lot would not sleep with their drunken father, there would be not stoning, Jesus would not go berserk in the Temple.

[Little Rik]

Why atheists hate to hear that?

God or not God FREE WILL still affect our lives in the good or the bad so why atheists dislike to hear about it so much?  

I'd like to buy a clue.  What specifically do you have in mind when you say "free will"?

FW allow humans to decide what to do and these doing produce reactions which can be positive or negative.
Atheists despite the fact that they do not believe in God keep on blaming God for all suffering.
Beside the fact that is highly stupid blaming someone that according to them does not exist is also more stupid to pretend that our actions suppose not to create any reactions.

To summarize we are dealing with total and utter madness that is why I started this thread.  

[Chad32]

We talk about blaming god for suffering because replying to every theist thread with "God doesn't exist. /thread" doesn't make for very good discussion. We can criticize a character in a book, even if we don't think he's real.

[Amarok]

We talk about blaming god for suffering because replying to every theist thread with "God doesn't exist. /thread" doesn't make for very good discussion. We can criticize a character in a book, even if we don't think he's real.

I view god the same way i view Voldemort a horrible being i don't accept exists

[I_am_not_mafia]

I'm usually pretty good at divining your meaning, regardless of how ridiculous it is, but I haven't a clue what you're on about here.  Is this a prelude to something?

I shall name you the Little Rik Whisperer.

[Whateverist]

I'd like to buy a clue.  What specifically do you have in mind when you say "free will"?

FW allow humans to decide what to do and these doing produce reactions which can be positive or negative.

Most rabid non-FW'ers I hear from online wouldn't have any trouble conceding that humans do at least some times get to decide some things. Of course when we do the deciding consciously like that we do so according to preferences and dispositions which we do not choose. That isn't enough freedom for some but I personally have no objection on that account. Suffice to say there is something about human subjective experience which certainly feels like free will. For argument's sake I'm inclined to give it to you.

Atheists despite the fact that they do not believe in God keep on blaming God for all suffering.
Beside the fact that is highly stupid blaming someone that according to them does not exist is also more stupid to pretend that our actions suppose not to create any reactions.

I can't speak for others since, as you know, there is no dogma to be found in common among all who do not believe in your or their God/gods. But I don't think any atheists actually blames the God which they do not believe exists for anything. When they tell you the God described in the bible is a sadistic and destructive tyrant, they are addressing the hypothetical represented by the character of Jehovah as it is developed in the stories in that book. They're saying, even if the petty, vindictive sucker described in the bible existed, it would not be worthy of worship or love, the polar opposite of omni=benevolent.

But that is not the reason rational people do not believe in such things. The lack of belief comes first. Addressing the absurdity of describing that book's creator as kind and loving merely addresses what looks to us as an internal inconsistency, as one might do for a character in any other book of fiction. I hope that clears it up for you, Rik.

To summarize we are I AM dealing with total and utter madness that is why I started this thread.  

Fixed that for you with my bolding. I hope you're getting help with this.

[I_am_not_mafia]

I ask this everytime and never get an answer.

What is free will free from?

[Whateverist]

I ask this everytime and never get an answer.

What is free will free from?

That's a good question.  To desire freedom from any determination whatsoever sounds like a recipe for extreme, global apathy.  I guess it would be the freedom to act arbitrarily on every choice, indifferent to any preference.  I'll pass.

[Astreja]

I keep forgetting there are some people who go off the wall, saying they worship a god without following the book or church's teachings. This must be how new cults are formed, except some people aren't able to get a following to start one.

I'll say most normal theists, then. I don't have an explanation for your type.

His type can be readily explained if he actually bangs what passes for his head against the wall every time he posts a emoticon of head banging against the wall.

Now there's an image to cherish.  

[Little Rik]

FW allow humans to decide what to do and these doing produce reactions which can be positive or negative.

Most rabid non-FW'ers I hear from online wouldn't have any trouble conceding that humans do at least some times get to decide some things.  Of course when we do the deciding consciously like that we do so according to preferences and dispositions which we do not choose.  That isn't enough freedom for some but I personally have no objection on that account.  Suffice to say there is something about human subjective experience which certainly feels like free will.  For argument's sake I'm inclined to give it to you.

You say..........which we do not choose.................
This obvious come from the fact that you do not believe that we ever lived before and we never accumulate reactions in previous lives that in this life pop up and affect us.
I do understand your point however life teach us that good or bad luck is pure fantasy and we are responsible for our life.    
To blame the destiny for our good or bad life is pure madness.  

Atheists despite the fact that they do not believe in God keep on blaming God for all suffering.
Beside the fact that is highly stupid blaming someone that according to them does not exist is also more stupid to pretend that our actions suppose not to create any reactions.

I can't speak for others since, as you know, there is no dogma to be found in common among all who do not believe in your or their God/gods.  But I don't think any atheists actually blames the God which they do not believe exists for anything.  When they tell you the God described in the bible is a sadistic and destructive tyrant, they are addressing the hypothetical represented by the character of Jehovah as it is developed in the stories in that book.  They're saying, even if the petty, vindictive sucker described in the bible existed, it would not be worthy of worship or love, the polar opposite of omni=benevolent.

But that is not the reason rational people do not believe in such things.  The lack of belief comes first.  Addressing the absurdity of describing that book's creator as kind and loving merely addresses what looks to us as an internal inconsistency, as one might do for a character in any other book of fiction.

 


Once again I do understand your point considering that religions and the so called holy scriptures with all their lies and BS have done so much damage to humanity however it would be so much more nicer to see that when you guys criticize these dogmas you be more careful
in pointing out that these dogmas belong to these religions or scriptures not to God.  

I hope that clears it up for you, Rik.

I rather hope that you guys stop putting good and bad food in the same pot and then pretend that it is edible.  

To summarize we are I AM dealing with total and utter madness that is why I started this thread.  

Fixed that for you with my bolding.  I hope you're getting help with this.

Saying We it is a way of saying considering that WE are in a forum or a group of people that are dealing with certain issues.
If this doesn't make sense to you then rather than saying WE I would saying YOU so it is YOU that got in a total and utter madness for pretending that is God that cause suffering.
Fixed that for you with my explanation.  



To summarize I give you top marks   for your mental effort to try to understand the issue but a low mark    for getting up with the Incorrect understanding.

---

I ask this everytime and never get an answer.

What is free will free from?

There are countless ways to describe FW.  
My way is that at the moment you, me and all creatures are stuck inside a body with the option to get out and be free from this physical-material bondage or to stay stuck in this or any body for ages and ages so we can be free from being stuck or free to stay.

Funny thing that when you are stuck inside a cave like those little kids in Thailand they feel to be free ASAP but to be stuck inside a body to most doesn't feel like an ordeal and this because most people are affected by the canary syndrome    in which a canary doesn't get the feeling that he can fly despite the fact that it has the wings and the possibility to fly as per his nature.


How sad Mat.