God, Energy and Matter

[GrandizerII]

If someone hits me with a baseball bat, I don't need to look for scientific proof before I realize it.  You might tell me I could have imagined it, but that wouldn't change the fact that I got hit by a baseball bat.  Someone visiting from another country, who also got hit by a baseball bat, might think he got hit by some other kind of club, but he still got hit by a baseball bat.

If you want to have some other evidence before you would believe then go ahead and wait for it.  I've got no good reason to spend my life looking for other ways to prove it's real.

You got hit by a baseball bat. Remind me what the action of hitting entails again?

[LadyForCamus]

@Lek

How do you know that your experience was caused by a god?

[Deesse23]

If someone hits me with a baseball bat, I don't need to look for scientific proof before I realize it.  You might tell me I could have imagined it, but that wouldn't change the fact that I got hit by a baseball bat.  Someone visiting from another country, who also got hit by a baseball bat, might think he got hit by some other kind of club, but he still got hit by a baseball bat.

Noone is asking you to provide proof to you. We are asking you to provide proof to us. :
If you factually got hit by a baseball bat, then you should be factually able to show us. Do show us!
Now, you claim you have been hit by a baseball bat. That alone doesnt make it a fact. You are not entitled to proclaim facts to the rest of us. Just because you think you got hit by a baseball bat, doesnt make it a fact. If it was a fact, you should be able to show us, because facts.....you know, can be demonstrated to others.  Why should i believe you? Because you say so?

You can believe and claim you have been hit by a baseball bat until you are blue in the face. You can believe in baseball bats all day (and night) long. That doesnt make it a fact and we arent compelled to believe you.

If you want to have some other evidence before you would believe then go ahead and wait for it.  I've got no good reason to spend my life looking for other ways to prove it's real.

Other evidence? You havent provide any yet!
If your standard for believing things includes things you cant demonstrate to anybody outside of your own mind, be free to do so. I have a higher standard than that. You gave me no good reason to believe you got hit by a baseball bat, other than "you say so".

[Rahn127]

If someone hits me with a baseball bat, I don't need to look for scientific proof before I realize it.  You might tell me I could have imagined it, but that wouldn't change the fact that I got hit by a baseball bat.  Someone visiting from another country, who also got hit by a baseball bat, might think he got hit by some other kind of club, but he still got hit by a baseball bat.

If you want to have some other evidence before you would believe then go ahead and wait for it.  I've got no good reason to spend my life looking for other ways to prove it's real.

You are now talking about things that we can demonstrate exist and can perform actions.
People exist.
Baseball bats exist.
People can swing a bat and cause damage upon other people.
All of this can be taken into account when you make your claim that "someone hit you with a baseball bat."

But let's put this physical claim into proper context when it comes to your personal experience with what you claim about a god.

Let's look at this claim.
"An invisible, intangible thing punched me in the jaw."

1. You didn't see it happen.
2. It's intangible so you couldn't have felt it.
3. There is no damage to your jaw.
4. There is no evidence whatsoever that this happened.

As all magicians can tell you, people can be fooled and their senses are not always reliable.

Beyond the idea that you personally experienced something. Sure I can believe that you did. But that experience can happen all within your own mind.

I have experiences all within my own mind every night when I fall asleep. My brain can create some wonderful experiences that didn't actually happen in real life.

[polymath257]

If someone hits me with a baseball bat, I don't need to look for scientific proof before I realize it.  You might tell me I could have imagined it, but that wouldn't change the fact that I got hit by a baseball bat.  Someone visiting from another country, who also got hit by a baseball bat, might think he got hit by some other kind of club, but he still got hit by a baseball bat.

If you want to have some other evidence before you would believe then go ahead and wait for it.  I've got no good reason to spend my life looking for other ways to prove it's real.

But if you claimed an invisible gnome hit you on the head with his magic scimitar, we would be well justified in being skeptical of your claim.

Why? Well, there is no evidence that invisible gnomes exist and there is no evidence that magic scimitars exist. So, we may well ask for further evidence than your claim.

And even more, if we didn't find a gash in your head and you kept talking about invisible gnomes, we might well suspect you to be delusional.

That is what God claims look like to atheists: claims about invisible gnomes. The more you talk about them without some *other* evidence to show they even exist, the less we see you as a reasonable person.

[Lek]

Well, if that's the way you feel, okay.

[Anomalocaris]

If someone hits me with a baseball bat, I don't need to look for scientific proof before I realize it.  You might tell me I could have imagined it, but that wouldn't change the fact that I got hit by a baseball bat.  Someone visiting from another country, who also got hit by a baseball bat, might think he got hit by some other kind of club, but he still got hit by a baseball bat.

If you want to have some other evidence before you would believe then go ahead and wait for it.  I've got no good reason to spend my life looking for other ways to prove it's real.

Because you have no real sense of pride and dignity,  you neither can nor have the desire to strengthen yourself with intellectual rigor.   As a result you embrace delusional opportunism based on ignorant and moronic speculation of the basest and most worthless kind.

[polymath257]

Well, if that's the way you feel, okay.

Well, how would *you* argue against someone who claims to be in communication with invisible gnomes?

Wouldn't you ask for a bit of evidence that those gnomes actually exist?

Would you take the word of the person claiming such communication? or would you start to think they might be a bit off?

How would that change if a substantial part of the population believed in invisible gnomes?

And how is your position *any* different than the person claiming they talk to invisible gnomes?

[Deesse23]

But, but....hes not talking to Gnomes, he is talking to a GOD!

[Simon Moon]

If someone hits me with a baseball bat, I don't need to look for scientific proof before I realize it.  You might tell me I could have imagined it, but that wouldn't change the fact that I got hit by a baseball bat.  Someone visiting from another country, who also got hit by a baseball bat, might think he got hit by some other kind of club, but he still got hit by a baseball bat.

If you want to have some other evidence before you would believe then go ahead and wait for it.  I've got no good reason to spend my life looking for other ways to prove it's real.

Problem with this failed analogy, is if you were hit by a baseball bat, you would be able to provide evidence, that ANYONE could see. Bruises, broken bones, swelling, etc. Possibly even x-ray evidence. Maybe the bat itself with your blood on it and the fingerprints of the person you claim swung the bat.

But you're not claiming to to have been hit by a physical bat, swung by an actual human, leaving you with demonstrable injuries. You are claiming to have been hit by a magical staff, swung by a wizard, that left no demonstrable evidence, and only your "feelings" that this even took place.

So, show us evidence you have been hit by a bat...