[Serious] Time to embrace Islam!

[R00tKiT]

You're rejecting these religions because they conflict with Islam.  You really don't see the problem there, do you?  Furthermore, why did you restrict your inquiry to just the Abrahamic faiths?  Maybe the Maori have got it right.  Or the Zulus.  Or the Inuit.

Do we need more than the three in one contradiction to rule out Christianity altogether ? Heaven and hell are almost absent in the Jewish literature, which means that the problem of evil is  impossible to solve. Do we really need more than these simple facts to start dismissing these religions outright ?

I reject Christianity because I can't wrap my head around a god who dies for my sins.

By the way, Islam is the fastest growing religion among the Maori people.

And one more point, Christian/Jewish or even nonreligious people who were serious and perfectly impartial about figuring out which religion is right and died before that are not punished according to the Islamic point of view of the afterlife.

No, it's precisely the question.  The explanation as to how things go (and, to a lesser extent, why they go) is learnt through observation.  You and other religionists are not interested in the facts, you're interested in interpreting the world in a way that supports a particular belief.

I already gave the very simple example of Jim opening the damn door. Even if you understand perfectly how the door handle works at the quantum level, this tells you nothing about Jim. Similarly, even if we have absolutely complete perfect science about how the universe works, we'll have no idea about why is it there in the first place.

---

Which is further indication thst it doesn’t exist.

Or indication that you don't want it to exist ?

You still didn't answer my question, what are the traits of the deity you'd worship ?

[Peebothuhlu]

At work.

Similarly, even if we have absolutely complete perfect science about how the universe works, we'll have no idea about why is it there in the first place.

Uhm.... that doesn't necessarily follow, y'know?

So..... how does the Quran and its creator solve the problem of 'Evil', as they see it?

Cheers.

[no one]

My make-believe is so much better than your make-believe!
True story!

[The Valkyrie]

You're rejecting these religions because they conflict with Islam.  You really don't see the problem there, do you?  Furthermore, why did you restrict your inquiry to just the Abrahamic faiths?  Maybe the Maori have got it right.  Or the Zulus.  Or the Inuit.

Do we need more than the three in one contradiction to rule out Christianity altogether ? Heaven and hell are almost absent in the Jewish literature, which means that the problem of evil is  impossible to solve. Do we really need more than these simple facts to start dismissing these religions outright ?

I reject Christianity because I can't wrap my head around a god who dies for my sins.

By the way, Islam is the fastest growing religion among the Maori people.

And one more point, Christian/Jewish or even nonreligious people who were serious and perfectly impartial about figuring out which religion is right and died before that are not punished according to the Islamic point of view of the afterlife.

No, it's precisely the question.  The explanation as to how things go (and, to a lesser extent, why they go) is learnt through observation.  You and other religionists are not interested in the facts, you're interested in interpreting the world in a way that supports a particular belief.

I already gave the very simple example of Jim opening the damn door. Even if you understand perfectly how the door handle works at the quantum level, this tells you nothing about Jim. Similarly, even if we have absolutely complete perfect science about how the universe works, we'll have no idea about why is it there in the first place.

---

Which is further indication thst it doesn’t exist.

Or indication that you don't want it to exist ?

You still didn't answer my question, what are the traits of the deity you'd worship ?

I don’t care if it exists. I have yet to see any evidence for it’s existence. And a loving deity wouldn’t allow some of the crap that’s done in its name.

Also, Hinduism is the fastest growing religion in NZ, so that must be the right religion.

And you still haven’t andwered MY questions from several pages back: what benefits are there for me, as a female, to accepting your religion, where modt of my gender are treated as property or not as valuable as a male?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

How's the conversions coming along?

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

I reject Christianity because I can't wrap my head around a god who dies for my sins.

And yet you can get your noggin round Allah, who is both merciful and just (two mutually contradictory attributes).

Boru

[R00tKiT]

I don’t care if it exists.  I have yet to see any evidence for it’s existence.  And a loving deity wouldn’t allow some of the crap that’s done in its name.

I explained in the original post that that the 'all-loving' trait is precisely where the other Abrahamic religions get it wrong. A perfect God who doesn't love sinners is more sensible than a deity who pretends to love them and then punish them for eternity. It's completely hopeless to reconcile an all-loving deity with the existence of eternal damnation, and that's one more evidence that the core beliefs of christianity were largely altered.

Islam is the only major religion today who endorses monotheism. It's possible to rule out any other religion that doesn't by appealing to simple logical arguments : If more than one god exists, then they are restricted by one another's will, and therefore none of them are gods.

Therefore, Islam should seem to be a promising candidate, we should then investigate the whereabouts of their prophet and in which circumstances the holy book came into being. It does take effort to reach a reasoned conclusion, but it's worth it.

Speaking of benefits, you don't endorse a religion because you expect some immediate gratification afterwards. Muslims face prosecution all around the world because of their belief. One would endorse Islam because he's conviced it's the truth, and it's okay (even from a strictly islamic point of view) not to endorse it if evidence is not convincing enough, but everyone should make an effort.

And who said women are treated as property in Islam?

[Nay_Sayer]

I don’t care if it exists.  I have yet to see any evidence for it’s existence.  And a loving deity wouldn’t allow some of the crap that’s done in its name.

I explained in the original post that that the 'all-loving' trait is precisely where the other Abrahamic religions get it wrong. A perfect God who doesn't love sinners is more sensible than a deity who pretends to love them and then punish them for eternity. It's completely hopeless to reconcile an all-loving deity with the existence of eternal damnation, and that's one more evidence that the core beliefs of christianity were largely altered.

Islam is the only major religion today who endorses monotheism. It's possible to rule out any other religion that doesn't by appealing to simple logical arguments : If more than one god exists, then they are restricted by one another's will, and therefore none of them are gods.

Therefore, Islam should seem to be a promising candidate, we should then investigate the whereabouts of their prophet and in which circumstances the holy book came into being. It does take effort to reach a reasoned conclusion, but it's worth it.

Speaking of benefits, you don't endorse a religion because you expect some immediate gratification afterwards. Muslims face prosecution all around the world because of their belief. One would endorse Islam because he's conviced it's the truth, and it's okay (even from a strictly islamic point of view) not to endorse it if evidence is not convincing enough, but everyone should make an effort.

And who said women are treated as property in Islam?

Islam did.

Now for my query, Why have you not accepted FSM into your heart?

[The Valkyrie]

I explained in the original post that that the 'all-loving' trait is precisely where the other Abrahamic religions get it wrong. A perfect God who doesn't love sinners is more sensible than a deity who pretends to love them and then punish them for eternity. It's completely hopeless to reconcile an all-loving deity with the existence of eternal damnation, and that's one more evidence that the core beliefs of christianity were largely altered.

Islam is the only major religion today who endorses monotheism. It's possible to rule out any other religion that doesn't by appealing to simple logical arguments : If more than one god exists, then they are restricted by one another's will, and therefore none of them are gods.

Therefore, Islam should seem to be a promising candidate, we should then investigate the whereabouts of their prophet and in which circumstances the holy book came into being. It does take effort to reach a reasoned conclusion, but it's worth it.

Speaking of benefits, you don't endorse a religion because you expect some immediate gratification afterwards. Muslims face prosecution all around the world because of their belief. One would endorse Islam because he's conviced it's the truth, and it's okay (even from a strictly islamic point of view) not to endorse it if evidence is not convincing enough, but everyone should make an effort.

And who said women are treated as property in Islam?

Islam did.

Now for my query, Why have you not accepted FSM into your heart?

Yup.

Also went with the “poor us” comment.

Did you notice?

Oh, and the main trait I’d look for in a deity: existence.

[R00tKiT]

Uhm.... that doesn't necessarily follow, y'know?

So..... how does the Quran and its creator solve the problem of 'Evil', as they see it?

Cheers.

I think it does follow. All we do in science is to explain (or explain better) phenomena which isn't explained already. Let's suppose we reached the stage where there's no corner in the universe left to investigate. Can we then tell anything why is it there in the first place?

All the established scientific theories we know so far have no ontological value everyone can relate to. General relativity has zero value to the layman. We didn't make any progress answering this kind of questions ever. Isn't it curious that the most pressing existential questions are exactly the ones unanswered by science?

Why can't the answers be the ones the old holy books? These books were almost always reachable to everyone, so god's way of sending his message isn't as bad as atheists claim.

If a just God exists, the answers should be already there. Here's how : a just God would make his message accessible to anyone at any time. It's perfectly unfair of God to reveal the true purpose in the universe in 2050, because then people who died before desperately looking for answers literally had no way of reaching the truth.