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[Serious] What God's justification for eternal torment?
RE: What God's justification for eternal torment?
(August 27, 2020 at 3:52 pm)Smaug Wrote:
(August 25, 2020 at 11:16 am)Mister Agenda Wrote: I remember when an Orthodox Christian friend of mine was going on about the baroque elegance of geocentric calculations and how simplicity doesn't mean correct. I was like, 'but gravity!'.

Did he mean the epicycles? I wonder where he found actual calculations for those... those aren't things you just casually google search, I guess. I mean the actual numerical tables or calculations, not the general explanations. This seems to be the stuff you can only find in specialized history books at best.

He did mean the epicycles, but I doubt he studied them personally. He was a religious studies major, not an astronomy major.
I'm not anti-Christian. I'm anti-stupid.
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RE: What God's justification for eternal torment?
If we were created by god, than there's only one thing that is undeniable. Among all the millions of species that have ever lived during the millions of years that life has existed on the planet, we're the only ones that can reason with logic. In short, what makes us special is that we're uniquely super intelligent. 

So, if there's god, we were made to think. That's ALL we can know for sure. Fine. So what do all religions tell you to do - stop thinking logically and take it on faith. WTF?

Lets apply some rational thought to eternal torment and see where we get.   God is all powerful. Fair enough. God makes us. Cool.  God makes us inherently sinful. Doesn't matter how hard you try, you're goin' stuff up. Right. So that means God is either, very cruel or majorly inept. 

Either way, the outcome is the same - we were created sick and yet commanded to be well.  Oh and here's the kicker. If we can't manage to achieve what the creator couldn't do or didn't want to do, we get punished for eternity. 

Good luck finding a justification for that one!  The design of your average prostate is more logical and those things are a mess!
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RE: What God's justification for eternal torment?
(September 9, 2020 at 12:10 pm)Angrboda Wrote: Hey!  I know that slime trail!

 you a Tom Hiddleston fan or just like making me look up crappy screen names and try and see if i can figure out how they apply to you?
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RE: What God's justification for eternal torment?
Moderator Notice
Angrboda and Drich have been thread banned for the use of insulting language.

Boru
‘But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods or no gods. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.’ - Thomas Jefferson
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RE: What God's justification for eternal torment?
(September 10, 2020 at 9:52 am)Mister Agenda Wrote:
(August 27, 2020 at 3:52 pm)Smaug Wrote: Did he mean the epicycles? I wonder where he found actual calculations for those... those aren't things you just casually google search, I guess. I mean the actual numerical tables or calculations, not the general explanations. This seems to be the stuff you can only find in specialized history books at best.

He did mean the epicycles, but I doubt he studied them personally. He was a religious studies major, not an astronomy major.

That shows. I like how flat-earthers, free energy folk and such are completely clueless about the actual math behind things they claim.
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RE: What God's justification for eternal torment?
(August 14, 2020 at 5:39 pm)onlinebiker Wrote: Consider "heaven".

You are going to be stuck - forever - with a narcisistic murdering rapist who thinks that anyone who opposes him about ANYTHING deserves and will recieve eternal torture.......

....

You gotta be one seriously damaged individual to think that's a sweet deal.....

whoa he is NOT a murderer.  That is the unlawful killing of one man by another.  He gave life in the first place, so it is his to take away.

Not saying I agree with the other adjectives.
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RE: What God's justification for eternal torment?
Quote:whoa he is NOT a murderer.  

Yes he is a murderer 


Quote:That is the unlawful killing of one man by another.  

Nope you can lawfully murder someone 


Quote:He gave life in the first place, so it is his to take away.
Non Sequitur  being the one who gave someone life does not grant them the right to take it away  


Quote:Not saying I agree with the other adjectives.
Then you are in error
"Change was inevitable"


Nemo sicut deus debet esse!

[Image: Canada_Flag.jpg?v=1646203843]



 “No matter what men think, abortion is a fact of life. Women have always had them; they always have and they always will. Are they going to have good ones or bad ones? Will the good ones be reserved for the rich, while the poor women go to quacks?”
–SHIRLEY CHISHOLM


      
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RE: What God's justification for eternal torment?
What an abhorrent and disgusting view of life.

EDIT: @runewell
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself — and you are the easiest person to fool." - Richard P. Feynman
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RE: What God's justification for eternal torment?
(October 7, 2020 at 6:22 pm)SUNGULA Wrote:
Quote:whoa he is NOT a murderer.  

Yes he is a murderer 


Quote:That is the unlawful killing of one man by another.  

Nope you can lawfully murder someone 


Quote:He gave life in the first place, so it is his to take away.
Non Sequitur  being the one who gave someone life does not grant them the right to take it away  


Quote:Not saying I agree with the other adjectives.
Then you are in error

How do you lawfully murder someone, if murder is unlawful killing?  How do you lawfully unlawfully kill someone?  That's a contradication.

As for the non-sequitur, how does it not follow that if God can give life, he can take it away?  I wasn't referring to humans there.

And finally you call me in error for not expressing an opinion about the other adjectives??

Huh

(September 11, 2020 at 6:47 pm)god bother Wrote: If we were created by god, than there's only one thing that is undeniable. Among all the millions of species that have ever lived during the millions of years that life has existed on the planet, we're the only ones that can reason with logic. In short, what makes us special is that we're uniquely super intelligent. 

So, if there's god, we were made to think. That's ALL we can know for sure. Fine. So what do all religions tell you to do - stop thinking logically and take it on faith. WTF?

Lets apply some rational thought to eternal torment and see where we get.   God is all powerful. Fair enough. God makes us. Cool.  God makes us inherently sinful. Doesn't matter how hard you try, you're goin' stuff up. Right. So that means God is either, very cruel or majorly inept. 

Either way, the outcome is the same - we were created sick and yet commanded to be well.  Oh and here's the kicker. If we can't manage to achieve what the creator couldn't do or didn't want to do, we get punished for eternity. 

Good luck finding a justification for that one!  The design of your average prostate is more logical and those things are a mess!

No, God didn't make us sinful, creation was good, and man was very good.  It was man that chose to sin, and passed that on to his offspring - don't blame your problems on God.
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RE: What God's justification for eternal torment?
Quote:How do you lawfully murder someone, if murder is unlawful killing?  How do you lawfully unlawfully kill someone?  That's a contradiction.
Because isn't defined by it's lawfulness . Thus it's not a contradiction to say murder can be lawful. Murder is a malicious and unjustifiable act against an undeserving person and indeed authorities can and do commit such acts . 


Quote:As for the non-sequitur, how does it not follow that if God can give life, he can take it away?  I wasn't referring to humans there.
It doesn't matter what your referring to . It does not follow that if something gives life it can take it away 


Quote:And finally you call me in error for not expressing an opinion about the other adjectives??
I imagine you object to those  adjectives. If so you are in error because they all fit .

Quote:No, God didn't make us sinful, creation was good, and man was very good.  It was man that chose to sin, and passed that on to his offspring - don't blame your problems on God.
If god creates it . He bears all the blame for it's current state regardless of any other decision made by any other being . In fact even creating being with choice is blameworthy , And the fact man had the option of sin when no such option was necessary even for free will is blameworthy
"Change was inevitable"


Nemo sicut deus debet esse!

[Image: Canada_Flag.jpg?v=1646203843]



 “No matter what men think, abortion is a fact of life. Women have always had them; they always have and they always will. Are they going to have good ones or bad ones? Will the good ones be reserved for the rich, while the poor women go to quacks?”
–SHIRLEY CHISHOLM


      
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