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What can atheists do / not do?
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 (January 3, 2011 at 6:20 pm)barboft Wrote: No rules at all? How do you expect to lead good lives without at least some rules about your conduct? We make our own moral conduct and set our own rules, and if we want to live in society we must obey it's laws, of course we would prefer if all silly religious laws would go "figuratively" to hell.  (January 3, 2011 at 6:20 pm)barboft Wrote: No rules at all? How do you expect to lead good lives without at least some rules about your conduct? We tend to respect and follow the laws of the land of course. You know, no stealing or murder an all that. It's just that we have no religious rules. The only rules we'd really follow are the laws of the land.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence - Carl Sagan
Mankind's intelligence walks hand in hand with it's stupidity. Being an atheist says nothing about your overall intelligence, it just means you don't believe in god. Atheists can be as bright as any scientist and as stupid as any creationist. You never really know just how stupid someone is, until you've argued with them.  (January 3, 2011 at 5:23 pm)barboft Wrote: Do you atheists have any rules about what you can or can't do? What atheists can or cannot do depends rather directly on the belief system they have—which is not atheism. Many are Humanists, others are Buddhists, a couple here and there might be Nihilists, etc. Those are belief systems and worldviews. The only thing they have in common is atheism, which is not a belief system, worldview, philosophy, religion, etc. It is very simply a "no gods" presupposition, upon which a belief system is built. As I have said elsewhere (and you would do well to understand this point): (November 17, 2010 at 5:47 am)Ryft Wrote: Atheism is defined as the "godless" fundamental starting point (presupposition) at bottom of one's worldview, upon which his metaphysics, epistemology, ethics, and so forth is built. It is "godless" by virtue of the very term itself (Gk. atheos, which means "without deity" in the same way that asymmetrical means "without symmetry"), and it is presuppositional because nothing justifies it (for the very criteria by which he justifies anything already presupposes No Deity Required; if deity is required at any point, atheism is precluded).
Man is a rational animal who always loses his temper when
called upon to act in accordance with the dictates of reason. (Oscar Wilde)  RE: What can atheists do / not do?
January 3, 2011 at 7:17 pm
(This post was last modified: January 3, 2011 at 7:21 pm by TheDarkestOfAngels.)
(January 3, 2011 at 6:20 pm)barboft Wrote: No rules at all? How do you expect to lead good lives without at least some rules about your conduct? There are rules of conduct. Rules of etiquette, social manners, the rule of law (Indiana, United States in my case), and so on. I also have my own values. All this is to say that, for example, I don't murder people I personally value human life to a certain extent. (My rule) It is illegal to murder someone. (state and federal law) The effect of the loss of life on those who personally and intimately knew the victim would be profoundly negative. (Social values/norms/laws). I empathize with the would-be victim and the connected friends and family (my own values). My atheism has little to nothing to do with my ability to value human life and my desire to not murder someone, as it has nothing to do with any moral and rule-based decision I make in my life over the course of my existence.
If today you can take a thing like evolution and make it a crime to teach in the public schools, tomorrow you can make it a crime to teach it in the private schools and next year you can make it a crime to teach it to the hustings or in the church. At the next session you may ban books and the newspapers...
Ignorance and fanaticism are ever busy and need feeding. Always feeding and gloating for more. Today it is the public school teachers; tomorrow the private. The next day the preachers and the lecturers, the magazines, the books, the newspapers. After a while, Your Honor, it is the setting of man against man and creed against creed until with flying banners and beating drums we are marching backward to the glorious ages of the sixteenth centry when bigots lighted fagots to burn the men who dared to bring any intelligence and enlightenment and culture to the human mind. ~Clarence Darrow, at the Scopes Monkey Trial, 1925 Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first. ~Ronald Reagan  (January 3, 2011 at 6:20 pm)barboft Wrote: No rules at all? How do you expect to lead good lives without at least some rules about your conduct? Other members have answered the first part of your question and I agree with their answers, so I will not be redundant. I will say that people can lead good lives without Christianity. You seem to be leading this conversation there anyway, so I might as well say it now. 
Aaah, I see. Atheism is not a belief system, worldview, philosophy, or religion. You prefer the handy word "presupposition". Gotcha. You simply "presuppose" that there's no god. Right. Thanks for clearing that one up. Cheers.
As an atheist I can move objects with my mind. It is a little known fact that we are all superheros. You know, "us atheists" the tight knit group with rules and regulations that confound description due to their air-tight eloquence. What you should really be asking is, "What is the atheist password, and what handshakes do I need to learn to join your wonderful group and pass into the inner sanctum of your beautiful buildings of meeting?" /sarcasm
Well, there actuall was a T-shirt, but I didn't get one due to my being a fat ass and Dar didn't order enough XXLs... sob P.S. Hmm, its like some people can't read the words that come after "Religious Views" or something... (January 3, 2011 at 7:35 pm)barboft Wrote: Aaah, I see. Atheism is not a belief system, worldview, philosophy, or religion. You prefer the handy word "presupposition". Gotcha. You simply "presuppose" that there's no god. Right. Thanks for clearing that one up. Cheers. Most atheists are atheists because theists make their individual religious claims and atheists reject those claims. We don't 'presuppose' god doesn't exist, we reject the notion that god does exist.
If today you can take a thing like evolution and make it a crime to teach in the public schools, tomorrow you can make it a crime to teach it in the private schools and next year you can make it a crime to teach it to the hustings or in the church. At the next session you may ban books and the newspapers...
Ignorance and fanaticism are ever busy and need feeding. Always feeding and gloating for more. Today it is the public school teachers; tomorrow the private. The next day the preachers and the lecturers, the magazines, the books, the newspapers. After a while, Your Honor, it is the setting of man against man and creed against creed until with flying banners and beating drums we are marching backward to the glorious ages of the sixteenth centry when bigots lighted fagots to burn the men who dared to bring any intelligence and enlightenment and culture to the human mind. ~Clarence Darrow, at the Scopes Monkey Trial, 1925 Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first. ~Ronald Reagan  (January 3, 2011 at 7:35 pm)Rhizomorph13 Wrote: Well, there actuall was a T-shirt, but I didn't get one due to my being a fat ass and Dar didn't order enough XXLs... sob I might have a couple somewhere if you still want one 
![[Image: cinjin_banner_border.jpg]](https://images.weserv.nl/?url=oggtheclever.com%2Fcinjin_banner_border.jpg) (January 3, 2011 at 7:35 pm)barboft Wrote: Aaah, I see. Atheism is not a belief system, worldview, philosophy, or religion. You prefer the handy word "presupposition". Gotcha. You simply "presuppose" that there's no god. Right. Thanks for clearing that one up. Cheers. Just like you presuppose that atheists lead immoral lives because they aren't Christian. (Yes, I can read between the lines.) 
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